Explain Edge Enhancement To Me (1 Viewer)

[David Von Pein]

I'm admitting an awful secret.....

I have no idea what Edge Enhancement is.

What am I supposed to be seeing when I view EE? And what makes it the evil of all evils?

I've never once pointed to my screen and uttered...."Oh God, NO! It's Edge Enhancement again! I can't watch any more!"

Is EE REALLY a huge issue on DVD...or merely one more reason to gripe about a DVD transfer?

Thanks for any help. (Anybody got any screenshots of examples of EE?)

 

[James L White]

basicly it's ugly halos around hard lines and yes it sucks, I think it's caused by El' Nino j/k but it is a legit problem:frowning:

 

[David Von Pein]

WHY is it even needed?

 

[David Von Pein]

Also: Is EE a problem on VHS pre-recorded cassettes? Or is it a Digital problem only?

 

[Jeremy Allin]

May all your EE questions be answered!

 

[BrentPollard]

It's a DVD thing. And mostly visible on larger high quality video displays, although Sony Wega owners claim to see it. I have a 4 year old Sony 32" trinitron and don't really notice it. On the Vista series "Tombstone" when Kurt Russell gets off the train you get a close up of his hat against the sky. If I pause the DVD and walk up to my tv I can see a halo. But I would have never noticed it had I not been a member of this forum.

 

[David Von Pein]

But I would have never noticed it had I not been a member of this forum.

Exactly.
Not even worth worrying about.

 

[SvenS]

The vast majority of those who are posting complaining of EE are those who are really Techno-fans NOT film fans! They sit around just analyzing the video instead of sitting back and actually enjoying the film itself! This has become a much over done thing in all these forums these days!

 

[Matt Pelham]

Edge Enhancement is a problem.

No it's not confined to DVDs, VHS tapes usually have the worst edge enhancement (halos 2-3 times bigger than the worst DVDs).

If it's extreme enough it may be distracting, but once you learn to ignore it, it ceases to be a problem. That being said if you don't know what EE is, don't go researching it or else you'll start noticing it while you're watching movies.

 

[Brian Lawrence]

The vast majority of those who are posting complaining of EE are those who are really Techno-fans NOT film fans! They sit around just analyzing the video instead of sitting back and actually enjoying the film itself! This has become a much over done thing in all these forums these days!

Not quite.
I fail to see how someone who cares about dvds looking as close to the original version as possible are somehow "NOT" film fans. I for one won't let mild edge enhancement prevent me from enjoying a film that I love, But that does not mean that I should just be quiet and totally appeased with a dvd transfer that should of looked better. Edge enhancement is something that could be easily avoided by the studios at no extra cost, It's something that they for the most part, purposely adding into the transfer, so as to give the illusion of a sharper image.
Once you know what edge enhancement is, It's impossible to not notice it. It's like a fly buzzing around your head, Even when you decide to ignore it, it keeps zipping by the corner of your eye. I don't even have a large TV and I can still tell the difference without much effort, Even when you are not noticing distinct ringing artifacts, the overall image just seems a tad unnatural and overly crisp or processed looking.
Yes there are extreme cases in which, I have seen people take a pretty damn clean transfer (Like Shrek) and find a smidgen of ringing in a blown up still frame and start squawking that it is nearly unwatchable. But most of the people I see griping about EE seem to be more level headed. We will still purchase, watch, and enjoy these movies, but never the less can't help but feel disappointed in the technical quality.
I find EE to be very irksome at times and I am a Film-fan more than I am a techno-fan, I buy many dvds that are in mono, dvds of films that have some scuffs in the prints or noticeable film-grain. I don't expect nor even want every dvd to look and sound like Fast and the Furious, but I do demand that films be presented in the best possible manner that their elements will allow and I do not believe that makes me somehow a NON-filmlover.

 

[Kwang Suh]

If you don't know what EE is, then keep it that way. In this case, ignorance is bliss. Once you know what EE is, you will always notice it.

 

[David Von Pein]

If you don't know what EE is, then keep it that way.

Gee, Kwang, NOW you tell me!
Too late! I already authored this thread.
Now I've got to lie in the bed I just made!
Now I'm gonna see halos everywhere! Crime-in-nettelies!!
(BTW....Is there EE evident even in some 1.33 films and TV DVD products?)

 

[David Von Pein]

Not trying to start up a flaming B-B-Q pit here .... but I have a feeling that there's more than just a slight grain of truth in Sven's statement above.
Over-analyzing anything is not good (IMO). Getting bent out of shape about each and every little blemish we see in films will eventually lead to thinking EVERY DVD looks like crap!
Example: AOTC. I've read on several forums threads that read along the lines of .... "AOTC: Is It REALLY A Good Transfer?" And it's probably as close to perfection as we're likely to see on current SD-DVD. But some people STILL gripe about it.

