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Enterprise 1/16

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by Dave Scarpa, Jan 16, 2002.

  1. Dave Scarpa

    Dave Scarpa Producer

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    Why is it that writersfeel they always have a B story ? That was always a problem in TNG, the need to have, an often have, a weaker B story. During all the drama of an Alien Invasion and defending the ship, am I to believe Hoshi or anyone for that matter would put finding out Reed's Favorite Food? TOS never had the need for a B Story?

    With only 42 min of episode they can't fill that with a single interesting story ? Tonight's ep was OK I wish they had Archer and Company actually Destroy the Alien Ship with the New Weapons, that would of Lent to some good soul searching.

    Also I had to ignore the obvious ease this ship can contact Earth, with a flawless transmission even, Subspace amplifiers indeed.
     
  2. Mike Broadman

    Mike Broadman Producer

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    Worst

    Episode

    Ever

    Really though, what the heck did I just watch? Why did the aliens invade? If they really wanted to destroy the ship, why not just blow it up?

    And yeah, that pineapple thing was lame. They have to learn how to integrate character development with story better.

    Next week's episode looks good, though. A classic medical Prime Directive-ish story line.
     
  3. Mike St.Louis

    Mike St.Louis Supporting Actor

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    I stared watching "Enterprise" and realized that I hadn't really missed it at all. Archer's speeches to new alien races are laughable.
     
  4. Randy Tennison

    Randy Tennison Screenwriter

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    I enjoyed it. I was glad there was no "Diplomatic Solution", and that they just simply blasted the ship.

    I also liked the fact that the captain was drinking a beer with the hero officers. It shows that he's not Picard, Kirk, or any of the other polished captains. He's a new breed of captain, without all the Starfleet history and protocals.

    And as far as his first contact speechs, yeah, their kinda funny. But you have to remember, no one has done it before. He's making it up as he goes along. He shouldn't be as polished as Picard.
     
  5. Chris Brunner

    Chris Brunner Second Unit

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    Dave,

    You make good point that I never really considered. I ALWAYS seem to find myself drifting off whenever the "B" story line kicks in. Looking back, EVERY EPISODE from TNG on, seems to have one. Last night though, I became ANNOYED each time the "food plot" reared it's ugly head.

    I've been watching the Original Series in order on DVD recently and, for the life of me, can't think of one secondary story that didn't have SOMETHING to do with the problem at hand.

    By George, you might have just discovered one of the problems that, if fixed, COULD save Star Trek. Will anyone listen??? NO.

    C

    I have to admit though, last nights episode had a really good score!! Better than many of the films even.
     
  6. Dennis Reno

    Dennis Reno Supporting Actor

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    I think the "B story" (great name, btw) is used for additional character development. Sometimes the B story is good, most of the time it adds little or nothing. TNG was full of them. In fact, if my memory serves me correctly, most episodes of TNG had two main stories woven together. Think about the interesting (?) forays into Data's quest to become more human, Worf's inner struggle, etc.

    I think, when handled correctly, two story lines adds greatly to the shows appeal. It can help explain why characters respond to situations the way they do, give us more perspective on personalities.

    Tonights episode wasn't bad IMO. Archer's speeches should be a bit bumbling, after all, this is supposedly our first major expedition. However, I still don't understand why the aliens "toyed" with Enterprise. That was never made clear.
     
  7. Shayne Lebrun

    Shayne Lebrun Screenwriter

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    "Oh crap. We got our asses kicked. If only we had some bigger guns."

    "We do."

    "Eh?"

    "They're in the closet."

    "What the FUCK?"

    "Well, we didn't have time to install them."

    "Oh, for Christ's sake."

    Or, put another way...

    "READY THE UNBELIEVEABLY LARGE DESTRUCTO-BEAM CANNONS!"

    "*clearing throat noise*"

    "*inquisitive look*"

    "We, ah, don't have the unbelieveably large destructo-beam cannons."

    "We don't?"

    "No."

    "And why is that?"

    "We, ah, fell behind schedule. Didn't have time to install them."

    "THROW ME A FRICKIN BONE HERE, PEOPLE! All I ask for is an UNBELIEVEABLY LARGE DESTRUCTO-BEAM CANNON, and you can't even do that. What do we have?"

    "A pineapple cake."

    "A pineapple cake? Is it large?"

    "Yes, sir. Unbelieveably large, in fact."

    "Well, that's a start. READY THE UNBELIEVEABLY LARGE PINEAPPLE CAKE!"

    But I do have to say, the aliens were well done.
     
  8. CharlesD

    CharlesD Screenwriter

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  9. ikiru

    ikiru Stunt Coordinator

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  10. ikiru

    ikiru Stunt Coordinator

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  11. Anthony Hom

    Anthony Hom Supporting Actor

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    One of the biggest examples of a B-story in TNG is the one with Worf finding the secret Klingon prison camp by Romulans. The B -story was Data working with Bashir at DS9 on having dreams?

