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For Those Who Still Think Physical Media Has No Place in the 21st century...

Discussion in 'Blu-ray and UHD' started by Nick*Z, Nov 16, 2019.

  1. jcroy

    jcroy Producer

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    From a strictly technical perspective, this is likely to be true.

    From a market perspective, this ain't happening. Regardless of who you want to blame for this sad state of affairs.
     
  2. jcroy

    jcroy Producer

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    If I had to guess, probably stuff like romcoms, dramas, etc ... which do not attract a hardcore collector audience.

    Also some third tier (and lower) movie companies only release thir stuff as dvd-only with no bluray versions at all. For example, such as bottom feeders like The Asylum and other junk purveyors released through distributors like Cinedigm, Lionsgate, etc ...
     
  3. Message #363 of 647 Jan 24, 2020
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2020
    Nick*Z

    Nick*Z Screenwriter

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    [QUOTE="Retiring DVDs means retiring DVD players (and eventually BD playback of DVDs). That would be an enormous inconvenience for those needing to play their existing libraries - not just new purchases - and if anything, due to cost, inconvenience and probably distrust, would facilitate a move from DVD to streaming rather than BD for many people.

    Existing DVD libraries are a thing, and many people are not going to rebuy content. It's not all about new purchases, but it is about the ability to play the discs you've already got and aren't replacing.[/QUOTE]


    Okay, retiring DVD as a format does not preclude being able to play your existing DVD's on a Blu-ray or 4K Blu-ray player. So, upgrade your player, not your library and from now on, buy Blu instead of DVD. Simple. So, yes - it's time to say goodbye to DVD.

    RE: your comment about those with existing libraries being inconvenienced. Did the industry take that into consideration for those who owned vast VHS or Betamax or LaserDisc libraries after DVD's debut? Did the industry say, hey, there's this guy - Ken Crane - who carries a ton of our content on LD. We need to keep him and his followers in large disc format?

    No. And since each was its own format, there was no 'backward' compatibility as there is between DVD, Blu-ray and 4K content. So, the argument is moot. The industry could save itself a lot of coin, and have minimal backlash by simply ending DVD and encouraging everyone to upgrade to a Blu-ray or 4K player.
     
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  4. BobO'Link

    BobO'Link Producer

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    Movies and TV series. Historically, with only a couple of months exception, DVDs outsell BR every month.
     
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  5. Worth

    Worth Producer

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    How would the industry be saving money by eliminating its best selling format? And at this point, would those who haven't already bothered with blu-ray/4K really be likely to do so, or would most of them just switch to streaming instead?
     
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  6. Jesse Skeen

    Jesse Skeen Producer

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    To be fair, most HD streaming DOES look better than standard DVD. What's really sad is I saw a YouTube clip promoting a DVD-only release that looked much better than that DVD did.
     
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  7. jcroy

    jcroy Producer

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    (On a tangent).

    I have to wonder if the dvd versions of non-genre titles (ie. not superhero, not scifi, not fantasy, not horror, etc ....), is subsidizing the bluray versions. (ie. Cushioning any potential or real losses from releasing the bluray version).
     
  8. Stephen_J_H

    Stephen_J_H All Things Film Junkie

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    Go look at the tray in your Blu-ray player. I'll wait.



    Did you notice that 3" diameter indentation in the tray? That's for the 3" CD format. Pressed 3" CDs haven't existed since the early 90s, but the moulds haven't been changed. Your DVD and Blu-ray players will still play CDs, a format that is now nearly 40 years old. Economies of scale being what they are, DVD playback costs [at this point] maybe a few cents to include in even the most expensive UHD 4K player. Unlike a failed format like HD DVD [RIP] and BD 3D [don't @ me; I'm still collecting 3D discs], DVD has enough market penetration that discontinuing DVD playback isn't going to happen anytime soon, and CD compatibility will go first.
     
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  9. MatthewA

    MatthewA Lead Actor

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    Recordable DVDs seem to be more practical to record anything off TV than Blu-ray, even now.

    What percentage of those sales constitute DVD-only releases?
     
  10. BobO'Link

    BobO'Link Producer

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    Here are some recent examples from November 2019 - Historically, there's very little variance:

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    DVD is DVD only. Blu-Ray includes combo-paks with BR/DVD as well as UHD titles.

    The last 2 weeks are interesting in that the week ending 11/23, with the large drop, was BF week last year. This year, the week ending 11/30 was BF week and shows a huge gain over the post BF week last year.
     
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  11. DaveF

    DaveF Moderator
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    There seems to be misapprehension of the state of streaming services. Content isn’t disappearing from services. Content is moving from one service to another. Currently, the major content owners are setting up their own service to compete with Netflix and/or try not to lose out in the streaming future. Accordingly, they’re all pulling their content back to their own services. Substantially, Netflix (and its customers) are the losers here, as Disney and Marvel and Star Wars movies are moving to Disney+ in the next serval years. Hulu is getting all shuffled up with NBC out and Disney owning it.

    This isn’t an absolute. And in the near term there are weirdnesses from all the legal manipulations of licenses for the services established years ago.
    https://www.polygon.com/disney-plus/2020/1/2/21046851/films-leaving-disney-plus-home-alone-pirates-of-the-caribbean-dr-dolittle

    But the clear trend is for *more* content to be on streaming, not less. A watershed is Studio Ghibli is now streaming with HBO MAX. They’ve never been available digitally, much less streaming. Now they are (or soon will be).
    https://www.theverge.com/2019/10/17/20919325/studio-ghibli-stream-hbo-max-spirited-away-kikis-delivery-service-my-neighbor-totoro

    Anything can happen, of course. Disney might decide they want a streaming vault and take content out of circulation for a decade. Who knows?

