Encroaching Neighbor (1 Viewer)

[Lew Crippen]

Robert Frost may be spinning in his grave, given the spin on his poem Mending Fences in at least two posts.

I won't quote the whole thing, but it begins:

Something there is that doesn't love a wall,
...

and (later) continues:

Spring is the mischief in me, and I wonder
If I could put a notion in his head:
'Why do they make good neighbors? Isn't it
Where there are cows?
But here there are no cows.

And (to the point here):

Before I built a wall I'd ask to know
What I was walling in or walling out,
And to whom I was like to give offense.
...

Now you may well disagree with the poet, but quotes out of context, misconstrue the point of the poem.

 

[Charles J P]

Hehehe, that's what I thought when I read that. "I'm a people person. I deal with the customers so the engineers don't have to. Don't you get that? What the hell is wrong with you people!" — Office Space

 

[Jeff Ulmer]

While I agree with you to an extent, Joe, it is pretty rude of someone to start chopping down trees and creating a big mess when they aren't even on their property. If the trees aren't on the neighbor's property, they are legally obligated to replace them, which includes the cost of removing any stumps they created, and replacing the trees with like-sized specimens. That could result in a several thousand dollar bill.

I still say calling the land title office or the police would be a good first step, which would at least give you a working framework for how to approach the situation.

 

[John_Stra]

I would just talk to them..say you are thinking of putting some landscaping etc.. and that you want them to be aware of the lot line. I agree with the lack of common sense.

 

[brentl]

""I was trying to locate the source of this water running down the driveway and I noticed that you're cutting trees that are on my property. There was a pin here (points to spot) that would've shown you the property line."

That's a great start.

Don't bring up the trees unless they are pricks, them show them the survey and tell them to replace the trees.

How about rerouting the hose back onto there(their, they're) property.

Brent

 

[Lynda-Marie]

My family had a weird situation when we moved into the house I grew up in [Early 1970s]. Not too long after we moved in, my dad received notice of a city auction, that was selling a piece of property that was 6 feet by 50 feet, and was just behind our garage. Dad bought the piece, and was cutting down a tree on it when our neighbor came over. It turns out it was really part of his property.

Unfortunately, the neighbor was mad as hell when he confronted my equally short-fused father. Relations were ugly for years, including a court battle. Why the city auctioned off that piece is still a mystery. I have never found out who might have initiated it, or why, because all of the plans I have seen of the property at the time before we bought the house and again after, indicated that this was part of the neighbor's property. Dad was not only furious with the neighbor for being such a "jerk" about it [dad's perception, considering the neighbor was well within his rights to be peeved] but also with being taken in by a bogus auction.

Considering the tension I grew up with Mark, I would STRONGLY advise you start things out in a friendly, non-confrontational manner. Aside from which, if you do start out hostile, and tick off your neighbors, they might start a harrassment campaign that will force you to deal with them, like it or not. Expensive lawsuits, unpleasant behavior, and nothing but frustration is just not worth it.

 

[Henry Gale]

Mark,
I don't think any of us have enough of the facts to comment on this, and I'm not sure you're armed with the complete story either.
No one has used the word easement yet, but an easement is what you're describing.
I've lived with a similar situation for over 20 years and it can get complicated. BTW, who maintains your "shared driveway"?
Take this slowly and look for that pin with a metal detector.

 

[Marv]

Maybe your neighbor is a fellow HTF member and will read this and understand he errored and you guys end up buddies, maybe even having family movie nights together.
You Never Know. Think Positive!

 

[Janna S]

Given all the possible angles to the trespass (trees and the special damage awards that some tree destruction may warrant, the removal or movement of survey markers, drainage issues, etc.) and how confrontations could haunt the neighborhood for years to come, and knowing the legal ramifications of what has happened, the possible remedies, the cost of achieving repair or remuneration or other satisfaction, and the risk of misstepping and losing your legal advantage, I give the sure-to-be-unpopular advice that you talk with a lawyer before you do anything. Don't be penny wise and pound foolish, and don't go off thinking you know the whole framework of what your remedies might be. I've seen many situations like this that went tragically - and I do literally mean tragically - out of hand.

 

[TomK]

I think that I read that you both have children. Are these children friends and perhaps they will play together for years? I live in a rural area as well and I know my son relishes the few kids that are in the area.

Play it carefully but don't get walked on.

Tom

 

[DonnyD]

Unless they are ignorant, they would have known what the survey pin actually was, therefore the removal of it was either out of pure ignorance or purposeful......
I would certainly agree with your concern with this dilemma. People get REAL funny about their land/property. I hope they are just ignorant but I doubt it.

