First film mixed in 10.2 premieres Monday

Discussion in 'Movies' started by Adam_S, Mar 2, 2005.

  1. Adam_S

    Adam_S Producer

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    I saw a posting for this at the Robert Zemeckis Center at USC where I have some classes. Anyway, a (presumably student short) film called _Seven Swans_ will be premiering at Norris Theatre on the USC campus (where Tom Holman teaches his class and has had equipped to run his 10.2 system). Apparently this is the first film to be mixed specifically for 10.2, it's based on the Hans Christian Anderson fable and there's no entry on imdb for it, I've already checked.

    It screens at 8:00PM on Monday, March 7 (unfortunately I have class then), and from what I could tell, it's a free and open screening. I'll try to get more details and post them here.

    Adam
     
  2. Ernest Rister

    Ernest Rister Producer

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    [​IMG]

    Look! My student film goes to 11!

    [​IMG]
     
  3. Edwin-S

    Edwin-S Producer
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    Everybody has to start somewhere. Just because it is a student film doesn't mean it is bad. Student films are experimental. New sound formats fall within the experimental category, so what is wrong with a student fim
    taking advantage of new technology? The rolling eye smileys do not seem to be constructive criticism of the student film makers efforts.
     
  4. Damin J Toell

    Damin J Toell Producer

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    Nice to see Ernest discouraging seasoned technogical innovators, students just starting out, and all forms of creativity in general based upon next-to-no information whatsoever. Now that's true film criticism.

    Let's all just insult and roll our at eyes at everything that doesn't involves ourselves. I'll try next:

    [​IMG]

    Look! I just restored a children's cartoon about a deer and a rabbit!

    [​IMG]

    DJ
     
  5. Adam_S

    Adam_S Producer

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    This will also be presented in 1080p

    btw, here's the website: www.matterworks.com


    It's 100% greenscreen work, and the acting doesn't look too good, about on par with most of the 'technical directors' here who aren't so hot with actors. but it looks pretty wonderful, and I imagine in 10.2 it'll be interesting to hear

    Adam
     
  6. Michael Ballack

    Michael Ballack Second Unit

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    [​IMG] to the rolleyes
     
  7. Ernest Rister

    Ernest Rister Producer

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    Since low frequencies are omni-directional, can someone tell me what the point is in having two LFE channels? And I am assuming, of course, that this film truly demands the need for 10 discrete channels of sound? CircleVision 360, or a planetarium that surrounds you with a visual image, would seem to justify such audio trickery.
     
  8. George See

    George See Second Unit

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    Jeez give the guy a break, I for one thought he was making a spinal tap joke, maybee no one else got it.
     
  9. Damin J Toell

    Damin J Toell Producer

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    He was, but it wasn't benign. He used one of the most famous examples of the utter stupidity in the film and, without any hint of laughing-with instead of laughing-at (indeed, the double eye-rolling makes it clear which was happening), he applied that inference of stupidity to the filmmaker in question. This isn't a thread to just post random Spinal Tap quotes; it was obviously an insult.

    If someone deserves a break, it's probably the student filmmaker in question who deserves a break from having his film trashed by people who haven't seen it.

    As for the utility of a second LFE channel:

    "The additional sub channel would be to create a greater sense of headroom on the low frequency effects, making it possible, for instance, to very accurately recreate the sense of space and pressure one feels when suddenly entering an otherwise silent cathedral."

    "2 low-frequency channels are added for bass envelopment and improved spatial reproduction."


    DJ
     
  10. Joel...Lane

    Joel...Lane Second Unit

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    [​IMG] Unbelievable.
     
  11. Seth Paxton

    Seth Paxton Lead Actor

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    I have created an animated film that will have speakers in the back of the theater and is based solely around the idea of abstract animation and free form segments. I envision updating the film every few years with new segments.

    [​IMG]
    Whatever, Walt, you stupid crackpot.



    Come on Ernest, you're better than that.
     
  12. Pat Frank

    Pat Frank Stunt Coordinator

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    Actually if it had something to do with Spinal Tap, wouldn't the sound system be something more like "0.10"? [​IMG]
     
  13. Ernest Rister

    Ernest Rister Producer

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    Hey...I now openly admit I stepped in it. I saw "student film" and "10.2" and I immediately thought of the crap student films and productions I crewed in college.

    Little did I know more money was being spent on this movie than the Gross National Product of some small island nations. This is not a student film. This is a line item in some state or federal spending bill.

    Having said that, hey -- two LFE channels are really TRULY unecessary. Frequencies of the kind they are talking about (creating the silent pressure of stone walls within a cathedral) are of such low frequency that they are felt, not heard, and are well outside the range of human hearing to begin with. I did a sound design for a show called Soldier Boys at a college in Southern California, and because the lead character was haunted by the events that happened to him in WWII next to a river, my idea was to introduce the river sound effect, and then using concussion speakers, drop that river sound out of the range of human hearing while maintaining the volume, so that the audience would feel the same psychological horror of the main character as he struggled to cope with this horror in his daily life at home. The sound would be always there, you just wouldn't hear it, you'd feel it.

