Glass tube hdtv vs. projection hdtv's. Is their a quality difference?

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by Todd smith, Apr 21, 2002.

  1. Todd smith

    Todd smith Supporting Actor

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    Just wondering If there is a quality diference between these two? Does the glass hdtv have a better picture when viewed from angles? If so, how much better? Which is the best way to go?
     
  2. Allan Jayne

    Allan Jayne Cinematographer

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    It is a matter of size.
    Direct view doesn't come bigger than 40 inches, and even 38 inch sets are not that common.
    Rear projection is not very sharp under 36 inches because of the rib pitch of the lenticular front panel of the screen. The graininess is similar to dot pitch of direct view sets. (Actually very few RPTVs less than 36 inches are made.
    The brightness of RPTV does fall off at the extreme sides more than direct view, but by the time brightness falls off, the picture looks very squished because of the sharp viewing angle.
    Video hints:
    http://members.aol.com/ajaynejr/video.htm
     
  3. Michael TLV

    Michael TLV THX Video Instructor/Calibrator

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    Greetings

    The larger directview tube sets (flat design) also tend to have many more geometry issues that simply cannot be fixed when compared to RPTV's.

    And while tubes are nice, you simply cannot get that enveloping feeling for a film like you can on a large RPTV.

    Final bit, RPTV tubes are inherently capable of more resolution than the direct view tubes. For HDTV images, RP's typically can display 25 to 33% more detail than the directview tube.

    Regards
     
  4. Jack Briggs

    Jack Briggs Executive Producer

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    The above two responses are spot on. Remember that a direct-view monitor will seem more impressive at first due to its high contrast ratio and ramped-up light output. Its image may seem sharper and more detailed, but that's not physically possible. A well-designed RPTV with 7-inch and larger CRTs will resolve more detail. On the other hand, the drawbacks to RPTVs have been well-stated here; they are more maintenance-intensive (periodic reconvergence sessions are mandatory) and finicky. But, then, no direct-view set can immerse you with a 50-inch or larger 16:9 widescreen film experience in your home.

    It's a decision between trade-offs. Ultimately, choose what looks best to you and what works best for your viewing area.
     
  5. Dwight E

    Dwight E Auditioning

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    Just to add.

    The current crop of 43" RPTV will consume less depth than a 38" tube.

    But, for a set up in picture size w/o the "elephant in the livingroom" syndrome, consider a front projection system. They are VERY close in price (within $500 of a RPTV) and have excellent colors. Tubes, though, have better contrast.

    If you don't want to take the leap towards a front projector, then get a good Hitachi/Sony/Toshiba/Pioneer RPTV that meets your $$$ and space needs.

    IMHO: internal tuners on all monitors kinda suck. Get Dish/DirecTV/Digital Cable. I saw this because crappy signal ona 55" screen is worse then a pure signal on a 27" tube.

    Regards,

    Dwight
     
  6. Jack Briggs

    Jack Briggs Executive Producer

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    I agree with Dwight on that score, too. I'd opt for an external tuner/STB.
     
  7. Todd smith

    Todd smith Supporting Actor

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    I am sorry guys. I did not make myself clear. I dont meant rear projection, I mean hd projection tv monitors compared to the glass variety.
     
  8. Allen Longcor

    Allen Longcor Supporting Actor

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    periodic reconvergence sessions are mandatory

    Does this mean recalibration with Avia or VE????
     
  9. RobertR

    RobertR Lead Actor

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  10. RobertR

    RobertR Lead Actor

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    quote

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------

    periodic reconvergence sessions are mandatory

    Does this mean recalibration with Avia or VE????

    __________________________________________________ ___________________________________

    convergence doesn't involve use of Avia or VE

    per se. The set has its own convergence grid which you can use.
     
  11. Todd smith

    Todd smith Supporting Actor

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    So what does all this mean in regards to my question? Sorry my knowledge is limited right now and you guys are speaking Greek![​IMG]
     
  12. JohnHN

    JohnHN Stunt Coordinator

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  13. Todd smith

    Todd smith Supporting Actor

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    What I mean is a front projection hdtv vs. a direct view hdtv. I know there is a huge difference in picture quality with direct view tv's vs. big screen tv's (not hdtv) and was wondering if the same applied for hdtv's?
     
