Experience with the Behringer UltraCurve 8024 anyone?

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by Oliver, Jan 20, 2002.

  1. Oliver

    Oliver Stunt Coordinator

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    I am going to order this filter to use it mainly in the sub path but also experience in full frequency range. I will order it with mic.

    Has any one experience with the UltraCurve and can give some advice for measuring?

    Thanks.
     
  2. Greg_R

    Greg_R Screenwriter

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    It looks like that product only has 3 bands of parametric EQ (which may not be enough for sub equalization). You might be better served getting a Behringer DSP1124P (Feedback Destroyer Pro). This has 12 bands of parametric EQ and is cheaper. FWIW, I am using 5 parametric filters to EQ my sub...
     
  3. FrankD

    FrankD Stunt Coordinator

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    I have bought both the older version of the 1124 and the 8024. Both are great products but the above noted post is correct. If you think you may need more than 3 parametric bands then go with the 1124. It is cheaper. One differnce between the 8024 and 1124 is that when you turn the 8024 on their is a much lesser pop in the sub. The way around this with the 1124 is to turn it on first and turn the sub on next (unless this problem is fixed with the new 1124 - comments from owners?)

    The 8024 does allow you to measure the frequency response with the mic along with giving you the ability to create pink and white noise and individual sine waves but the display is fairly poor. However alternatively you can buy software form accusoft to run on you computer with a calabrated mic along with the 1124 and end up getting much more for probably less money.

    Regards
     
  4. Oliver

    Oliver Stunt Coordinator

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    Thanks for the response. I allready had a Behringer Feedback Destroyer DSP 1100, but wasn't satisfied with the quality. This is why I turned to the 8024.

    The 3 Notch Filters per Channel should be enought considering that there are still normal filters that work simultaniously with those togheter.

    So the choise was because of the mic and better quality.
     
  5. Danny Owens

    Danny Owens Agent

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    I tried 3 of the 8024's. As far as full spectrum, it's garbage. The quantization at low volumes will drive you nuts!! It also adds another A/D D/A conversion at the preamp output. IMO, Behringers A/D and D/A converters suck. It works fine with subs because the sampling frequency is high enough to handle the < 120 hz signal. Once you get abouve about 800 hz, the quantization is very nasty. I ended up going with three of the Ultra-Graph Pro and stayed in the analog domain.

    Danny
     
  6. BruceD

    BruceD Screenwriter

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    Oliver,

    I'm interested in what you mean by your comments,"I allready had a Behringer Feedback Destroyer DSP 1100, but wasn't satisfied with the quality. "

    What specifically were you not satisfied with?
     
  7. Oliver

    Oliver Stunt Coordinator

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    @BruceD

    I unpaked the unit when it arrived and plugged it in to see if it would work. Just then I noticed that it was emitting bussing from thw tranformator. I opend the unit to fix the screws at the transformator with no better result. It also look very poor from the inside. So I did not even use it, just the bozz was enouth for me to sell it on ebay.

    If it was possible for humans already 30 year ago to walk on the moon, then I do not think that it is to much asked to give us toys without buzzing transformator.

    So my next try is the 8024 that I ordered this morning. I will be used only in the subwoofer parth. But only if it is little better than the FBD, otherwise you will find the unit on Ebay Germany.
     
  8. BruceD

    BruceD Screenwriter

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    I certainly can't comment on German electricity (although I did stay in Hanover for CeBit a couple years ago), but a buzzing transformer is an annoyance.

    The upgraded model Behringer is selling now, the BFD 1124P should be an improvement. I have the BFD 1100P and noticed you didn't specify 1100P in your message. Did you have an original 1100? That may have been the problem. Did you buy the 1100 new or on ebay?

    I haven't had any problems with mine buzzing, although it does pop if you turn it on while the sub is already on, so I just leave both on.

    When I tested an external DAC last year, it came with a 3mm thick square of soft rubberized material under the transformer to damp any vibratiions or buzzing.

    I do think the 1100P/1124P is a better solution for sub equalization.

    Keep us informed how it goes.
     
  9. FrankD

    FrankD Stunt Coordinator

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    You should note that there is two kinds of buzzing.

    1. From speaker generally caused by the ground plug on the Behringer. This is fixed by getting a cheater adapter to remove the ground or as I did (since cheater plugs can not legally be sold in Canada) bought an AC adapter and cut the ground plug that would have gone into the wall and pluged my Behringer into this adapter effectively removing the ground.