    You know what the results of this would have been?

    Most likely a sea of vomit in the audience after the 3rd or 4th scene, as these constant low frequencies would impact the inner ear, creating a nauseous and overwhlemingly distressed psychological effect. I accomplished what I wanted through other means, but I still chuckle at the youtful ambition which was grounded in an idea, not real-world physics. Two LFE channels? I'm dubious.

    So forgive me a bit of mocking laughter when I saw "student film" and "10.2". I was really only laughing at myself back in school. What's the old saying? Look before you leap?
     
  14. Tony_Ramos

    Tony_Ramos Second Unit

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    Ernest, I'm sorry to inform you that it is indeed possible to discern the direction of low frequency subwoofer information... Move your subwoofer around and you might feel it yourself... Maybe not the 20-30 hz stuff, but certainly the sub 80hz that most satellite speakers aren't designed to handle...

    Therefore having stereo channels of bass will help with positioning and immersion.

    Finally, 10.2 channels is worthless if 5 of them are placed behind the screen like the new experimental THX standard has...

    really what we need is a codec meant for 1 speaker every 60 degrees, a center, and one on top, with stereo bass. The front and rear speakers would have to be acoustically related of course. It would provide vertical imaging, stereo bass, and 360 degree imaging.
     
  15. Tony_Ramos

    Tony_Ramos Second Unit

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    According to the website, apparently Gary Reber, editor of WSR and preimminent supporter of surround sound, likes the mix, so it must be pretty darn immersive.

    Ernest, ove your subwoofer around and you might feel the positioning yourself... Maybe not the 20-30 hz stuff, but certainly the sub 80hz that most satellite speakers aren't designed to handle...

    Therefore having stereo channels of bass will help with positioning and immersion.

    Finally, 10.2 channels is worthless if 10 of them are placed behind you... really what we need is a codec meant for 1 speaker every 60 degrees, a center, and one on top, with stereo bass. The front and rear speakers would have to be acoustically related of course. It would provide vertical imaging, stereo bass, and 360 degree imaging.
     
  16. Robert Anthony

    Robert Anthony Producer

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    I'm pretty sure Episode I had about 1500 visual effects shots.

    and I thought the student film crack was funny, even if it was dismissive.
     
  17. Ernest Rister

    Ernest Rister Producer

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    Ernest, I'm sorry to inform you that it is indeed possible to discern the direction of low frequency subwoofer information...

    Tony, in my experience, that depends on your speakers, and where you place your sub. Ideally, you shouldn't be able to localize your sub.
     
  18. Adam_S

    Adam_S Producer

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    The highest budget I've heard for a grad film is 95k, most get a lot of equipment donated, make connections at studios (many get access to studio prop houses for free) and most people work for food and tape/dvd for your reel rather than pay. You're also expected to run your set like a professional obeying all the rules you'd be expected to obey in the real world, they're very strict on this. Even on 290s (what I'm doing now, currently pre-producing my forth of five) you need to get all the necessary permits, safety clearances, tutors/child welfare (if you're shooting with kids, which a lot do on the second level, 310, not so much no 290, though it's not unheard of) while obeying SAG rules with any actors you cast. If you do any stunts (explosions or other dangerous things) you have to hire a stunt coordinator. Steady cam operators aren't covered under the insurance we pay at the start of the semester so if you hire an outside one it's a safety issue unles they have insurance USC approves--or you can use your own home-built steady cams and glide cams, cranes, gimmicked up lighting (hurray for clamp lamps!) and what not. 290s are the only films allowed to use copyrighted music (since they'll never be played outside of class in the format you shot them in), every other level you're expected to hire original composers. Quite a few intermediate films also hire students and or pros to work on make up and special effects, including computer effects. The stuff done in animation department is also incredible, a favorite spring thing is the annual Key Frame screening of this years crop of animated offerings. [​IMG]

    Actually, talking with one of the professors the other day, he said the biggest issue they're having of late with people who move up to 310 is that they don't initially know/understand about how actual 16mm film works, so they don't see the difference in shooting with tungsten or daylight film, since it's just the flip of a switch or a matter of white balancing on the Sony PD100s we use in the beginning course. And if you shoot on 16 you HAVE to send it to a lab to have them process it and digitize it so you can edit on Avid, we still have flat beds around but I don't know of any class that uses them other than as a novelty demonstration.

    anyways, I really need to get back to figuring out how to write that script and make the three story lines scan and stay under seven minutes and have creative work arounds our limitations then I can start casting it, scouting locations, getting permits and hanranguing people into crewing for me.

    Did I mention our campus TV station which does an hour of live broadcasting about every night and around 2-4 hours of original programming weekly? Plus of course it's also a production crew for hire at the best price in LA so I'm also on that working 'free lance' whenever my schedule permits to pick up some nice 12$ an hour crew work.

    I Love USC!, I understand we also have a football team, but I've not heard much about it.

    Adam
     

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