Elite 45TX vs. Sony STR-DA2000ES vs. HK 525

Discussion in 'AV Receivers' started by Mike Baldwin, Nov 1, 2003.

  1. Mike Baldwin

    Mike Baldwin Stunt Coordinator

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    Just thinking about those two right now, also considering the HK 525. I think that the HK might have the best sound from what I hear from the forum. I really like the usb port option on the elite. Thou it runs a little higher on price too. That would be my max prob on a budget. Can the sony compete with the other two. I really don't hear much about them on the forum. I will most likely buy off the internet to save money. This way i can afford a nice DVD player too. Thanks

    Mike
     
  2. ChrisLazarko

    ChrisLazarko Supporting Actor

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    The 2000ES isn't a bad piece but i've had very hard times with Sony and stay away from nearly all there products.

    The Pioneer is very nice as well as the HK. My personal vote goes to the HK. I am somewhat biased towards HK when people ask and my main reason for standing behind them is they take pride in there product and when there is a problem they don't put up a fuss, they just fix it. The units sound unbelieveable, they look unbelieveable, and the amps they put in them are very good.

    Good thing also is that HK is phasing out the x25 line and now coming out with there x30 line so they x25 line is cheap than ever before!
     
  3. jad

    jad Agent

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    All depends on your musical tastes and room acoustics.
    HK has a warm sound with a full midrange and somewhat forward presentation that might tame a somewhat bright setup. The Sony is fairly neutral with a more laid back perspective erring slightly on the bright or lean side. In my setup it seems the lower midrange needs to be fleshed out a little more but I'm still tweaking. The sound however is more transparent and involving overall with a more tuneful bass.
     
  4. Stephen Hopkins

    Stephen Hopkins HW Reviewer
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    Jad, i think you're confusing words... Bright and forward are the same thing... and warm and laid back are the same thing...

    Bright = Forward
    Warm = Laid Back
     
  5. Mike Baldwin

    Mike Baldwin Stunt Coordinator

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    My current speakers are Paradigm Cinema 70's. They arn't the best but they do the job. The Elite I figured would be a little overkill but these speakers are just to hold me over. I don't wnat to get a receiver that are good for these speakers then would not be enough for some floor standers. The HK has a modest power rating at only 55 watts/channel right. The Paradigms are rated at 70 max so I think that to be appriopiate. Would the sony 1000ES be a better suiter then the 2000? If I went HK then decided to go to 7.1 what kinda of external amp would blend well with the HK processor? Thanks for the advice!!!!

    mike
     
  6. Stephen Hopkins

    Stephen Hopkins HW Reviewer
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    The HK 525 is rated 70w x 7, so no need extra amp for 7.1. The HKs are also conservativly rated for power, most times actually producing more than the rating. Either way, the HK525 and Elite 45TX (or 43TX) would be in the same realm. The 3000ES would probably be a more reasonable comparrison but it's a new model so you won't find it as deeply discounted.

    If you like the 45TX but the price is pushing you away, consider the 43TX. They are the exact same receiver except the 43TX doesn't have the automatic calibration, USB port, or RS-232 port. Amplifier and proccessing are exactly the same.

    These receivers are all extremely close so the best thing to do would probably be to see which has the features and ergonomics you like the best and go w/ that one. Speakers dictate sound characteristics 10 times more than electronics.

    Good luck [​IMG]
     
  7. jad

    jad Agent

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  8. Stephen Hopkins

    Stephen Hopkins HW Reviewer
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    Many times the word forward is used to describe bright and laid back is used to describe warm. Forward and laid back can also be used to describe soundstaging which is how you were using them, but your sentence structure lead me to beleive you were confusing the meanings, not reffering seperatly to sound color and sound stage.
     
  9. Cahyo Wicaksono

    Cahyo Wicaksono Stunt Coordinator

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    AFAIK the 43TX doesn't have phono input and the remote is also much worse. Of course this is only from memory.

    I only auditioned 43TX vs 45TX vs 2000ES. I don't like the 2000ES sound at all, too tinny. 45TX Auto MCACC is much more accurate than 43TX Manual MCACC (I tested them by using frequency sweeps, recorded by an spectrum analyzer).

