For the love of movies: The Past, Present, and Future of Cinema and what makes us fans (1 Viewer)

[Desslar]

These are not at all the same thing as today's big franchises. When people cite these they don't at all account for the fact that these were B pictures made fast and on the cheap just to throw in as another feature to give you more time to spend in a theater. They were not the big focus that were meant to make a company's entire fiscal year. It is basically ridiculous to compare them.

Charlie Chan, Ma and Pa Kettle, Andy Hardy, Sherlock Holmes, these were not franchises at all in the way today's big budget features are. There is no comparison.

No one said Frankenstein was comparable to the MCU. We were discussing if a studio back in the day would have considered making a series of sequels to a vintage hit like The Adventures of Robin Hood. And they did create such franchises, mostly for the horror genre initially and then for many others.

 

[Reggie W]

No one said Frankenstein was comparable to the MCU. We were discussing if a studio back in the day would have considered making a series of sequels to a vintage hit like The Adventures of Robin Hood. And they did create such franchises, mostly for the horror genre initially and then for many others.

Yes, I just don't think the "franchise" idea works for the older pictures as they really did not look at them that way back then. They were just cheap properties they could quickly churn out to throw on a bill with their A pictures. Franchise films are now the A pictures or the ones most important to the company's financials. So when we throw "franchise" onto vampire or wolfman pictures from way back when that's essentially a bad comparison.

 

[Joe Wong]

Why are franchises of interest to studios? Because it's familiar IP. If it's popular as well, then even better.

So yes, the older series like Andy Hardy may have been done quickly and cheaply, but they still relied on the familiarity audiences had with the IP.

In today's world, with film budgets as they are, then a movie with familiar IP is a "safer" bet. And if it makes money and launches a franchise, even better!

The movie still has to be well-received, of course. Since even films envisioned as franchise launchers (2017's The Mummy, starring Tom Cruise) can crash and burn.

 

[BobO'Link]

These are not at all the same thing as today's big franchises. When people cite these they don't at all account for the fact that these were B pictures made fast and on the cheap just to throw in as another feature to give you more time to spend in a theater. They were not the big focus that were meant to make a company's entire fiscal year. It is basically ridiculous to compare them.

Charlie Chan, Ma and Pa Kettle, Andy Hardy, Sherlock Holmes, these were not franchises at all in the way today's big budget features are. There is no comparison.

In spite of that those series *were* some of what kept audiences coming back for more - just like the serials kept the kids coming back every Saturday to see what happened next - even if the feature and/or backup film was the same thing as the week before.

Abbott and Costello grew from "B" pictures into the movies that gave Universal huge profits. The horror films did pretty much the same. The first film in each "series" was an "A" picture with most of the sequels being "B" films though there were a couple of exceptions. The Three Stooges were no slouches when it came to box office draw either and they started below "B" movies in the pecking order. After becoming a major box office powerhouse, Columbia Pictures was able to use the Stooges as leverage. The demand for their films was so great that Columbia eventually refused to supply exhibitors with the trio's shorts unless they also agreed to book some of the studio's mediocre B movies.

 

[Reggie W]

This is fun, Tarantino talks about every movie he saw at the cinema in 1979.

 

[Reggie W]

Here's some more fun stuff. A list of the 70 best music documentaries compiled by Rolling Stone:

40 Greatest Rock Documentaries

Burning guitars, big suits, meeting the Beatles — the concert films, rockumentaries and artist portraits that stand head and shoulders above the rest

www.rollingstone.com

 

[Capt D McMars]

Here's some more fun stuff. A list of the 70 best music documentaries compiled by Rolling Stone:

40 Greatest Rock Documentaries

Burning guitars, big suits, meeting the Beatles — the concert films, rockumentaries and artist portraits that stand head and shoulders above the rest

www.rollingstone.com

With lists always seems to have, to some, very glaring ommisions. Here is one in my opinon...Festival Express, an across Canada tour of 70s hope, drugs and mayhem. Placing very different acts in a train and seeing what happens along the way!! It could have been something really amazing, but the drugs got it way!!