    2. The other is a mechanical hum which seems to be the issue here. Yes my 1100P does have some mechanical hum, but if it is inside a cabinet then just about all the hum should disappear. You can hear the hum from about 5 feet away if the unit is exposed. It is not loud but you know it is there if all other equipment is off. Sure I would like the mechanical and other hums gone but for the price that the unit costs I did not expect too much. Some people have actually taken the unit appart and added material to stop this hum. I did not try this as it does seem some what dangerous. Perhaps others can comment on this.

    Also I would not mind knowing if the 1124P eliminates both problems above and/or the other problem of subwoofer pop when Behringer is turned on after sub.

    If I recall correctly a much smaller pop existed with the Behringer 8024 Ultracurve as well.

    Regards
     
  10. Greg Lee

    Greg Lee Agent

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    I have an 1124, and it does have the POP when it is turned on or off. However I have not encountered any buzzing of any kind; neither electrical hum nor mechanical buzzing.
     
  11. FrankD

    FrankD Stunt Coordinator

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    I called up Behringer and they said that the 1124P has an improved DSP system and is supposed to be quieter but not dead silent. However they did not fix the POP as described above.

    Also per discussions with the Behringer representative he said that it would not be worth it to upgrade from the 1100P to the 1124P if the unit was just being used for subwoofer equilization - Unless you really hate the extra humming from the earlier version.

    Regards
     
  12. Chris Zell

    Chris Zell Stunt Coordinator

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    Danny,

    I must disagree with you about the 8024 being 'Garbage' full range. I do wish it were 96kHz ADC inputs, but the 48kHz 24 bits aren't 'Garbage'. You should not have terrible quantization noise if you send it levels high enough. 48K, 24 bit did not destroy the sound in my case at all. In a straight thru test, I noticed a slight degradation. But when I compared bypass with carefully EQ'd settings in a problematic room I had, the benefits far outweighed the negatives - much better with IMO than without.

    I am now in a different room, and I'm using it just in-line with the sub. I agrree with you, it is fine for that. Whether or not 3 parametric filters per channel is enough is up to the individual, but I think it is usually more than ehough. It's hard to properly set up 2 or 3 parametrics! I also like the pink noise, analyzer, mic and PC software. It is very useflu as a carry around analyzer, and I use it for that.

    The display on the 8024 is not the greatest. I use the free PC software to get better pics, and to control it. The PC software does not allow ful control however, which is unfortunate. I sit looking at my PC screen when I am playing with it.

    If I only needed it for the subs, an 1124 would be the cheaper way to go. But as long as it is useful in other capacities for me, then I'll keep it.

    Be sure you have the maximum signal levels you can get without overoload to minimize distortion in any unit the does analog-to-digital conversion. Low level means poor quantization. Tons of folks do this, and then blame the unit. I'm not necessarily saying that is what you did, danny, you may have far superior ears than mine, but it is a common problem.

    Cheers,

    CZ
     
  13. Danny Owens

    Danny Owens Agent

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    Chris,

    I understand that it needs a higher level input; however, the type of music I listen to is quite dynamic. I don't know if you are a Pink Floyd fan, but at the beginning of Dark Side fo the Moon there is a kick drum that starts out really faint and then gets stronger. As it gets louder, it sounds like sandpaper until it gets to full volume. Soft details get lost in the quantization; such as light guitar strumming. That is with my pre amp at max output! I had three of them and they all did the same thing at several different gain levels.

    Danny
     
  14. Chris Zell

    Chris Zell Stunt Coordinator

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    Danny,

    Yes, I am a PF fan. haven't tried the intro to DSOTM - I can tell it sounded bad!

    I put mine in a tape loop, thereby guaranteeing that it would not get ridiculously low, and quantized when I was listening at low volumes. If I was going to keep it there, running full range, I was going to get the digital input option, and run my CD player right to it with coax, thereby bypassing the problem with an additional AtoD and DtoA. When I get my HT preamp, I may consider getting this I/O option and sending the digital output of the preamp to the 8024 when I'm listening 2 channel. I sure wish HT pre/pros had digital outs for all the 7.1 channels - then you could do this regardless of the type of source.

    Cheers, and sorry the 8024 didn't cut it for you. I'll probably just continue to use mine for the sub, and as a carry around analyzer.

    Cheers,

    Chris
     

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