Empire Magazine's Top 25 Best Films

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by Steve Christou, Sep 28, 2001.

  1. Steve Christou

    Steve Christou Long Member

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    Empire Magazine is the UK's no.1 film magazine, not sure if its available in the US, the new issue had the results of a poll by its readers on the 50 best films of all time, here is the top 25.
    1)Star Wars (1977)
    2)The Empire Strikes Back (1980)
    3)The Shawshank Redemption (1996)
    4)The Godfather (1972)
    5)The Matrix (1999)
    6)Fight Club (1999)
    7)Gladiator (2000)
    8)Goodfellas (1990)
    9)Breakfast at Tiffany's (1961)
    10)Pulp Fiction (1994)
    11)Raiders of the Lost Ark (1981)
    12)The Usual Suspects (1996)
    13)Jaws (1975)
    14)American Beauty (1999)
    15)Casablanca (1942)
    16)Blade Runner (1982)
    17)Godfather II (1974)
    18)Seven (1995)
    19)Aliens (1986)
    20)Saving Private Ryan (1998)
    21)Silence of the Lambs (1991)
    22)Schindler's List (1993)
    23)Alien (1979)
    24)Some Like it Hot (1959)
    25)LA Confidential (1997)
    So what we have here is what the average UK filmgoer thinks are the best movies ever, no British films in the top 25, tsk tsk.
    Citizen Kane is at no.28, 2001 is at no.33, and Jedi is at no.40.
    Lawrence of Arabia is at no.36.
     
  2. Jeff_A

    Jeff_A Screenwriter

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  3. Rain

    Rain Producer

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    quote: 1)Star Wars (1977)
    2)The Empire Strikes Back (1980)
    3)The Shawshank Redemption (1996)...
    5)The Matrix (1999)
    6)Fight Club (1999)
    7)Gladiator (2000)...
    12)The Usual Suspects (1996)...
    16)Blade Runner (1982)...
    18)Seven (1995)
    19)Aliens (1986)...
    23)Alien (1979)[/quote]
    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
    Now that's even funnier than most of Steve's posts.
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    [Edited last by Rain on September 28, 2001 at 11:31 AM]
     
  4. JonZ

    JonZ Lead Actor

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    Yea thats pretty funny, the Matrix and Gladiator in the top 10 of all time....oooooooooooooooook [​IMG]
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  5. Steve Christou

    Steve Christou Long Member

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    Well that represents the UK's average moviegoer I'm almost afraid to say, I'm pretty sure the US average moviegoer would have a different sort of top 25, probably 2 or 3 Kevin Smith films in the top 10 and 'Dude Where's my Car' at no.11, with 'American Pie 2' straight in at no.1, hehehe sorry had to hit back. [​IMG]
    Yep, looks like most of Empire's readership consists of teenagers, film snobs probably spit at the mag on the newstands.
     
  6. PhilipG

    PhilipG Cinematographer

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    Well, it could be that the readers of Empire are better judges of movies than the HTF's elitist film snobs. I mean, it's all down to personal taste and movie experience anyway. [​IMG] Anyway, having said that, I think their choices suck. [​IMG]
    But I'd keep a few in, namely 9, 15, 16, 24, and 25.
    I'm no film snob, but surely we can do better here...for example:
    classics: The 39 Steps ('35), Lawrence of Arabia, The Ipcress File, Grand Illusion, The Wicker Man
    contemporary: Rushmore, Dark City, Moulin Rouge, Brazil, Being John Malkovich
    Of course now someone's gonna claim my selection is just as bad or worse... [​IMG]
     
