Has anyone paired a svs pci with a pc plus?

Discussion in 'Speakers & Subwoofers' started by Sheldon C, Oct 14, 2003.

  1. Sheldon C

    Sheldon C Second Unit

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    I haven't read a post where someone has done this, so I'm wondering how it would work. I currently have a pci 20-39 in a 18x23x8 room with no openings. I love the bass I am getting, but after a year of getting used to it I want more.

    I want to buy a sub that will satisfy me without ever wanting for more bass and I want to spend less than 1000 dollars (the less spent the better however). I thought about just pairing my sub with another pci, but like I said I never want to upgrade again and what if that's not enough?

    I am thinking that if I get a plus than I could make sure that the subs weren't cancelling each other since the plus has the variable phase and it's also tempting because of the better woofer.

    So, would it be ok to have the two different subs running together?

    How much db gain would I get if I get a plus?

    (it's gonna be awhile, I still need to buy a center and rears to match my new axiom m60's but I can't help thinking down the road).
     
  2. ScottCarr

    ScottCarr Second Unit

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    If you have the room you might want to consider the PB2isd. that way you can keep all the drivers the same and increase max spl
     
  3. Sheldon C

    Sheldon C Second Unit

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    hmmm not a bad idea, however I don't know if I would like how a box sub and a cylinder sub look together...

    so you think there would be problems using two different woofers?
     
  4. Richard_B

    Richard_B Stunt Coordinator

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    What about selling your pci and getting a PB2+?
     
  5. RichardH

    RichardH Supporting Actor

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    I recommend either:

    1. get another identical sub (20-39 PCI)

    2. sell it and get a PB2+ as Richard_B has already suggested.

    BTW, you must really like bass [​IMG]
     
  6. Sheldon C

    Sheldon C Second Unit

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    Yeah, it's funny how for about a year I couldn't imagine wanting to upgrade my sub...

    But then after spending too much time on this forum I started to wonder what hitting 115 db would sound/feel like.[​IMG]
     
  7. Richard_B

    Richard_B Stunt Coordinator

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    Sheldon,
    I just got my 25-31pc+ last night and that thing rocks. I don't know how the regular PCi line compares but I have to imagine they are close. I think you're crazy to be looking for more bass [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]

    If you have space for 2 identical cylinders go for the stereo sub setup. That Pb2+ is a monster though and might be just what you are looking for. Same goes for the PB2isd.
     
  8. Sheldon C

    Sheldon C Second Unit

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    I think what really got me was hearing my friends pci 16-46 in a smaller room with wood floors. Man the bass absolutely ripped through my body! I don't get the same effect in my larger room with concrete carpeted floors.

    Richard, how large is your room and what type of floor do you have?
     
  9. Richard_B

    Richard_B Stunt Coordinator

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    Sheldon,

    The room size is 15'x 14' but is open on one side going into the hallway and dining area. There is a 4 ft wall there that seperates the room but it is mostly open. SVS recommended I go with the pc+ if I wanted it loud due to the room size/open area. They also said either way pci or pc+ the room could accomodate either of the two subs. I went with the plus cause they said louder (when the wife is gone it gets LOUD[​IMG]). The floor is full carpet (cut pile burber) with cement foundation.
     
  10. Derrik Draven

    Derrik Draven Supporting Actor

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    Sheldon - I'm in the damn near the exact same boat as you.

    I did; however, purchase a 16-46pc+ 2 days ago to go with my 16-46pci.

    A few people here, in the past, stated that it might not be a good idea since you might get some soundwave cancelling due to the differences in the subs BUT...Tom (subhuman) V. himself said that it will work just fine. [​IMG] I'm taking his word for it since it's pretty safe bet if he says so.

    My room is 12 X 33 and the floor is carpeted over concrete. I lost a HUGE amount of bass response when I moved all my stuff from the MUCH smaller room upstairs. It was about 15 X 15 and, wooden floors.

    Got spoiled by the ridiculous amount of bass response. Nothing like playin Halo, and when the covenant dropships come down on you, your floor starts shaking!!!! [​IMG] [​IMG]

    Nothing like that in this ht room. Was pretty damn bummed after working on this room for about 2 years, finally setting up my ht, and losing all that bass. [​IMG]

    Didn't even dawn on me that I'd lose that much until after I set everything up.

    After I get these 2 subs up and running after calibration, I'll post my results here.

    If they're still not pumping out what I want, I'm just going to have to live with it for awhile. I'm not dropping into credit card hell. [​IMG]
     
  11. Sheldon C

    Sheldon C Second Unit

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    Cool, hopefully you will be happy with the 2 16-46's, I'm looking forward to hearing your impressions.
     
  12. Frank Carter

    Frank Carter Screenwriter

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    Here's one thing that comes to my mind when mixing subs from various levels. When your 20-39PCi has reached it's limits, a Plus sub can keep on going. If you bottom out the PCi, you're obviously not going to turn it up more even though the Plus sub can keep on truckin', you might end up holding the Plus sub back.
     