 

[Capt D McMars]

Here's some more fun stuff. A list of the 70 best music documentaries compiled by Rolling Stone:

40 Greatest Rock Documentaries

Burning guitars, big suits, meeting the Beatles — the concert films, rockumentaries and artist portraits that stand head and shoulders above the rest

www.rollingstone.com

Another doc I just love is this one from 2012 -Searching for Sugar Man -

 

[Capt D McMars]

Although not really a documentary, it is a historic record in so many ways, I had to add this as well...

 

[Capt D McMars]

Although released in 2001 by Criterion on DVD, the weird and wonderful 1972 Peter OToole vehicle "The Ruling Class" could use a restored release in BD at least!!

 

[Reggie W]

Although not really a documentary, it is a historic record in so many ways, I had to add this as well...

I thought this was on the Rolling Stone list, maybe not, I know there were some films about the Stones on there.

 

[Reggie W]

Although released in 2001 by Criterion on DVD, the weird and wonderful 1972 Peter OToole vehicle "The Ruling Class" could use a restored release in BD at least!!

Yes, love this film. I have the Criterion DVD but would certainly upgrade.

I like Peter Medak as a director. He has made some really good interesting films. Probably this and The Changeling being his two most well known but he made The Krays, Let Him Have It, and Romeo is Bleeding as well. Certainly a guy worth paying attention to. The last thing I saw about him was a documentary about the making of his film Ghost in the Noonday Sun with Peter Sellers. He is said to be working on a new picture, Fallen Moon, which if it happens I would check out.

 

[Reggie W]

So, I have two videos today that I think as a contrast will be quite interesting to watch. They each feature a director talking about pictures they love or have an interest in. First up, a favorite of mine, David Cronenberg:



I have to say David looks great in this video and much more invigorated than when I saw him prior to making Crimes of the Future when he looked...well...sort of depressed.

As a contrast this next video features Michael Bay, not a guy whose work I have followed nor had an interest in. Actually, this may be one of the only times I have actually heard him speak about film. He is in the same video store as Cronenberg was (this is obviously a series of Canadian interviews) and also wandering about discussing films that have some significance to him:



I have to admit, having never encountered Mr. Bay, his personality is somewhat overbearing and somewhat annoying. Nothing against him but it is sort of funny how each of these men do seem to sort of reflect the kind of films they make. Cronenberg seems thoughtful and measured and Mr. Bay seems like he may suffer from ADD. Just sayin'....

 

[jayembee]

I have to admit, having never encountered Mr. Bay, his personality is somewhat overbearing and somewhat annoying. Nothing against him but it is sort of funny how each of these men do seem to sort of reflect the kind of films they make. Cronenberg seems thoughtful and measured and Mr. Bay seems like he may suffer from ADD. Just sayin'....

 

[jayembee]

Though it's a Roland Emmerich film instead of Michael Bay, every time my wife and I saw a trailer for 10,000 B.C. we'd say "awesome pussycat!" when the sabre-tooth tiger shows up.

 

[Keith Cobby]

So, I have two videos today that I think as a contrast will be quite interesting to watch. They each feature a director talking about pictures they love or have an interest in. First up, a favorite of mine, David Cronenberg:



I have to say David looks great in this video and much more invigorated than when I saw him prior to making Crimes of the Future when he looked...well...sort of depressed.

As a contrast this next video features Michael Bay, not a guy whose work I have followed nor had an interest in. Actually, this may be one of the only times I have actually heard him speak about film. He is in the same video store as Cronenberg was (this is obviously a series of Canadian interviews) and also wandering about discussing films that have some significance to him:



I have to admit, having never encountered Mr. Bay, his personality is somewhat overbearing and somewhat annoying. Nothing against him but it is sort of funny how each of these men do seem to sort of reflect the kind of films they make. Cronenberg seems thoughtful and measured and Mr. Bay seems like he may suffer from ADD. Just sayin'....