  14. Todd B

    Todd B Stunt Coordinator

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    Sorry to be slow Todd but I'm still not sure that I am clear on your question. [​IMG]
    Generally, there are three types of consumer displays... direct view, rear projection, and front projection. You can find these three types in both standard and high-definition flavors. Most consumers think of rear projection when they use the term 'big screen' and, as I just stated, these come in both standard and HDTV varieties.
    Are you asking for a comparison of HDTV direct view and HDTV rear projection, between HDTV direct view and HDTV front projection, or between HDTV direct view and HDTV projection (any)?
    Todd
     
  15. JohnHN

    JohnHN Stunt Coordinator

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    Like Todd B, still not sure of your question. You write
    "there is a huge difference in picture quality with direct view tv's vs. big screen tv's"
    The phrase "big screen tv's" usually refers to RPTVs (or large CRT-based direct views or, less frequently, plasma) rather than front projectors. If you do mean front projection, as you later write, then it is not clear what you mean by a non HDTV front projector. If you go to a home theater store, virtually all front projectors these days will be HD ready in some sense. Here are links to pictures of two front projectors
    http://www.sharp-usa.com/products/Mo...58,652,00.html
    http://www.Vidikron.com/products/Vision1/vision1.htm
    Is this really what you had in mind when you wrote front projection? If so, then others have answered your question. Not only are front projectors capable of a much, much bigger image, but the best of them dominate crt-based direct views on virtually every dimension except image brightness. And off center viewing is not the problem with front projectors that it is with RPTVs.
     
  16. Todd smith

    Todd smith Supporting Actor

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    I guess the two sets I am trying to compare are both direct view. I was trying to compare, for example, a 32" hdtv sony trinitron to a Toshiba 43" hdtv. I guess these are both considered direct view? The sony has a glass flat front while the Toshiba has more of a screen type material. Neither of them use a projector type device, but in Best Buy these tv's are labled as hdtv projection monitors which is what is confusing me and you guys because it sounds like it is not a projection at all, but instead a direct view. So why do they lable these as projection?
     
  17. Matt Perkins

    Matt Perkins Stunt Coordinator

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    Oh, NOW I see where the confusion was coming from! Todd was relying on Best Buy's terminology. It's a wonder that they were both labeled "television." (If indeed they were ... )
    [​IMG]
     
  18. John Royster

    John Royster Screenwriter

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    Direct view is a single tube like the sony you mention.

    RPTV is rear projection onto a screen like the toshiba you mention. the image is projected via three cathode ray tubes (CRT).

    So looking at these TVs side by side you are in essence comparing direct view with RPTV and all previous comments apply.

    FPTV is a front projection onto a screen, sometimes mammoth in size.

    hope this helps.
     
  19. JohnHN

    JohnHN Stunt Coordinator

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    The Toshiba is probably the 43H71, which is an RPTV.
    The Toshiba is a good set. You can check out the angle of vision issue for yourself in the store. But in terms of basic video quality, the Toshiba is a very good set, and it is much bigger, obviously, than the Sony. Unless you will be watching the set VERY close, bigger is almost certainly better.
    The Sony 32HS20, which is probably the other set you are looking at, is also a good set.
    A few comments. First, trying to judge between the video quality of these sets in the store is hopeless. Because of the large amount of ambient light, the RPTV will always lose. Rest assured that the RPTV will look great when put in a light controlled environment: bright, fully saturated colors, detailed, the works. In general, I am skeptical of comments comparing sets in store environments, even within the class of RPTVs. On the otherhand, if you will be watching the TV with a lot of ambient light, then that is an argument for a direct view, either crt or plasma [​IMG]
    Second, the fact that you are looking at 4:3 sets signals that watching conventional TV is important to you. If that is the case then try to get some feel for what the sets will look like with a mediocre source, VHS tape say. HD ready sets can vary markedly on this dimension. Run of the mill TV signals and the deinterlacers in HD ready TVs (which converts interlaced to progressive) are usually a sorry mix. Depending on what material dominates your thinking, you may even be better off with a non-HD ready set like the Toshiba 43A61 or the Sony 32FV17. Again, don't assume that direct views will dominate at home just because they appear to do so in the store.
     

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