 

[Kwang Suh]

The vast majority of those who are posting complaining of EE are those who are really Techno-fans NOT film fans! They sit around just analyzing the video instead of sitting back and actually enjoying the film itself! This has become a much over done thing in all these forums these days!

I usually let EE pass me by. But, watching something like Tombstone: Forcefield edition, well, I don't know how you couldn't notice.

 

[andrew markworthy]

I think that edge enhancement can be used by *some* folks to boast that they've got expensive set-ups where it's very noticeable. I don't think everyone who contributes to these debates falls into this camp, and some people are genuinely concerned with quality and that's it. This is laudable - we all want the best quality we can get - but I think it's also worth pointing out that EE was devised so that Joe [or Jo] Average, who can't afford a 60 inch screen and is stuck with a not very high quality set, can get a *subjectively* better picture.
I think at times some of our beefs about standards of picture and sound, which are only an irritation when seen on a megabucks system and are unnoticeable on an average system, are just a little snobbish.
Incidentally, about the obsession with screen size - are some members (I use the term advisedly) of this Forum *compensating* for something?

 

[GlennH]

The vast majority of those who are posting complaining of EE are those who are really Techno-fans NOT film fans! They sit around just analyzing the video instead of sitting back and actually enjoying the film itself! This has become a much over done thing in all these forums these days!

EE is what sometimes makes video less FILM-like in appearance, thus hampering FILM fans from enjoying the FILM experience. FILM fans want the best possible presentation for the FILMs they watch. They don't want to have that marred by unnecessary video processing.

It has nothing to do with being a Techno-fan. And who asked your opinion on why EE bothers us anyway? I think that people that post like you did either have very small video displays, are legally blind, or just not very discriminating. So please don't bash those of us who don't fit those categories.

 

[Mark Palermo]

About 3 years ago, before I knew what edge enhancement was, I figured it was a problem with my new RPTV. The repair guy was absolutely baffled by it (I would point it out on the helicopter at the beginning of THE THING), and some people said I could get rid of it if I lined the inside of my set with non-reflective black fabric. I'm glad that I now know it's been a problem with the source material all along.

Mark

 

[SvenS]

EE is what sometimes makes video less FILM-like in appearance, thus hampering FILM fans from enjoying the FILM experience. FILM fans want the best possible presentation for the FILMs they watch. They don't want to have that marred by unnecessary video processing.
It has nothing to do with being a Techno-fan. And who asked your opinion on why EE bothers us anyway? I think that people that post like you did either have very small video displays, are legally blind, or just not very discriminating. So please don't bash those of us who don't fit those categories.

Oh, so now a forum to voice your opinion is NOT a place to voice your opinion? I guess everyone here just post scripted responces that are given to them by the administartor!
I have no problem with people posting about an especially bad transfer with a lot of EE...what I have a problem with are all these posts on DVD that have very minimal EE and how the EE is ALL OVER THE PLACE and we should boycott the DVD and/or studio! These people usually just leanred about EE and want to try and impress others by posting any slight EE that may be found on a DVD. Yes, EE is a artifacting that we certainly can do without especially those with largers screens (mine is only a mere Runco DTV-1200 projected on a 8 foot screen which I guess you consider that a very small display ) but to fly off the handle as many are doing these days just makes me think they are into Home Theater strictly for the electronics and NOT for the films. To NOT buy a DVD of a film you really like because it has slight EE is rediculous IN MY OPINION!

 

[GlennH]

Oh, so now a forum to voice your opinion is NOT a place to voice your opinion?

Not at all, Sven. But your initial post didn't qualify what you were saying. It seemed to me to condemn anyone who ever posted anything about EE (I'm one of those) as being a techno-geek who doesn't love films (I'm not one of those). An opinion about EE is one thing, but an opinion that sweepingly judges others unfairly is bound to offend.
Your additional posting above gives a better idea of where you are coming from, and I agree with what you say. But I also don't want to discourage knowledgeable people from complaining about EE because we know the studios can do better and it's only by continually demanding better that we're ever likely to get it. And some of the EE today is more than slight, and you should definitely see that on an 8 foot display.
Sorry if I offended you, but your initial post didn't come across very well to me.
By the way, for any of you techno-geeks who want some more recent musings about EE vs. compression artifacts from Mr. EE (Bjoern Roy), check out this thread at AVS:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...hreadid=201080

 

[EricW]

i started out watching DVDs on my computer, which is probably the WORST thing to do in terms of EE. now i have a 36" HDTV, and i still notice it. i doesn't bother me that much, but it is nevertheless distracting (like Phantom Menace - oops, that wasn't edge enhancement, according to Van Ling). especially when it's an otherwise PERFECT transfer (like Pearl Harbor DC). i've never seen the Tombstone DVD.