  7. Neil Joseph

    Neil Joseph Lead Actor

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  8. Ike

    Ike Screenwriter

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    It can be assumed that most users of the IMDB are in North America, and so that list is this:
    1 Godfather, The (1972) 8.9/10 (40128 votes)
    2 Shawshank Redemption, The (1994) 8.8/10 (57350 votes)
    3 Schindler's List (1993) 8.7/10 (42277 votes)
    4 Citizen Kane (1941) 8.7/10 (25214 votes)
    5 Casablanca (1942) 8.7/10 (28503 votes)
    6 Godfather: Part II, The (1974) 8.7/10 (20547 votes)
    7 Star Wars (1977) 8.7/10 (64377 votes)
    8 Shichinin no samurai (1954) 8.6/10 (9125 votes)
    9 Memento (2000) 8.6/10 (14219 votes)
    10 One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest (1975) 8.6/10 (28477 votes)
    11 Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Bomb (1964) 8.6/10 (25359 votes)
    12 Raiders of the Lost Ark (1981) 8.6/10 (39392 votes)
    13 Rear Window (1954) 8.5/10 (16173 votes)
    14 American Beauty (1999) 8.5/10 (44854 votes)
    15 Usual Suspects, The (1995) 8.5/10 (43787 votes)
    16 Star Wars: Episode V - The Empire Strikes Back (1980) 8.5/10 (47709 votes)
    17 Psycho (1960) 8.5/10 (22677 votes)
    18 Pulp Fiction (1994) 8.5/10 (54290 votes)
    19 Silence of the Lambs, The (1991) 8.4/10 (38512 votes)
    20 North by Northwest (1959) 8.4/10 (14862 votes)
    21 Wo hu cang long (2000) 8.4/10 (22626 votes)
    22 It's a Wonderful Life (1946) 8.4/10 (17517 votes)
    23 Goodfellas (1990) 8.4/10 (25266 votes)
    24 Lawrence of Arabia (1962) 8.4/10 (12348 votes)
    25 12 Angry Men (1957) 8.3/10 (10440 votes)
    While a better list than the one Steve posted, it still is off, with the focus, obviously on American films, and a tendency for newer films. And in my personal opinion, Star Wars, it sequels, or it's prequels, would appear in no form of a "Best-of" list.
     
  9. Ike

    Ike Screenwriter

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    I'd have to agree with Steve that that paticular magazine's(I'm almost dead certain we get it in the US, though I'm not a 100% sure) fanbase must be younger. In a complete and utter waste of my time, averaging the list showed that the average date for the film's on Empire's list is 1984.6, while IMDB's average is 1974.16. And, somewhat surprising, contains more foreign language films!
    (Hey, Steve, England may want to check out some of their own films-I hear the Powell fellow is pretty good, since after all, you are the ambassador right? [​IMG] )
    [Edited last by Ike on September 28, 2001 at 02:45 PM]
     
  10. george kaplan

    george kaplan Executive Producer

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    The list isn't completely bad, but the bias towards newer films (or ignorance of older films) is sad.
    From the top 25:
    1990-2000 52%
    1980-1989 16%
    1970-1979 20%
    1960-1969 4%
    1950-1959 4%
    1940-1949 4%
    1900-1939 0%
    Conclusion: over half the greatest films ever made were made in the last ten years.
    [​IMG]
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    13-time NBA world champion Lakers: 1949, 1950, 1952, 1953, 1954, 1972, 1980, 1982, 1985, 1987, 1988, 2000, 2001
     
  11. Steve Christou

    Steve Christou Long Member

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    Yep I agree IMDB's top 25 has more great films than Empire's top 25, both lists missed out on '2001 A Space Odyssey' though.
    I don't have a problem with either list, since I have nearly all the films from both lists in my movie collection.
    I'd hate to see what some of HTF's movie snob elite would compile in their top 25, maybe one or two American films and the rest will seem like anagrams, ouch! [​IMG]
     
  12. William Ward

    William Ward Supporting Actor

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  13. SteveGon

    SteveGon Executive Producer

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    Gladiator!?! [​IMG]
    Geez, I thought the Brits had good taste!
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    -- Charles Frazier, Cold Mountain
     
  14. TheoGB

    TheoGB Screenwriter

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    Well lets see now, what does make a great movie? Oh yes, one I enjoy watching again and again. Well in that case I'd say any of those 25 seem good to me.
    Rain, are you suggesting Fight Club is *not* one of the 25 greatest movies ever made? Tut tut. What I find funnier are some of the movies you didn't seem to find objectionable:
    10)Pulp Fiction (1994)
    11)Raiders of the Lost Ark (1981)
    13)Jaws (1975)
    14)American Beauty (1999)
    21)Silence of the Lambs (1991)
    How Raiders or Jaws are in any way okay in a list but a Star Wars movie or Bladerunner is not I find intriguing. And Pulp Fiction is okay but The Usual Suspects is not? [​IMG]
    You don't appear to like Ridley Scott at all...
    Frankly you will always be more likely to get newer movies in peoples lists rather than older ones - it's true of albums. New stuff comes in and you like it and after a while you maybe get bored again - fair enough.
    I would object just as much to people who feel that there was a golden age of cinema (usually when black actors were unknown and women were merely objects!!) and that now everything is crap.
    Theo
     
