1. Sign-up to become a member, and most of the ads you see will disappear. It only takes 30 seconds to sign up, so join the discussion today!
    Dismiss Notice

Fox's evolution of "tv on dvd" to "tv on dvd-mod"

Discussion in 'TV on DVD and Blu-ray' started by jcroy, Aug 16, 2019.

Tags:
  1. jcroy

    jcroy Producer

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2011
    Messages:
    4,441
    Likes Received:
    1,682
    Trophy Points:
    4,110
    Real Name:
    jr
    The more problematic CBS case might be something like My Three Sons season 3 being dumped to dvd-mod.

    A few classic tv fans might blow a gasket if something beloved (such as a "hypothetical" gunsmoke or loveboat), goes the dvd-mod route for future season set releases.
     
    Flashgear and bmasters9 like this.
  2. jcroy

    jcroy Producer

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2011
    Messages:
    4,441
    Likes Received:
    1,682
    Trophy Points:
    4,110
    Real Name:
    jr
    I suspect if and when CBS goes all-in with dvd-mod for current tv shows, it will largely be game over for the tv on dvd as a general wide market. Especially if this is done for CBS procedural type shows such as NCIS.
     
  3. bmasters9

    bmasters9 Producer

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2008
    Messages:
    3,448
    Likes Received:
    3,231
    Trophy Points:
    4,110
    Real Name:
    Ben Masters
    CBS better not do that with Gunsmoke, not after near 3/4 of the run!
     
    Flashgear and jcroy like this.
  4. jcroy

    jcroy Producer

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2011
    Messages:
    4,441
    Likes Received:
    1,682
    Trophy Points:
    4,110
    Real Name:
    jr
    For these remaining Fox owned shows, the question is whether Disney is interested in eventually releasing a complete (or partial) series dvd set for any of them. Either with special packaging, or generic giant 24-disc cases.

    Awhile ago I remember seeing a Family Guy set which had seasons 11-14 in a giant 12+ discs case. (IIRC another two FG sets were seasons 1-5 and 6-10). The question is whether Disney is interested in releasing a FG seasons 15-18 dvd set eventually.

    (A similar thinking might be behind Disney releasing The Simpsons season 19 later this year).

    With Modern Family and Homeland ending next year, the question is whether Disney wants to release complete series sets. Same story in the near future once the above shows eventually end: AHS, Archer, Fargo, Handmaid's Tale. (AHS, Archer, and Fargo were already discontinued on bluray, while it is currently unknown whether Handmaid's Tale season 3 will be released on bluray).

    "This is Us" might be vulnerable to going dvd-mod, in spite of getting a three-season renewal recently (ie. seasons 4-6). In terms of past precedents, Fox released seasons 1-3 of "New Girl" as general wide releases before going dvd-mod for season 4.
     
  5. jcroy

    jcroy Producer

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2011
    Messages:
    4,441
    Likes Received:
    1,682
    Trophy Points:
    4,110
    Real Name:
    jr
    The current Fox shows where there have been no announcements yet for season 2 dvd (or bluray) sets are:

    - The Orville
    - 9-1-1
    - Mayans MC
    - Lost In Space reboot

    Under the Disney regime, in principle they're all vulnerable to going dvd-mod or outright discontinued for season 2.
     
  6. Nick*Z

    Nick*Z Screenwriter

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2003
    Messages:
    1,011
    Likes Received:
    1,447
    Trophy Points:
    1,610
    Location:
    Canada
    Real Name:
    NICK
    It's just Fox going the quick n' dirty route. Shows like Archer, shot in hi-def, but only released on DVD makes absolutely no sense at all in this late stage of video mastering and UHD broadcasting. The logic of studio exec's who continue to support DVD over Blu-ray only releases baffles me. Make the point. Don't buy these releases on DVD.
     