    It was a 2 parter, with the dream story coming to an end in part 1 and the Worf story taking all of part 2. The Worf story was actually very good, dealing with the planet where Klingons and Romulans secretly live together in peace.
     
  12. Chuck Anstey

    Chuck Anstey Screenwriter

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    As for the cannons, what do you expect when you leave dry-dock before Tuesday? At least they were delivered.

    I have to agree that Archer is lame and I am not really getting into this show at all. I want it to be good but the stories have been as weak as the Enterprise itself. Maybe next week.

    Chuck Anstey
     
  13. todd s

    todd s Lead Actor

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    The one thing I like is that you can see the bridge between our time and that of Kirk & Picards. For example in last nights episode Reed's dad talks about how is family is 3 generations Navy. Thus showing how the old armed services have really not made the jump to space.
     
  14. Jack Briggs

    Jack Briggs Executive Producer

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    About "B" stories: TNG took that to excess during its fourth season; sometimes it was hard to differentiate the main plotline from the B plotline.

    On the other hand, it sorta worked with last night's episode. During the first half of the episode, I was certain the story would take a TNG twist and point out that the satellite transponders the Enterprise had been deploying were in some way defiling the aliens' "territory" in that sector of space.

    Alas, the story took a suprising turn and ended in a distinctly TOS style, with the Enterprise pummeling the alien spacecraft. Interesting. Archer was in his Kirkian mode.

    The B story was pretty decent, helping to flesh out Reed's character a bit, as well as Hoshi's.

    One thing though: Why the reluctance to return to Earth? The Enterpises 1701, 1701-A, 1701-D, and, presumably, 1701-E, return to home base routinely. Archer doesn't really have a point to prove there.

    Is some sort of Voyager-stranded-light-years-from-home mentality creeping here?

    Overall, though, I enjoyed the episode. Not bad at all.
     
  15. Nelson Au

    Nelson Au Executive Producer

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    I enjoyed the show too last night. I was expecting the aliens to turn out to be like Balok from Corbomite Maneuver, testing the Enterprise. Which they were, but in the end they decided the humans were not worth contacting and decided to kill them.

    I really enjoyed the comradre of the Chief Engineer and Armory Officer under the pressure they were.

    I agree Archer is written as so as to sound a bit goofy when contacting aliens. I agree too that he's the first, no Kirk or other Captains with this kind of experience. But the thing I liked the most was how Archer realizes that they have no chance out there and the need to get the ship in shape. Malcolm came through as everyone in the audience would expect.

    And I think it wasn't necessary for Enterprise to destroy the enemy. It sends the wrong message don't you think? The silly ape-like humans going out and destroying everything.

    Nelson
     
  16. WoodyH

    WoodyH Stunt Coordinator

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    Here's what I put up on my website earlier today:
     
  17. Jason Seaver

    Jason Seaver Lead Actor

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  18. Steve Enemark

    Steve Enemark Second Unit

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    The whole episode was a wash. It felt like two "B" stories told in parallel, with no "A" story to be found. Halfway through the episode, I thought "When is tonight's story going to get going?" If you're going to have aliens attack the ship, at least give them some motivation, not to mention a friggin' name.

    It was a clumsy plot device to endanger the ship, without A: making an interesting story, B: giving the bad guys an ounce of personality other than the alien-of-the-week, and C: giving me any reason to care about what happens next. I mean, we know the Enterprise will prevail somehow, and pulling an uninstalled phaser cannon out of thin air was the final insult.

    I was mildly entertained when Hoshi "propositioned" Reed, and he got the wrong idea, but it was surrounded by 59 minutes of fluff. The sooner they jettison the crew (except for Trip, Dr. Phlox and Hoshi) the better.
     
  19. Nelson Au

    Nelson Au Executive Producer

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    The whole point though, from my point of view is, that as we venture into space, there will be things we will never understand, beings who will not be able to or want to communicate with us. I think this was a story from our point of view, we can't see the aleins either as the audience. We are like the crew, as baffled as to why they were testing them, and checking out the crew and attacking them.

    Maybe they like going around testing and provoking others. Maybe this episode was a clumsy attempt to forsee future conflicts with these aliens. Like those really bad early Next Gen episodes that forshadowed the Borg.

    Nelson
     
  20. Jack Briggs

    Jack Briggs Executive Producer

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    I certainly agree it was refreshing to have truly alien aliens, and ones for whom no "universal translator" could work.

    As for Kirk: I have always entertained the notion that for Kirk "diplomacy" was essentially a phaser in his hand and a smirk on his face.
     

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