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Favorite New Outlaw 950 Feature???

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by John Cain, Nov 10, 2001.

  1. John Cain

    John Cain Second Unit

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    The feature I look most forward to with the new Outlaw 950 pre/pro is the bass management that will allow me to select different crossovers for different speaker groups.
    The second most anticipated feature is the 6.1 surround (I just got rear surround speakers).
    What are you looking forward to ??
    -- John
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  2. Brandon B

    Brandon B Second Unit

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    Separate sub XO points for different speaker groups. The main reason I plan to buy it.
    BB
     
  3. Tony Lai

    Tony Lai Stunt Coordinator

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    The analog passthru... the 'one box does it all' engineering.
    I dunno, it's so well thought out, I like how they don't dictate what WE need :)
    T.
     
  4. Dan Hitchman

    Dan Hitchman Cinematographer

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    Well, they didn't put in a 7.1 mode with the ability to do stereo back channels. That is one minus. Although, I guess you can't expect miracles on a sub $1,000 pre-amp. Although, if Outlaw is supposed to be putting out a more than $1,500 quality component at cost (since they cut out the middle man and deal directly with consumers) then they probably should have.
    It wouldn't seem like such a deal to me if they finally release a pre-amp at a $900 price point that really only is worth $900 retail. That would be an insult to their customers.
    However, the way they do the volume control is supposed to be quite sophisticated: analog domain, but with digital control capabilities. The control sends a digital pulse and that then tells the analog chip to raise and lower the volume. Supposed to be a cleaner way of manipulating the volume. We shall see, um hear.
    Dan
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    Stop HDCP and 5C-- Your rights are at risk!
    [Edited last by Dan Hitchman on November 10, 2001 at 01:26 PM]
     
  5. Derrik Draven

    Derrik Draven Supporting Actor

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    My favorite feature is that the 950 might be available soon...
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    "...better to have a gun and not need it than to need a gun and not have it". - Slater, True Romance
     
  6. Bernard L

    Bernard L Stunt Coordinator

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    well, whtever it is, it surely isn't a green power button [​IMG]
     
  7. Gregory Scott Bass

    Gregory Scott Bass Stunt Coordinator

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    I think they are missing the boat also by not putting 7.1 on this unit, it has me reconsidering lately, I guess logic 7 spoiled me. I also find it annoying that prologic2 was designed to be a 7 channel system but was reduced to 5 for marketing reasons, you can expect the 7 channel version in a couple of years and they will act like they just invented it....its a marketing ploy to make us upgrade once again, and I am afraid outlaw may be doing the same song and dance.
    I may have to sit this one out or possibly buy an mc1 again, I definetely am keeping an eye on the prices on ebay. Scott
     
  8. John Morris

    John Morris Guest

    Gregory: If I were you, I would definately buy another Lex MC-1 (although why did you sell it in the first place?)and then wait those two years to pay Lex a few grand for that upgrade to DPL7. It looks by the tone of your post, that you'd just be dis-satisfied with anything but 7 channel music.
    As for me, I'll spend my grand on the Outlaw and then in two years, spend another grand to buy Outlaws next model pre/pro. At that time, I'll move the 950 to either my bedroom or the kids playroom HT.
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    Take Care,
    merc
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    [​IMG]
    God Bless America!!!
     
  9. MatthewJ S

    MatthewJ S Supporting Actor

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    Let's hope it has the most important feature,quality sound!
     
  10. Gregory Scott Bass

    Gregory Scott Bass Stunt Coordinator

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    John I think you hit the nail on the head, for alot of people money is an issue, it was for me and still is, I havnt written off the outlaw by a long shot, I was actually hoping to beta test it to make it more affordable,it will just be interesting to see how good it is and my post was mainly a gripe about having to continuously upgrade to new equipment and how the companys that do have upgradibility built in either dont support it or charge you almost as much as new equipment to do a upgrade. I wish our computers could just run our home theater so we could just download the latest and greatest. I just had two kids so now every purchase is a major one. Scott
     
  11. Michael D

    Michael D Stunt Coordinator

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    Gregory,
    Although the 950 won't have logic 7, it does have a version of 7.1. At least that is the way I read the specs on it. Maybe only mono rear channels, someone please fill in the blanks here, thanks.
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  12. Randy G

    Randy G Second Unit

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    My vote:
    stereo rears: yes
    dual mono rears: no
    Outlaw 950: no
    close, but no cigar.
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  13. Roger Dressler

    Roger Dressler Stunt Coordinator

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    John wrote:
    "I also find it annoying that prologic2 was designed to be a 7 channel system but was reduced to 5 for marketing reasons, you can expect the 7 channel version in a couple of years and they will act like they just invented it....its a marketing ploy to make us upgrade once again, and I am afraid outlaw may be doing the same song and dance."
    I can assure you that Pro Logic II was not reduced from 7 to 5 outputs. It never had 7 outputs. I worked with Fosgate through the design phase.
    I can tell you the reason it has 5 outputs is because 5.1 is the most universally recognized and utilized multichannel production, delivery, and reproduction layout in the world, and is likely to remain so for a good long time. The full capabilities of 5.1 are only being explored for the first time by music, TV, and game content producers. Let's give them a chance to score before moving the goal posts.
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    Roger Dressler
    Dolby Laboratories
     