    MatthewA, jcroy and Jesse Skeen like this.
  7. jcroy

    jcroy Producer

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2011
    Messages:
    4,441
    Likes Received:
    1,682
    Trophy Points:
    4,110
    Real Name:
    jr
    The easy answer is that too many people are stupid and/or ignorant ? ;)
     
  8. jcroy

    jcroy Producer

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2011
    Messages:
    4,441
    Likes Received:
    1,682
    Trophy Points:
    4,110
    Real Name:
    jr
    As mentioned earlier in this thread, the inconvenient fact of the non-ubiquity of bluray (and 4Kbluray) is a complete utter failure on the part of the advertising / propaganda folks hired to market bluray over the past 13-14+ years.
     
  9. TravisR

    TravisR Studio Mogul

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2004
    Messages:
    33,435
    Likes Received:
    10,459
    Trophy Points:
    9,110
    Location:
    The basement of the FBI building
    It's as simple as that the Blu-rays aren't generating enough profit for them to "bother". If they were making enough money, they'd keep releasing them.
     
    Josh Steinberg and jcroy like this.
  10. jcroy

    jcroy Producer

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2011
    Messages:
    4,441
    Likes Received:
    1,682
    Trophy Points:
    4,110
    Real Name:
    jr
    This goes to say that the giant movie companies are just a "symptom" of the problem, responding to supply and demand adjusted for costs.

    I doubt there's an evil cabal of home video division executives smoking cigars around a table, deliberately planning the demise of bluray/4Kbluray. :)
     
  11. David Weicker

    David Weicker Producer

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2005
    Messages:
    3,233
    Likes Received:
    1,568
    Trophy Points:
    4,110
    Real Name:
    David
    The Orville S2 does have a preorder listing on Amazon.

    And Lost In Space hasn’t had a second season yet.
     
  12. jcroy

    jcroy Producer

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2011
    Messages:
    4,441
    Likes Received:
    1,682
    Trophy Points:
    4,110
    Real Name:
    jr
    It appears to be a placeholder for the time being. (Though the mockup cover looks cool).
     
  13. Message #33 of 64 Aug 19, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 19, 2019
    jcroy

    jcroy Producer

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2011
    Messages:
    4,441
    Likes Received:
    1,682
    Trophy Points:
    4,110
    Real Name:
    jr
    My conclusion for any current/recent shows owned by Disney/Fox, Sony, or Lionsgate, it is very much a crapshoot as to whether any season sets will be released on dvd/bluray in the general wide market. I have pretty much written off any recent/current shows owned by Disney/Fox, Sony, or Lionsgate for quite awhile.

    In the case of Warner, they seem to only care about their own current shows on the CW, HBO or TNT, and whatever long running comedies on the mainstream networks (such as The Big Bang Theory, etc ....). DC comics franchise stuff still seems to be available on bluray on the general wide market. For anything else that doesn't fit into these categories, it is very much a crapshot.

    For Universal, it is very much a crapshot overall too but not as bad as Disney/Fox. For example, I suspect even the Chicago franchise is vulnerable to going dvd-mod at any time. (Law & Order SVU went dvd-mod for seasons 18 and 19, while Law & Order: Criminal Intent was outsourced to Shout Factory after season 6).

    For CBS/Paramount, it seems like they're primarilly left with releasing dvd sets of long running procedurals and Star Trek franchise stuff on the general wide market. For one-hit wonders or anything else that is not a procedural nor Star Trek, it gets dumped to dvd-mod or is not released at all.
     
  14. TJPC

    TJPC Producer

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2016
    Messages:
    3,185
    Likes Received:
    2,800
    Trophy Points:
    4,110
    Location:
    Hamilton Ontario
    Real Name:
    Terry Carroll
    I would certainly prefer Blu ray to DVD for everything, but still do not understand the irrational fear of DVD-mod.

    At the start of the DVD era, my friend made dozens of copies of borrowed Warner movies from the library. Many of these original DVDs are now sited as being unplayable on another thread. The burned copies are still fine.