    IMO the 43TX is not worth the money, but the 45TX is.

    I don't know about HK, based on FutureShop record, there are more HK receivers returns and break-downs than any other receivers they sell in the GTA.
     
  10. Stephen Hopkins

    Stephen Hopkins HW Reviewer
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    The 43TX MCACC can be very accurate if you spend a little time working with it. It's not as convinient as the 45TX but most enthusiasts don't mind spending an hour or two tweeking. The remote is not bad, just lacks the LCD screen and has a slightly different layout.

    For the price difference in the 43TX (both at retail and now) the 43TX is a much better bargain in my opinion. People are finding the 43TX as low as $400 (i payed $500 a few months ago) and the 45TX is still fetching $600 - $700 if you can find it. $200 for a remote w/ a very small LCD and automatic calibration isn't worth it to me, especially having owned a Pronto for over a year and not being affraid to use the SPL meter to tweek things myself. That $200 represented a new DVD player to me which was a much more noticable improvement than the auto-calibration or slightly better remote would be.
     
  11. David Judah

    David Judah Screenwriter

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    If you decide on the Elite, I recommend the 45TX. The equalizer settings would be very difficult to get right manually and there are some internal differences that are only apparent in the service manual(not listed in the published specs). They're not huge differences, but enough IMO, to warrant the extra couple hundred dollars.

    DJ
     
  12. Stephen Hopkins

    Stephen Hopkins HW Reviewer
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    The manual MCACC is not dificult at all. It's simply test tones at different frequencies that you level adjust just like you were balancing your speakers... 5 bands for the center, left surround, and right surround setting each to match the mains.

    As for the un-published differences, would you care to elaborate David?
     
  13. David Judah

    David Judah Screenwriter

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    Well, I consider a press of a button versus running 25 different sets of tones more difficult, but of course that's my definition. I respect your willingness to tweak; I like to do that too. [​IMG] Also, that only mimics one mode on the 45TX(the "Front Align" mode which sets the equalizer based on the Fronts channels). There is also on the 45 an "All Channel Adjust" mode which sets each channel independently.

    In addition, there is the Air Studios Sound Tuning which is layered along with the MCACC on the 45 for an extra bit of refinement that is absent on the 43.

    If you get a hold of the service manual for the 45 & 43TX, there is a contrast of the part differences. Besides the ones that are added on the 45 for its additional features, there are many upgraded parts that the 43 doesn't have.

    Again, IMO, it is worth the extra money, but that doesn't mean the 43TX is not a great receiver at its price point.

    DJ
     
  14. Cahyo Wicaksono

    Cahyo Wicaksono Stunt Coordinator

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    1. If you're not the type that keeps experimenting with speaker positions, speaker models etc, manual MCACC maybe not too difficult to do (although I refuse to spend 20 minutes calibrating when I can just press a button).

    2. Even after careful calibration, frequency response created by manual MCACC is FAR LESS ACCURATE than by using Auto MCACC. This is not a placebo effect. Like I mentioned earlier, the difference was tested using a professional spectrum analyzer.
     
  15. Doug Brewster

    Doug Brewster Second Unit

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    "Many times the word forward is used to describe bright and laid back is used to describe warm. Forward and laid back can also be used to describe soundstaging which is how you were using them, but your sentence structure lead me to beleive you were confusing the meanings, not reffering seperatly to sound color and sound stage."

    Well put (despite being poorly spelled). Additionally, I'd never before seen these terms in reference to soundstage, but always in reference to tonality and color.

    "I don't know about HK, based on FutureShop record, there are more HK receivers returns and break-downs than any other receivers they sell in the GTA."

    I have had 3 and 2 of them developed problems (one damaged in shipping), but I just haven't heard anything that sounds as good so I keep trying.
     
  16. Cahyo Wicaksono

    Cahyo Wicaksono Stunt Coordinator

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    Well, I actually was given the info by Future Shop as a corporation, not from one store only. This is based on their sales record vs their return/exchange record.
     
  17. ToddP

    ToddP Stunt Coordinator

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