Guitar players. Pedals/effects processors?

Discussion in 'After Hours Lounge (Off Topic)' started by Philip_T, Apr 23, 2004.

  1. Philip_T

    Philip_T Supporting Actor

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2002
    Messages:
    876
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Was thinking about getting a new effects processor for my electric guitar and wanted to get some input from you guys on your gear. I currently have the Digitech GSP-21 and its ok, but sometimes I feel that the menu is clunky and Ive yet to achieve a great distortion patch. I was looking into the newer Digitech models like the RP300 as they seam to be easier to program and it looks like you can actually download patches now and also get specific settings from guitar magazines for their featured songs. This ease of use sounds appealing and might get me back into playing more. What type of effects processors do you guys recommend under the $200-$300 range? Also, has anyone ever heard of the old Rat distortion pedals? A friend of mine used to have one back in the late 80's and I seam to remember it having a good distortion sound, but its been a long time.
     
  2. JonZ

    JonZ Lead Actor

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 1998
    Messages:
    7,798
    Likes Received:
    11
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I prefer the seperate box pedals to the combination FX boxes.

    The only pedals I ever used was the Boss DS1 Distortion and the GE7 EQ(set in a V configuration for best sound)

    Both were great and I got a excellent heavy guitar sound with my USA BC Rich Warlock (Duncan Pickups)and Gibson Explorers(Duncan and Gibson Sticky Finger Pickups).

    What kind of sound are you looking for?FOr what type of music?What equiptment do u have now?

    Equiptment AND pickups will affect ur sound.Everyone nowadays used the EMGs. They have a dry sterile sound I fukin hate.

    I love Duncans and Marshall or the older Gallien Krueger amps.

    While I was always curious to try other pedals I always stuck with Boss, beucase Im poor and theyre reliable. Comparing the Boss to the combination pedals my brother and friend have, I like the "truer" sound of the Boss pedals more.

    But that only IMHO.
     
  3. Chazz_S

    Chazz_S Supporting Actor

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2002
    Messages:
    501
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I had a Rat 2 modded by Keeley. Pretty nice pedal, but I eventually sold it.

    Now I'm just using a Boss OS-2, and Tubescreamer for dirt.
     
  4. Jeff Ulmer

    Jeff Ulmer Producer

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 1998
    Messages:
    5,584
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    What type of sound are you after? Outside of specific effects (chorus, flanging, delay) I am not a big fan of pedals. What are you using as an amp? My preference for distorted guitar is old Marshalls (loud!), hot pickups (I use DiMarzio X2Ns or Super Distortions on modded guitars) with something on the front end to boost the input signal. Most processed distortion sounds muddy, overly compressed and fizzy to me, and lacks the tight crunch I'm looking for.
     
  5. Philip_T

    Philip_T Supporting Actor

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2002
    Messages:
    876
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Jeff, not using an amp right now, just headphones through the gsp-21, but when I do get one, it will probably be a cheap Crate or Peavy, nothing too special as I cant justify spending too much. The guitar is an Ibanez RG-320 which I love. As far as the sound goes, I would like the distortion be able to get as smooth as Eddie Van Halens 'brown' sound, to a little more raunchy, say like Zach Wylde with Ozzy possibly? I dont know for sure, but I do know that I cant stand most of the presets on my gsp21 and my attempts to create new ones usually end up with only moderately decent distortion. Good cleans are a must as well be it warm and full, or cold and thin. Thanks for the input so far guys. [​IMG]
     
  6. Jeff Ulmer

    Jeff Ulmer Producer

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 1998
    Messages:
    5,584
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Okay, I see where you are coming from, unfortunately you are going to have a very hard time getting what you want from an inexpensive box and no amp. If it were that easy everyone would be doing it. Great guitar sounds are almost always real amps, with the combination of pickup, preamp and output tubes, plus the speakers themselves responsible for great tone.

    However, my advice would be to ditch the Digitech and get yourself a Line 6 POD. The sounds are decent, there is ample room for modifying, and it is about as good as you are going to get without a real amp setup. There are plenty of amp models to choose from, and it has built in effects for both clean and dirty patches.