Interesting videos, thanks for the heads-up. Good setting for directors/actors to talk about their films and films they like.

 

[Reggie W]

Interesting videos, thanks for the heads-up. Good setting for directors/actors to talk about their films and films they like.

I still like to listen to directors talking about their work. I mean, I am a Cronenberg fan so always cool to hear from him and he says something in the video I am in total agreement with, which is that I think you would get better filmmakers if they did not attend film school. Sort of in the same way McCartney talks about the value of him not being a trained musician, it allows him to do things that a trained musician might not do because they see it as a mistake or not proper. Someone else I heard recently mentioned the film school thing and that they felt one of the issues about today's pictures is so many people are making movies about movies now. They just don't have life experience or anything interesting to write about so they instead write movie scenes based on other movie scenes. This is basically Tarantino's entire deal, he writes movies all about his love of other movies, TV shows, and pop culture. Really though, his life seems to be dominated by his pop culture memories. Of the movies he saw, the songs he heard on the radio, or the TV shows he watched. It's almost like he did not live his own life he lived the life of all these people he watched and dreamed about the other things they did when they were not on a screen.

With Quentin he is just so into it that it turns into an interesting and fun fetish when he gets it up on screen. However, in a lot of these other pictures it just comes out as a boing repetitive deal and when you combine them writing movie scenes based on other movie scenes with also having to write to a formula...well...there just is no there, there in a lot of today's pictures.

I enjoyed listening to Michael Bay too because he is out of my box. He has an obvious enthusiasm for filmmaking, which I liked, and he seems to really love movies. So, despite the fact that I have not watched most of his pictures I liked his passion. He does seem like a guy that is just making movies about movies as well. I probably will go back and watch something he made now to see what I think of it today. While I know his pictures are not really my thing, it is good to get out of my box sometimes.

 

[TravisR]

I enjoyed listening to Michael Bay too because he is out of my box. He has an obvious enthusiasm for filmmaking, which I liked, and he seems to really love movies. So, despite the fact that I have not watched most of his pictures I liked his passion. He does seem like a guy that is just making movies about movies as well. I probably will go back and watch something he made now to see what I think of it today. While I know his pictures are not really my thing, it is good to get out of my box sometimes.

Bad Boys II is like a $150 million exploitation movie. I'm not saying it's a good movie but it's fun and at points sick and just wrong... Those are good things in my mind.

 

[Reggie W]

In another aside, with Memorial Day Weekend generally being the kick-off to summer I had a look at some Summer Movie Preview articles to see what is coming this summer. I thought the new Mission Impossible was coming this summer but had that wrong (it just seems one of those films that has been coming forever as well as the Top Gun sequel) and I thought due to the pandemic that this would be a big summer movie season. Mainly because there was a backlog of movies they had been holding off on releasing.

However, I only found a few films I personally want to see in the previews. Men, which is already out, Crimes of the Future in June, The Forgiven and The Gray Man (which is Netflix so don't know if that will be in a cinema) in July, and I think that was it.

What summer movies will get you into an air-conditioned cinema this summer?

 

[BobO'Link]

I still like to listen to directors talking about their work. I mean, I am a Cronenberg fan so always cool to hear from him and he says something in the video I am in total agreement with, which is that I think you would get better filmmakers if they did not attend film school. Sort of in the same way McCartney talks about the value of him not being a trained musician, it allows him to do things that a trained musician might not do because they see it as a mistake or not proper.

I started college as a voice major. The first week of music theory class we were given a basic chord progression and told how it was the "right" way to do that progression. When I questioned that saying "If a progression doesn't follow that sequence yet *sounds* good or gets you where you need to be then why do you have to know a "proper" way?" I was told "You have to learn the rules to break them!" I called BS on that - it's one of the (many) reasons I changed my major after a year.

What summer movies will get you into an air-conditioned cinema this summer?

There's nothing I've seen announced that generates even the slightest interest for me.