    I am told the DVD-mods purchased from Warner Archive etc. are even more durable. I have a lot of these and never had a problem at all.
     
    Randy Korstick likes this.
  15. Josh Steinberg

    Josh Steinberg Executive Producer
    Reviewer

    Joined:
    Jun 10, 2003
    Messages:
    16,047
    Likes Received:
    18,765
    Trophy Points:
    9,110
    Real Name:
    Josh Steinberg
    I agree. I have been purchasing burned MOD DVDs since Warner Archive opened shop in 2009. I have also been burning my own DVDs at home since about 2001. At the last check, every single one of those still played fine, with no issue whatsoever.

    I cannot say the same for pressed discs that I've purchased in that same time. And I've actually taken better care of the pressed discs, where a lot of my home burned discs have been stored in less than ideal circumstances over the years and still play properly.
     
    Randy Korstick and jcroy like this.
  16. jcroy

    jcroy Producer

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2011
    Messages:
    4,441
    Likes Received:
    1,682
    Trophy Points:
    4,110
    Real Name:
    jr
    Which brand of blank discs did you use? (ie. Were they made in japan?)
     
  17. Josh Steinberg

    Josh Steinberg Executive Producer
    Reviewer

    Joined:
    Jun 10, 2003
    Messages:
    16,047
    Likes Received:
    18,765
    Trophy Points:
    9,110
    Real Name:
    Josh Steinberg
    I generally used whichever brands were readily available at my local retailers or that offered the best price if going by mail order. I never played the game of "Only discs from this one magical company are good, and all others are really bad" paranoia that was big among some enthusiasts at the time.
     
    jcroy likes this.
  18. Message #38 of 64 Aug 19, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 19, 2019
    Nick*Z

    Nick*Z Screenwriter

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2003
    Messages:
    1,011
    Likes Received:
    1,447
    Trophy Points:
    1,610
    Location:
    Canada
    Real Name:
    NICK
    Actually, the cost of mastering a Blu-ray is comparable to the cost of mastering a DVD in 2019, especially when the show in question has already been shot in hi-def, as conversion or up-conversion is not an issue. It's a one to one transfer process.

    And, in a hi-def world, there really is no point to standard def releases any more. Samsung recently introduced their 8K sets with no content in 8K available to take full advantage of the technology. DVD serves none of the current models either in HD broadcast, Blu-ray or 4K format and looks terrible when viewed on any of these aforementioned hardware. Time for the studios to catch up to where the technology is. In the old days, the tech companies and the home media giants ran concurrent races. That hasn't happened since about 2006, with the entertainment industry continuing to lose ground as a result.

    The most expensive part of the 'remastering' process is restoration, followed by the up-conversion process to bring a film-based product up to new digital standards. As virtually all of the Fox TV shows listed in this discussion are already in hi-def, the argument that it is more cost effective to release them to DVD than Blu-ray is moot. Period!

    In the early days of releasing TV to Blu-ray, the discrepancy between the cost of the DVD and the cost of the Blu-ray for purchase often was beyond $10, leading all but the 'early adopters' of Blu to conclude they could 'be happy' with just their DVD's, since they were cheaper. Today, that price disparity has also leveled off with Blu-ray usually within a $1 to $5 dollar difference for which many are willing to pay the difference to get a superior product. The studios just looked at the numbers before the adjustment in mastering costs were actually in and decided they weren't interested in keeping two formats going. But instead of dropping DVD, they dropped Blu-ray, perhaps unaware that 4K was just around the corner. As 4K sets are fast becoming 'the norm' in households replacing their TV's, the mentality to continue on with DVD instead of Blu-ray now makes no sense.

    But now, in some cases, you have hi-def TV programming that hasn't seen a hi-def home video release for several seasons, making the cost of going back and re-issuing Blu-rays of the DVD sets a little less cost effective.