    But I think the fear that streaming services will just willy-nilly delete content doesn’t make sense. Where’s the profit, a good Ferengi would ask? Long tail. Deep libraries. Something for everyone. Not just Marvel movies on Disney+.
     
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  12. MatthewA

    MatthewA Lead Actor

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    The gain in the last week is obviously because of the Black Friday boost, but that's expected. There is a glimmer of hope if there were more post-Thanksgiving sales this year than last year.

    What those sales figures still don't say is whether DVD those sales are for movies released only on DVD or for movies on DVD who also have a Blu-ray version counted separately.

    I think in the long-term cable is going to be the biggest loser here. It's just a matter of time before everything that's now exclusive to cable moves over to streaming.
     
  13. BobO'Link

    BobO'Link Producer

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    Then have a look at the top 20 titles for last week (there's a link at the bottom of the list for the prior week). The chart linked shows the percentage of sales for each title on BR (and a breakout of how much of that % is UHD):
    https://www.mediaplaynews.com/research/top-20-sellers-for-week-ended-1-18-20/

    Some of it is rather sobering. HBO's flagship Game of Thrones sold more on DVD than BR.

    Here's the post BF week from 2019:
    [​IMG]
     
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  14. DaveF

    DaveF Moderator
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    NBC’s The Good Place is only sold on DVD. Which means we’re all living in The Bad Place!

    I’d consider buying TGP on blu-ray for the extended episodes and any bonus features not available on streaming. But I’m not buying DVDs.
     
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  15. Message #375 of 647 Jan 24, 2020
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2020
    DaveF

    DaveF Moderator
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    I burned 3” CDs, and printed custom labels, to create digital resumes to give away when I was job hunting after grad school. :) good times.
     
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  16. Josh Steinberg

    Josh Steinberg Executive Producer
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    I’m going to guess the reason for Game Of Thrones selling more on DVD: the majority of those sales are coming from people who are not tech savvy and never upgraded from DVD to streaming, and either don’t have cable or elect not to pay for HBO.

    If you’re in any way tech savvy, you probably watched the show through a cable or app subscription in HD. You might have watched it on Amazon, as they have a deal to stream HBO content. Or, you might have pirated it since it’s the top pirated show worldwide. Compared to how many illegal downloads have been made of the show, it seems only a fraction of the people who have seen it did so legally.

    The DVD sales for this title probably represent the remaining audience that can’t or won’t do those other things.

    Anecdotally, my mom and stepdad watched all but the last season on DVD, choosing not to subscribe to HBO through cable and only knowing how the Netflix app worked. When it came time for the last season, my stepdad came to the conclusion that it was stupid to wait half a year for the DVD which they’d watch only once, and about five minutes after saying that my stepsister had them up and running with HBO Now on their Roku stick. Once he saw how easy that was and that it wasn’t the same messy commitment as ordering a new channel from cable, he dumped all of cable almost immediately. He had just thought streaming was basically like YouTube only messier and harder to navigate and for computers and not TVs (not connecting the dots that Netflix was the same kind of streaming) and that was that. So in the blink of an eye, a lifetime cable subscriber and DVD buyer turned into a streamer overnight. Any differences in quality between streaming and discs, perceived or actual, ended up being entirely irrelevant to someone who wanted to see a thing once in a 32” TV using the built in speakers.
     
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  17. TravisR

    TravisR Studio Mogul

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    I never buy GOT but can you even find the Blu-rays at brick and mortar stores? I have trouble finding most Blu-ray TV shows at stores so that could be another reason that they sell more of the DVDs.
     
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  18. Josh Steinberg

    Josh Steinberg Executive Producer
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    Best Buy maybe? I feel like that’s a big enough title that it could be carried in both formats in some places. Particularly going back to when the show was starting and the media landscape hasn’t fully changed yet.
     
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  19. Message #379 of 647 Jan 24, 2020
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2020
    BobO'Link

    BobO'Link Producer

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    You can easily find Game of Thrones on both BR and DVD at stores here. Its sales figures somewhat mirror the difference between overall DVD and BR sales.

    I still purchase DVDs *if* the title can't be purchased on BR. There are also a few TV series I started on DVD and just kept that format for consistency. Those are also shows for which I truly don't care if the quality is a bit lower. There've been complaints about The Orville only being distributed on DVD. I purchased it because I like the show and found the DVD quality is quite acceptable - it looks just as good, if not a bit better, as the quality I got streaming it.

    I still vastly prefer physical. Streaming has replaced "live" TV for me for sampling a show to see if I want a physical copy. If I find I don't I'll often continue streaming it "just because." That's something I never did with "live" TV.
     
  20. DaveF

    DaveF Moderator
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    <shudders> :)

    I’m thinking about upgrading my Futurama DVDs for blu-ray...if they’re on blu. I’m a bit confused on the state of affairs there. Rationally, I should just watch Futurama streaming. But, I love the commentaries, and I’ve started a rewatch of the series. I don’t think episode commentaries are on streaming services, so I gotta have physical media for that.
     
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