    Also realise that what makes a great distorted guitar sound does not equal a great clean sound. For distortion, you want high output pickups, not too heavy on the highs, with a mid/lower frequency range emphasis. Clean sounds are best achieved with single coil pickups, not humbuckers, and their tonal coverage is almost the opposite. Their output is also considerably lower.

    How is the switch on your guitar configured? Is it a five way or three way?
     
  7. Vince Maskeeper

    Vince Maskeeper Producer

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 1999
    Messages:
    6,499
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I am the first one to say modeling and emulation sucks, but given your configuration, and the fact that you're a hobbiest- some of the cabinet/amp emulators are fun TOYS (let me stress, toys, I would never suggest they are a replacement, or hell even a comparison to the real thing).

    Line 6 stuff is all the rage, but I find the Behringer V-amp to be a great little demo tool for like $150!

    If you're getting an amp for a good distortion sound- get a Mesa or a Marshall (or the marshall sounding ones like Orange, Sovtek, etc)--- if you're not- look into a digital emulator- but know that nothing NOTHING beats the real thing!

    -V
     
  8. Philip_T

    Philip_T Supporting Actor

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2002
    Messages:
    876
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Well, after doing some further thinking, I suppose an amp wouldn't be out of the question. I might be able to get one of these used for under $200 today. I see where they retail for over $500 new. But it would be a blind purchase without having heard it 1st. Descisions.

    BTW, its a 5-way switch Jeff.
     
  9. Jeff Ulmer

    Jeff Ulmer Producer

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 1998
    Messages:
    5,584
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I would disagree with Vince to an extent. Modelling has its uses, and has come a LONG way over the years, and some of it sounds pretty good in certain situations. There are plenty of useable sounds in a POD, even at a pro level. It all depends on your taste and how fussy you are. I'm fussy, which is why I use a collection of amps and guitars for my work, but they aren't jack of all trades, even my prized 1972 JPM50 only does one thing really well. If that's what I want, there is nothing better.

    Don't be mislead by name brands, not all amps are the same. I would avoid the newer Marshalls. They changed the way they derive their distortion to clipping diodes, which to me sounds horrid. I find them muddy, spongy, and overly fizzy when driven hard. For the money, a POD will give you more diversity, and even if you decide to buy an amp later, you will still have a good selection of sounds available. You can hook up the POD to your stereo or a PA amp. They are not meant to amplified by guitar amps.

    As for Behringer, I have a problem with these guys on a moral basis, since nearly everything they build is ripped off from someone else. It's easy to lower your price when you rely on some other company to do all the R&D and you just clone their products.

    The 5 way will get you better options on your clean sounds.
     
  10. Philip_T

    Philip_T Supporting Actor

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2002
    Messages:
    876
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Well, thats good to know and makes me feel better, cuz I just lost the bid for the one I was looking at. Must be a sign.

    While I see your point on Berhinger Jeff, I will have to check them out at least to see what their all about. Ive never heard of them before and from Vince said, sounds like a nice price. Also looking at the Pods. I need to stop my local ProSound and see if they have one to demo.
     
  11. Zen Butler

    Zen Butler Producer

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2002
    Messages:
    5,540
    Likes Received:
    19
    Trophy Points:
    5,610
    Location:
    Southern, Ca
    Real Name:
    Zen K. Butler
    Depends on what you play. I like the old school analog effect sound. The Korg Toneworks AX serious is a cool/cheap multi-effect processor. Sounds are more vintage slapback, phasers, flangers, rotovibe. I don't like the distortions or amp modeling and opt for the distortion on my amps mostly. Add a Vox wah and Danelectro Backtalk and other goodies.

    You can emulate sounds from Airplane to Pearl Jam to John Frusciante but...
    If your into a modern processed sound, disregard my post.
     
  12. Jeff Ulmer

    Jeff Ulmer Producer

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 1998
    Messages:
    5,584
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    You can get a POD on ebay for about the same price as the Behringers.
     
