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gauge of monster dvi400

Discussion in 'Home Theater Projects' started by Greg B, Mar 5, 2004.

  1. Greg B

    Greg B Auditioning

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    Does anyone know what gauge the Monster Cable dvi400 is? I purchased a dvi from cables to go that seems pretty comparable but I'm not certain. I believe it's only 28 awg. Any ideas?
    Thanks,
    Greg
     
  2. Bob McElfresh

    Bob McElfresh Producer

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    Why do you ask/care?

    These cables are not ment to run more than about 6-8 feet in length. Even then, some cables have issues running high-speed digital signals in a bundle. Unlike a single coax run, the gauge is not the issue between good/bad - its the fact that there is a bundle of cables in close proximity. (or so I believe).
     
  3. KurtBJC

    KurtBJC Agent

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    Gauge, as Bob says, isn't the big issue. The big issue (and, unfortunately, a huge issue for DVI in general) is return loss, which depends on length, bitrate, and impedance match. Because the DDWG, which designed the DVI standard, chose to use a bundle of twisted pairs to carry the signals balanced, it's a mess; impedance tolerance is poor, so return loss is high, and that accounts for the troubles people have with DVI over distance. Crosstalk is an issue potentially as well, from shoving all those conductors (23 in the case of a DVI-D dual-link) into a cable under 1/2 inch in diameter.

    Does Monster publish any return loss specs on its DVI cable? That's what you'd really want to see if you were trying to figure out whether it's a well-built cable.
     
  4. Drew_W

    Drew_W Screenwriter

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    Monster has yet to post any specs that I know of. Well almost. Recently, they started posting specs on speaker cable, like this for the M2.2:

    Measurements:
    Outer Diameter: 17.30mm
    Variance: +/- .1mm

    This is very important for comparison purposes. [​IMG]
     
  5. Gabriel_Lam

    Gabriel_Lam Screenwriter

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    What kind of length are you running?

    I've personally noticed some difference with thicker gauge (for instance, when bettercables went to a thicker gauge for their 9m DVI-D cable.) No question about it, their older 28AWG based cable could not do more than 1280x1024 at 60hz at that length (I tried 3 of them, with a few different senders too).
     
  6. KurtBJC

    KurtBJC Agent

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    Actually, Gabriel has a valid point...it depends on what length you're running, and although wire gauge isn't important at three feet, it certainly can become so at longer lengths. I know that one company I've corresponded with on DVI cable specs does produce larger-gauge cables for the longer runs, and that makes sense both because it would reduce raw attenuation losses and because it would help make the dimensions, and therefore the impedance, more consistent.

    Still...in a world where SDI can run uncompressed full-blown HD signals for hundreds of feet without loss, it's a real shame that the current prevailing consumer standard is a signal/cable combo that starts having trouble over such short lengths. If the standard had been designed by broadcast engineers, rather than computer engineers, things might have been different.
     
  7. Gabriel_Lam

    Gabriel_Lam Screenwriter

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    Well, we can all sorta look forward to HDMI. [​IMG]

    Kurt, are you guys going to start carrying DVI cabling? Is it going to be the gauge of the CobaltCable stuff?
     
  8. KurtBJC

    KurtBJC Agent

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    We may have something in the way of DVI soon. I've been talking to some people at Belden who are working on product development, and the tricky part here is coming up with a good way to connectorize it. In the meantime, we may start handling some Chinese-made (so far as I know, they're all Chinese-made right now) DVI cables for resale as an interim measure.

    We've cut up a few of these on the test bench, and they don't look good inside; bad, cheap construction, inconsistent twist rates, and tiny, tiny wires. The DVI-I cables we've seen have all had what appears to be PVC dielectric in the coaxes on the analog side, and while I can't say what the impedance of the analog cables in these bundles is, it certainly isn't 75 ohms and is something much lower. I showed one of these to Steve Lampen from Belden and he asked, "you know what the impedance of that is?" I replied with a four-letter word signifying excrement, to which he said, "correct." But we've been looking at some not-so-bad ones which may do the trick, and will do some in-use testing soon.

    Anyhow, the trick to getting these to run distance might be bonded pairs, or something like that. Connectorizing them efficiently, and keeping them price-competitive with Chinese molded cable assemblies, could be a tough problem, but we've got some ideas on that score. We'll see...
     
  9. Greg B

    Greg B Auditioning

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    Fortunately I am only running a 2 ft. cable so it's sounds as though the gauge will have no factor. Thanks for your help and thank you Kurt. I purchased a digital audio cable and a set of component cables from you guys the other day.
    Greg
     

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