Full bitrate DTS

Discussion in 'DVD' started by Roger U, Jun 26, 2003.

  1. Roger U

    Roger U Auditioning

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    Think full bitrate DTS will make a comeback anytime soon. Seems some of the earlier titles had it, now everything is half bitrate. I would think the superbits, at least, would feature it.
     
  2. Ed St. Clair

    Ed St. Clair Producer

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    NO!!!

    It won't 'fit' on a SB. With 5.1 DD, that is.

    Although, the two disc set, should have been the model for DTS.
    That way, they could have competed with DD, w/extras's.

    No such luck.
    DTS; Great product. Horrible marketing.
     
  3. Ed St. Clair

    Ed St. Clair Producer

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    What about HD-DVD???

    Any chance, with the new format?
     
  4. Julian Lalor

    Julian Lalor Supporting Actor

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    Well, the recrnt R2 DVD of Trainspotting has a full bitrate DTS track to go with the DD 5.1 track. Ditto the R2 Resident Evil. So it's still being done, just not in R1.
     
  5. greg_t

    greg_t Screenwriter

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  6. Matt Stone

    Matt Stone Lead Actor

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  7. GregK

    GregK Screenwriter

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  8. Ben Rogers

    Ben Rogers Stunt Coordinator

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    When I bought superbit, I never listened to Dolby Digital track. I don't know why Colombia didn't get rid of the dolby digital 5.1 and just did a regular Dolby 2.0 and a full bit DTS track just like Dances with wolves, Shadow or any earlier DTS release.
     
  9. Jason Hennigan

    Jason Hennigan Stunt Coordinator

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    I wouldn't be opposed to Columbia not putting DD5.1 tracks on the Superbit releases.

    Give DTS Full bitrate!

    I know that there has to be a DD track of some kind on there, but who is buying Superbits to listen to the DD track? DD is on the normal release.
     
  10. Matt Stone

    Matt Stone Lead Actor

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    Speaking of the Superbit releases, the half-bitrate track on Punch-Drunk Love is great. One of the best tracks I've heard in a long time. Great varience between loud, almost unbearable scenes and quiet dialog.
     
  11. RobD

    RobD Second Unit

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    DTS 96/24 may be worth of consideration, 2 thirds of the tracks are standard DTS (Anout 1000Kbps)and the rest (about 500Kbps) is extened 96/24 info for recievers that can handle it. Im not sure if many new films have 96Khz audio sources but if they do this could be a great solution.
     
  12. James Reader

    James Reader Screenwriter

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  13. KlausWinkler

    KlausWinkler Agent

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    I think it would partially contradict the SB concept.

    On one side, they couldn't afford the space for a commentary, but now they would have to sacrifie >700 Kb for the full rate DTS.
     
  14. greg_t

    greg_t Screenwriter

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    Well, the principle behind superbit was to eliminate extras so the dvd would have "the highest audio and video bitrates". Half bitrate is not full and contradicts the superbit concept. There's no reason why they can't use full bitrate. Of course that's what was said when they came out. We now know that superbit is really about selling you the same title twice.
     
  15. James Reader

    James Reader Screenwriter

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  16. Michael Reuben

    Michael Reuben Studio Mogul

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  17. JulianK

    JulianK Supporting Actor

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    Even if all the bonus features had been moved from disc two of Columbia's Punch Drunk Love Superbit (Deluxe?) disc onto the movie disc, there would still have been room to fit on a full-bitrate DTS track and a commentary track!

    Superbit? Super marketing gimmick!!
     
  18. RobD

    RobD Second Unit

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    JulianK,

    It is not just disk space that is of concern. DVD has a max of just over 10MB/sec for the video track and all aoudio tracks combined. Hence by adding commentary and full bit rate DTS, in any scenes where the rate is at 9ish or higher the picture quality may suffer. This is also why Mr Reuben has a valid point in that removing the DTS track would allow higher video bit rate peaks and hence possibly ahigher quality picture.

    IMHO the Dolby Digital track should be removed since anyone worried hugely about sound and picture quality typically have a DTS reciever anyway and slighttly higher PQ could be achieved and we wouldnt have to bother changing to DTS in the Menu. In the UK superbit titles are rare in any retail shops although easy to find in Mail Order and hence any compatibility problems caused by Joe 6 buying Superbit are almost eliminated as Internet listing can make the requirement of a DTS decoder very clear.
     
  19. Craig W

    Craig W Second Unit

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    Personally, I wish that the half rate dts would be dropped off of the Superbit line. It has been my experience that when 448kbs Dolby Digital and 754kbs dts come from the same master that there really is not any difference. You have to admire Dolby for what it can do with such a low bitrate.

    If they were to do away with Dolby on the Superbit line that would be fine, but then it can't technically be called a DVD. According to the DVD specification, a disc must contain at least a single Dolby Digital (1.0 or higher) track or a PCM track. If both of these are missing then the disc cannot carry the DVD logo.

    I would rather have the extra bitrate be dedicated to the video.
     
  20. Craig W

    Craig W Second Unit

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    The requirement of Dolby or PCM was so that the players could convert the Dolby track or PCM to analog audio to send the players analog audio outputs. At the introduction of dts on DVD, many players could only send the dts digital bitstream down to a decoder. This meant that if you had a dts disc and no decoder you could not hear any audio. Thus, dts was assigned the label as an optional audio track on dvd.

    Newer players can convert dts to analog audio internally, but at the time of its introduction it was not possible.

    There was a lot of political wrangling behind the scenes when DVD was being developed and at the time the DVD forum was not satisfied with the first dts proposal for encoding dts on DVD.

    dts wanted to use the PCM track with no flag protection(ie. the track would just be marked as a PCM track much like they do on dts laserdisc and dts CD), but this opened up a chance for equipment damage for those that did not have dts if they accidentally selected a dts track. This is one reason today that some dts discs bring up a warning screen when you select dts.

    So dts had to go back and come up with another proposal and thus it took an additional year after DVD introduction to get dts included in the DVD specification, but as a result it was given the optional audio track label and was not included with Dolby and PCM as one of the possible required audio tracks.

    Hopefully with the increased availabitly of dts hardware, dts can be included as one of the possible required tracks with the next generation format.
     

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