  13. Vince Maskeeper

    Vince Maskeeper Producer

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 1999
    Messages:
    6,499
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0


    You can get a USED pod from one of the PREVIOUS product lines for about the same prices as a NEW and CURRENT v-amp.

    The V-amp "pro" (the rackmount studio model) is about $275 at guitar center-- the Podxt Pro (which the V-amp Pro would be considered to be a copy of) is $700 at guitar center. And if you're a computer geek, the V-amp has some nice software which gives you easy access to modifying the models and creating your own unique parameters.

    If you don't need the crazy rack mount with all the studio features, the V-amp 2 model is $175 at guitar center - the version of the pod which the V-amp 2 is a knock off of (the Podxt) is $400.

    -V

    PS: I want to stress, I come at this NOT from a guitar player POV, as I am a HACK at best... I come at it as a studio engineer and producer with a LOT of experience with vintage and not-so-vintage amplifiers as well as the whole spectrum of digital gadgetry... I am most concerned with how they sound-- so my suggestion might not be a good reflection on usability or other issues...
     
  14. Jeff Ulmer

    Jeff Ulmer Producer

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 1998
    Messages:
    5,584
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0

    Do you mind if I steal your salary? I could afford a lot more paintbrushes.
     
  15. Vince Maskeeper

    Vince Maskeeper Producer

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 1999
    Messages:
    6,499
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0


    Sure, drop me an email.

    I make at least 3-4 albums per year, every year, being paid only in meals (despite fetching day rates as high as $400 on many other sessions)- because I believe very strongly in music as an artistic expression-- i voluntarily give up my salary, often, for the betterment of making good records and letting kids express themselves with as best tools as are available. Some of these projects have gone on to turn a profit for the band involved, and I have never come back to collect for my time and effort.

    Even when i am paid for my time as an engineer- it is based entirely on a sliding scale system of what a band can afford... Fot those who are fortunate enough to be driven to create "commercial" material - they can usually afford a bit more-- but I always take cut rate prices for those who have chosen to go a more non-conventional route and have little chance for commercial success. Despite living in a capitalist society- the rules of art should never be ruled entirely by supply/demand...

    I have spent 2 years establishing a non-profit organization and endowment foundation dedicated to a "community studio" project-- specifically to allow a recording environment for material with limited commercial potential (and provide a FREE learning environment that sees recording as an artform more than a vocation)... if the project manages to get anough funding to go live- I will be the only board member who does not receive a salary for my work.

    I spend hundreds of hours per year working on my website (musicianassist.com) who's sole purpose is getting information to those people making music -- my mission being to help them better create, perform and promote their craft and art. People steal my work all the time, and I have never made a peep. If it gets the info out to more people, it's worth it-- I'm not here for the credit...

    I have spoken at confrences for musicians, and have never requested anything beyond travel expenses (which I often also turn down for anything this side of the mississippi).

    I have allowed dozens of articles I've written reprinted widely on the net and in industry publications without collecting a red cent (not to mention the dozens of reprints I never approved, and have never minded for a moment).

    If you wanna preach about putting my money where my mouth is my brother, best look at the next guy, cause I been giving up my paycheck for the improvement of music as an artform for a long, long time.

    Sorry to hijack... back to regularly scheduled programming
     
  16. Tim Hoover

    Tim Hoover Screenwriter

    Joined:
    May 27, 2001
    Messages:
    1,422
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Back to the original topic...

    Philip, have you considered going the used route for gear? I have an old Digitech 2101 that I picked up a few years back for $250 that I absolutely love. It's extremely (almost intimidatingly) flexible as far as programming goes, and with the right preamp tubes, can sound pretty damn convincing...

    I will forewarn you that my taste runs to the funkier and trashier side of effects, though. Zen mentioned the Dano Backtalk, which is a reverse delay that I love. Electro-Harmonix also gives me the giggles on a daily basis with their offerings...
     

Share This Page