  15. Ike

    Ike Screenwriter

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    Theo,
    It's safe to say of course there will be cultural advancements, but does that discourage the brilliance of some films? I mean, "Citizen Kane" only has blacks in scenes as waiters or singers, and the women aren't exactly flattering (though I'm sure I could argue that they are; that Susan was a bad singer, but that's not what she wanted, and instead indulged Kane, but I digress), but it is still one of the greatest films of all time.
    Why I am more inclined not to litter my personal favorites film lists with more recent fair is you've got to give it time. It may agree with today's time, but it may not hold up. I like Fight Club-wouldn't call it one of the 25 greatest films ever, but did like it-but really, is it going to hold up 30/20/10/5 years? It's satire-something that rarely holds up. So when something is still sharp after 20 or 30 years, say Dr. Strangelove or Network, then it's impressive. If we look back at Fight Club in 10 of 20 years, and go, "That is still as good, if not better, than when it was released," then I'd say it deserves a spot in the top 50.
    If someone was so inclined, you'd also see that the majority of films of both lists have made a gaggle of money-that's expected. The more people vote, the more likelihood they've seen less obscure films unless you poll a very distinct group of people.
    That's why these lists don't pan out. It's better, if you are going to make a list as such, to ask a group of people who are very knowledgeable, but maybe in the minority (The Sight and Sound list), or allowing a forum such as this, where people can post their own lists. I'm not one that says good lists serve no purposes (I learned a lot from the S&S list), but these lists of American blockbusters don't really seem to serve a purpose-they aren't really the greatest films ever, but instead the greatest most seen films in our country.
    [Edited last by Ike on September 29, 2001 at 03:03 PM]
     
  16. Rain

    Rain Producer

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  17. TheoGB

    TheoGB Screenwriter

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    I presumed the ones you didn't single out would make your top 25.
    Ike, I'm not saying there aren't classic movies from years ago. Of course there are and they don't need to be colour.
    What I find bizarre is the way people continually act like Star Wars and many similar movies don't deserve to be in these lists - often as if being popular isn't good enough after a certain year.
    SW is now almost 25 years old and shows no sign of dropping of any lists of popular movies, hence I would argue that it is definitively a great movie. If it was a nothing picture that appeared at the 'right time' then every one-off sci-fi space opera would have had the same effect. But watch the pilot Battlestar Galactica and it's easy to see why it's nowhere.
    I would argue that sheer popularity (not box-office takings but over time, movies that people vote in like these) marks a movie out. I don't think this list would be anyone's natural top 25 but it's not a *bad* top 25 by any means and particularly not because it fails to have Citizen Kane in or a Kubrick movie, for example.
    To suggest that a movie can only be judged great after a set number of years is somewhat pointless because movies are probably, more than books and music, a product of their time. CK will always have 60ish years over any movie made today and if it remains popular because it is good (and not because we are *told* it is good) then you will always be able to say that later movies cannot be considered classics of the same stature.
    What if in 10 years time people are not impressed by Kane? Maybe the majority of people are not impressed by it now. But then again it's much easier to adopt a reactionary position of dismissal of new ideas, etc.
     
  18. Steve Christou

    Steve Christou Long Member

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    Looking at both lists, the only film I don't have in Empire's list is 'Breakfast at Tiffany's' and in IMDB's list 'Memento' which I still haven't got round to seeing.
    It's easy to get snobbish over Empire's list, I think its a valid list because its mr.average filmgoer who voted, the more discerning movie fan would have more golden oldies in the top 25, and there are no crap films in that list in my opinion, my personal top 25 would consist mostly of pre-80's films with only 3 or 4 from 1980 to the present.
     
  19. brentl

    brentl Cinematographer

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    i'VE Got 8 that would be on my list.
    LL cool B
    "Best" film ...come on now!
     
  20. Scott_MacD

    Scott_MacD Supporting Actor

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    Please, I cringe whenever I see Star Wars in a top 5 of a Best Movies ever list, especially a halfway decent movie mag like Empire.. Sigh, J6P enters into a good read now.
    Then again, Empire only allowed the readers to choose 3 movies to be allowed in the poll. I didn't enter for this reason, I'd need around 15-20 places, as I'm sure most of the members here would too.
     

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