    I say, if the studios are unwilling to incur this cost, then they should at least be willing to 'farm out' their hi-def digital files to third party distributors to do 'complete series' Blu-ray reissues. This is already happening with vintage TV releases: Quantum Leap, Miami Vice, Damages, The Rockford Files, and the pending Blu of Charlies Angels coming from Mill Creek. Some studios are waking up. Warner will give us the original Scooby-Doo and The Jetsons very soon on Blu. They've already given us Johnny Quest.

    If there's room for this vintage product in hi-def, then there is CERTAINLY room for already prepped hi-def TV on Blu-ray. Warner's archive is also busy pumping out series like Riverdale, Young Sheldon and Lethal Weapon on a MOD basis, but legitimately authored discs. So again, it can be done. At this late stage in the game, it most certainly SHOULD be done!!!
     
    Jesse Skeen and bmasters9 like this.
  19. Josh Steinberg

    Josh Steinberg Executive Producer
    Reviewer

    Joined:
    Jun 10, 2003
    Messages:
    16,047
    Likes Received:
    18,765
    Trophy Points:
    9,110
    Real Name:
    Josh Steinberg
    Nick, I say this with respect, but I think there's a basic point that you're missing here.

    These product categories are drying up because there is little audience demand for them. The way the general audience consumes television content has changed dramatically in the past ten years.

    There is very little audience for modern shows on Blu-ray. For most people who wish to view a current TV show that they missed on air, purchasing a physical object is not the most efficient or desirable way to do so. TV on DVD took off as a category in the first place because, for a brief period, it was the cheapest, best and most practical way to watch a show. That's no longer the case.

    The audience for aftermarket TV distribution has basically split in two directions - most people prefer to stream this kind of content, which generally streams at a quality equal to or better than its original television broadcast. For those people who have not yet moved on to streaming (and the number of people in this category continues to plummet), that group isn't interested in what Blu-ray had to offer and never was. That audience purchases DVD because they are making a decision not to keep up with technology and are stretching obsolete technology to its end of life. There's no real polite way to say this, but that demographic will simply age away, and when they go, so will the demand for this type of content on physical media.

    For Fox, they are making a business decision that the higher costs of Blu-ray production (which are higher than DVD, even if the content is already available in HD) combined with the lower sales of that format make it a losing proposition. Simply put, most fans of a Fox show like "The Orville" aren't waiting for the Blu-ray when the season ends because they've never lost access to the show in the first place. A few years ago, there was an incentive to buy a physical disc -- once the show finished airing, you might not have the chance to see those episodes again. But in 2019, it's a different story. If I were to have missed an episode of "The Orville" when it aired on Fox, I didn't have to wait for a physical media release. I could simply go to Fox's website and watch it there for free in HD. Or I could watch it on Hulu in HD, which I already subscribe to, making it virtually free for me to do so. It's also on a la carte services like iTunes and Vudu in HD. With that being the starting point of what's available the moment the episode is aired, most general consumers just don't have the need to take any extra steps. They already have access to the content in HD. They never lost that access. It doesn't make sense for a lot of people to purchase something like this on a Blu-ray disc when it would just be a second copy of something they already can see for free.
     
    Randy Korstick, Conrad_SSS and jcroy like this.
  20. Adam Lenhardt

    Adam Lenhardt Director

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2001
    Messages:
    21,836
    Likes Received:
    7,139
    Trophy Points:
    9,110
    Location:
    Albany, NY
    The problem with TV on Blu-Ray is the same problem with physical media generally: There are three formats co-existing and splitting a limited market. DVD should have been phased out when Blu-Ray phased in. Blu-Ray should have been phased out when UHD phased in.

    I love TV on Blu-Ray, and spend a lot of money on TV on Blu-Ray to show my appreciation to the studios that support it. I much prefer physical media to digital copies stored on a server somewhere. But I refuse to buy TV on DVD for shows that aired in HD. I just can't justifying paying a premium price for a subpar product.

    So the shows that only come out on DVD I either forgo buying or buy digital only.
     

Share This Page