 

[Tim L]

This story sounds familar- my problem started with an easment as well-I have a very long driveway (600ft) but there is a small section near my mailbox entrance that I have an easement with my neighor-I went ot there one day just to plant some stuff and he said that I couldn't beause its his property ( it is) but I have complete rights to the easement- says so in my deed. he even wanted me to move my mailbox and put my trash pick up on the other side of the driveway-(again he has no say in this-he was just trying to push- but he picked the wrong guy and I basically lost it at that point and told him to f... off because the mailbox is by rights on town property). We went to the lawyers first just to confirm and when we were doubly certian we told him and he didn't like it-infact it got worse and I had to hire a surveyor just to mark the whole property line between us (a good 700ft).
That still wasn't good enough everytime I went near the line (rake leaves whatever) he was right there ball busting-he is obsessed with the line. I started clearing my front yeard by cutting down MY trees and he was right there with his digital camera taking pictures of the property line- so now its going to be fence time. I have never had good relations with any nieghbor- so I buy a house way off the road and have only one neighbor to speak of and it turns out he's an asshole too-you just can't win sometimes. good luck and find out the facts first like I did before you confront him

 

[Charles J P]

I think this is what the original poster is trying to avoid here. When someone has a minor dispute and you "lose it and tell them to fuck off" its probably going to lead to not good relations with ANY neighbor.

 

[BrianW]

Moving the survey pin is evidence not only of deliberation, but premeditation. I would get a survey done, making sure to inform the surveyor that you're sure the pin was moved. If the survey shows encroachment, I'd hire a lawyer to send them a letter detailing what actions need to be taken on their part to remedy the situation. If they approach you offering alternatives, be gracious and willing to accept a lesser settlement.

I have a friend whose driveway encroaches on his neighbor's property and has done so for nearly 80 years. His neighbor threatened, via lawyer letter, to sue for $70,000 for back rent on the encroachment. He approached her, offered to remove the encroaching part of the driveway and re-sod the area, and she was perfectly fine with that. As far as I'm concerned, I think both parties handled the situation in the best possible way.

 

[Paul Bond]

Being a non-confrontational sort (except in my daydreams), I will recommend something like the following:

Approach your neighbor and comment how you have noticed he is clearing some trees and brush from his property. Even compliment him on how nice it is looking (what the heck), then let him know that a few years ago you had chosen to let your property grow more or less free so that it gave you a feeling of being alone in the woods that you really enjoyed. At this point, hopefully, he should be nodding with you. Even if not, he shouldn't be feeling threatened.
So now you can state your concern that he not cut down any of your growth by mistake or mistaken kindness, thinking he is doing you a favor. You could even point out that the property markers used to be 'around here somewhere' and that you had left them after the initial survey because they helped you to remember where your say-so ended and to keep you from offending any neighbors. Unless he is truly a jerk at this point he should be willing to work with you to identify what is whose, and the issue will be decided without any grumpiness. If he truly IS a jerk, then I reckon you need to get the surveyors out to redefine the property lines and then ask him politely to leave your side alone so that the two of you don't have to waste your time and money on lawyers and courts.

Bond. Paul Bond.

 

[Joe Szott]

Sorry, I missed the part where he was actually cutting down your trees. I thought he was just stacking the wood from his trees on your property to store it there. Yeah, I'd be a bit more pissed about it than I orginally posted.

But still, just go talk to them. You never know what's on their mind until you get some sort of communication going.

 

[Moe Maishlish]

Never assume things.

The pin might be missing, but you don't know that:

a) your neighbour is the person that removed it
b) it's been removed at all (it might be buried or stamped into the ground)
c) it might have been removed by an animal or natural occurrence (if it wasn't planted very deep or firmly).

Going in half-cocked, and accusing your neighbour of something for which you are making assumptions & presenting circumstancial evidence will do nothing but make the situation worse for yourself.

You might also want to consider being nice about it. I understand that you're not a "people person", but sometimes you have to be, so grin & bear it. Talk to your neighbour like you WANT to be neighbours (even though, evidently, you don't), and that you're interested in maintaining friendly relations. Otherwise, you're sending a very bad message.

Why accomodate someone who's not being accomodating to you? If someone approached you all riled up and pointed our something that you did wrong, then you might not necessarily react in the best manner. Conversely, if they approached you with seeming respect & treated you with a degree of decency & dignity, you'll at least know that they're not trying to cause a problem, but to find a solution.

As someone who has lived with his share of crappy neighbours (both with my parents & on my own, in apartments & in houses), I'm speaking from experience. Trust me - having bad relations with those living around you is no fun at all.

Good luck, and let us know how this turns out.

Moe.

 

[Henry Gale]

[c]Happy Birthday Mark![/c]
[c]Be sure and invite the neighbors over for ice cream & cake. [/c]

 

[Philip_G]

one question, what are these survey pins you speak of?

Are we talking a regular old wooden stake? Or some kind of metal pin I'm not familiar with?

 

[Chris_Morris]

I know around here they use metal stakes in the ground. Last year the plat next to mine was being surveyed for sale and they went ahead and re-surveyed the neighboring plats. When the iron could not be found, they restaked it, but the plat specifically marks the iron pins in the ground.