  14. John Morris

    John Morris Guest

    Roger D: Hmmmmm, please notice that I was quoting someone else when I posted:
    quote: I also find it annoying that prologic2 was designed to be a 7 channel system but was reduced to 5 for marketing reasons, you can expect the 7 channel version in a couple of years and they will act like they just invented it....its a marketing ploy to make us upgrade once again, and I am afraid outlaw may be doing the same song and dance.[/quote]
    The above was posted by Gregory and I was somewhat sarcastically refuting his statement... me and you are both on the same side.
    Okay, for that mistake, I'll accept the protected code for the upgrade to DPL3? Or, at least the release date and supported decoding chips... NAH! Nevermind...
    As for me, I'm buying a new pre/pro which supports DPL2 amd DD-EX.
    Thanks for being a part of this forum and you are forgiven for your mistake, although, it sure would be nice to have some sort of display which displays Dolby nomenclature in my HT. [​IMG]
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    Take Care,
    merc
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    [​IMG]
    God Bless America!!!
    [Edited last by John Morris on November 12, 2001 at 01:28 AM]
     
  15. John Kotches

    John Kotches Cinematographer

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    Dan,
    I'm sorry, but DTS-ES and THX-EX contain mono information which is sent to either a single rear center channel, or duplicated to a pair of rear speakers.
    So I'm not quite sure how Outlaw is missing the boat on this.
    Regards,
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    John Kotches
    Contributing Writer
    Secrets of Home Theater and High Fidelity
     
  16. Dan Hitchman

    Dan Hitchman Cinematographer

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    Well, Logic 7 and THX EX can both create at least some sense of stereo separation in the back channel.
    If they put a decoding mode similar to, let's say, Logic7 then they would need the ability to have stereo rear outputs not just dual mono.
    They are kind of starting to get into "a day late and a dollar short" mode if the hold up is now a game of word symantics. Unless, by adding licensed DD EX, they are designing the 950 with the possibity of having a matrixed height channel. Although, I'm not as thrilled with the thought of continually going backwards in format sophistication by reverting to matrix channel delivery instead of discrete, full bandwidth channels.
    Hell, let's design a home theater medium that allows true 1080p HD resolution and audiophile quality 10.2 discrete surround and be done with it. I'd be all over that! [​IMG]
    Dan
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    Stop HDCP and 5C-- Your rights are at risk!
     
  17. Matthew Anderson

    Matthew Anderson Second Unit

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    I like the Cirrus Extra Surround and adjustable crossovers for each set of speakers.
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  18. John Morris

    John Morris Guest

    Logic 7, logic 7, logic 7... I just don't see what is so great about logic 7??? Because of the few "I gotta have logic 7" posts I've been reading, today, I went into a local shop and once again demoed logic 7. The setup was a very nice one which could make almost anything sound good. I brought along some demo material with me including a few multichannel SACD disks, a few regular CDs, and two DVDs including The Haunting and Episode One- TPM. First, I listened to the SACD discs using first logic 7 music, and then direct mode. Winner, by a huge margin SACD, but no suprise there since SACD had a format advantage. Next, I listened to my speaker testing CD by Donald Fagan. Obvious winner, Direct two channel. Logic 7 music didn't sound bad, IMO, it just distracted from the front soundstage. Everytime the rears perked up, I thought, why? It reminded me a bit like a better thought out 7 channel stereo DSP that I sometimes use for very casual listening on my Denon 3801. Finally, it was movie time. IMO, here is where Logic 7 cinema had a slight advantage over 7.1 DD EX. I found that my seating postion had a great effect on how much difference I really heard. If I sat in the ideal sweet spot, the difference was noticable if you tried to hear a difference. Otherwise, when I started enjoying the movie and forgot about critical listening, I realized that I didn't notice the differences. However, if I moved my chair back beyond half way in the room, the differences were noticable. In fact, my attention was drawn to the discrete sounds emanating from one center rear predominately.
    So, I guess I would like to have the opportunity to have Logic 7 someday for certain movies, but it certainly is not a must have for me, and will never be a deal breaker when it comes to buying equipment.
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    Take Care,
    merc
    ----------------
    [​IMG]
    God Bless America!!!
     
  19. Will Gibbons

    Will Gibbons Agent

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    John,
    Logic 7 may not be a feature that does it for you, but I do enjoy it. I look at it not as a single feature, but a set of features because of the various parameter settings within each effect you use. From your post, I am guessing you were auditioning Logic 7 on the new MC-12. Was the SACD player hooked up and outputting in 2-channel or 5.1 channel? You then were able to compare Analog Bypass On and Off on this? I have not auditioned the MC-12 yet and I'm curious on this. While adding the additional processing of A-D with Bypass Off, the benefit of full crossover control and time alignment would be available. I would think it would still be pretty impressive. I have planned on holding out for a digital standard, but this could be a long time coming.
    Tweaking Logic 7 to the room and music is something I would suggest doing. You have control of frequency rolloff and additional delays for your rears as well as level controls by effect for the side and rear surrounds. Additionally, you can adjust vocal enhance for your center and adjust soundstage for Front, Neutral, and Rear. Individually adjusting these settings or several together, as well as tweaking the crossover points have made major differences in my enjoyment. I prefer setting for the fullness of the sound environment and increase in the soundstage, yet still maintaining front presence without "effect" distraction. Each to their own, but adjusting Logic 7 may give you far more appreciation than a "stock" audition.
    Regards,
    Will
     
  20. MatthewJ S

    MatthewJ S Supporting Actor

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    circle surround,logic 7,dts neo6,dplII ,"concert hall", "jazz club",etc...my dsp is better than your dsp!!!!
    lets just hope that we get recording engineers to utilize multi-channel discrete formats properly so we don't have to go out and buy new equipment everytime some idiot-savant develops a new "must-have" algorythm!!!!
     

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