  13. Reginald Trent

    Reginald Trent Screenwriter

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    I think you should consider a 16-46 pci over another 20-39 pci because it plays lower than your current sub.The PB2isd or PB2 plus are alos good choices if you don't mind goning to the box look.
     
  14. steve nn

    steve nn Cinematographer

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    When you calibrate dual subs your SW setting on your receiver will be much lower and the gain setting on the back of your plate amp will most likely be lower also to achieve calibration. In doing so this will give you added headroom and make it much harder to bottom out one of your subs. The PCI would bottom first and there are different ways of calibrating to compensate for this.

    You could go with a 20-39+ and get a automatic +6db boost/headroom and generally speaking this would work out just fine. It is not optimal (another 20-39 would be) but still a good option. You would get your 6db bump with the 20-39 pc also.

    If you cared to sell your pc and go with another offering from SVS, that would keep you with-in your stated limit and you would definitely be good to go with the PB2+ or the new PB2-ISD I would think?

    I paired a AV15 up with dual 25-31cs+'s for a few months and it worked out very well, much better than what I thought it would. If I put the port blockers in the 25-31cs+'s? (A common practic with me now) I bet I would have been hard pressed to be critical of it?? In the end I decided to go with a third 25-31cs+ to be sure all was good with my bass and space limitations coupled with WAF.

    20 [​IMG]
     
  15. Sheldon C

    Sheldon C Second Unit

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    Ok, so I get a boost of 6 db when I add another sub be it a plus or a pci. So what if when I calibrate I do it one sub at at time. What if I set the pci to 8db below the other speakers and then set the plus sub to 4db below the other speakers. So on average they are 6db below if they are not on at the same time, but if I turn them both on I would get that 6db gain right? Wouldn't that give me a correct calibration and allow the plus to work harder?

    In reality I would probably set the subs hotter than that, but I am just wondering if my theory will work.

    The reason why I am leaning towards a cylinder is because I actually prefer the way they look (I think I'm in the minority).
     
  16. steve nn

    steve nn Cinematographer

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    You might be in the minority but then I guess I might be also. The cylinders have their benefits.

    Your stated method of calibration is one option that comes to mind. Another would be to reduce your gain on your plates with your SW setting on your receiver set to the middle value and calibrate both at the same time a db or so over your intended calibration. Then bring them down with your receiver gain. ether way your going to notice a big difference in headroom and most likely will not need to worry about bottoming your pc with running dual. Dual changes your options drastically for the better imo and purifies your bass. I like to let my subs just glide along and be nice to them instead of asking to much/more from one.[​IMG]
     
  17. Robb Roy

    Robb Roy Supporting Actor

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    Sheldon,

    I've never actually calibrated a dual sub setup, so I'm just thinking out lout here. I would think that even if you calibrated one hotter to achieve an average, that would only work at reference, and that at any volume below that would cause your bass to seem quieter.

    You say you love the sound of your bass, but you just want more. It is true that your PCi would bottom sooner than a PC+, but if you're not bottoming it now, you're certainly not likely to bottom it just because you added another, more powerful, subwoofer.

    -Robb
     
  18. Sheldon C

    Sheldon C Second Unit

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    Thanks for the advice Steve and Robb. While it's true I haven't bottomed out my pci, I have pushed it to its limits and here's what I mean by that.

    When watching a very bass heavy scene (like inro to toy story 2) I can get db levels around 107 to 108 on my meter (uncorrected). However, when I turn up the sub volume using the receivers volume control or just turning up the master volume control on the receiver and try the same scene again, the meter doesn't read any louder. I haven't tried turning up the sub's amp volume but I'm willing to bet that I still wouldn't get any more bass. (btw, the subs amp volume is set exactly half way).
     
  19. steve nn

    steve nn Cinematographer

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    When I hit that point of no response in my setup that means bottoming is close at hand. Another db or two and ksksksks! We're talking 123 dbs uncorrected though and just way out of line. If you pick up another sub and calibrate accordingly I bet you would not give up what a dual SVS configuration brings to your HT? 6 dbs is a whole lot of bass/headroom. You could use some of that 6 dbs for both.

    Both methods of calibration will work but I use the all at the same time approach now. If you try the first method you will see that when powering one off there is the loss that you would expect at any volume. I guess if you went the Plus rout you would be able to sell the pc and go with another Plus down the road if you still felt the need wich of course would be optimal. You might not even notice a difference though (2 +'s) with your expected headroom.
     
  20. Derrik Draven

    Derrik Draven Supporting Actor

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    Steve - do you have all your subs in 1 corner? I know that that's supposed to be optimal but, most of us don't have rooms that are so flexible.

    My current setup does NOT allow any more room that what I have and, that means one svs in this corner, one in that.

    I'm guessing that the plus will be here Monday since I don't live all that far from SVS. My setup across the front soundstage will look like this:

    SVS / BP2000tl/ TV / BP2000tl / SVS

    I can't put 2 subs in either corner due to the fact that they will be blocking the 15" side drivers in the Def Tech towers. 1 sub can be set back far enough to let the towers breath.
     

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