Early Edition- Stalled?!

bmasters9

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The packaging is shit... a wallet you slip the discs into inside a box.
Same as the Cannon release that I have; the way around it (and this is what has worked for me with that Cannon release) is to get white disc sleeves, take the discs out of that wallet, put the discs in the sleeves, stack the discs and sleeves in that recessed area inside, and dispense with the wallet. You might have to sift through all the envelopes to find the disc you're on, but at least you're not risking scratches by having the discs in that wallet all the time and taking them out and putting them back. Try that and tell me what you think.
 
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TVonDVDJunkie05

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Thanks for the updates The Obsolete Man.

I think I will stay with the CBS releases, it looks like s3 & 4 contain edited episodes which I detest. I can live with music edits (depending on the show) but edited episodes are unacceptable (unless uncut versions do not exist for some reason).

So blame CBS just as much. They're the ones who are always quick with a syndication edit, hack music out wholesale without even trying to clear it or even finding out if it's public domain and can be used without paying, and generally make a mess of anything that doesn't have the word "Trek" in the title. And even then...
Spot on with this assessment, most of the blame for these shoddy releases rests with CBS NOT VEI IMO, for the reasons you have specified. It looks to me that if CBS has abandoned a show then they don't bother doing anything with it and if a third party (like VEI) wants to acquire the rights to the show they just give them whatever shoddy prints the have. VEI is a budget outfit like Mill Creek, they don't have tons of cash to spend on remastering or securing music rights- they just release what they are given. Having said that though, they should at the very least (if they don't) ensure that the prints they are given contain the uncut versions of the episodes for whatever series they are releasing.
 

gemad

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Now, now...

VEI has very low standards, it's true. But they're a company that takes what they're given. Garbage in, garbage out.

So blame CBS just as much. They're the ones who are always quick with a syndication edit, hack music out wholesale without even trying to clear it or even finding out if it's public domain and can be used without paying, and generally make a mess of anything that doesn't have the word "Trek" in the title. And even then...
i hate cbs as well. but what is, is. i'm over it now.
 

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Spot on with this assessment, most of the blame for these shoddy releases rests with CBS NOT VEI IMO, for the reasons you have specified.
For the most part.

The only issue I would hold VEI being solely responsible, is their shoddy disc quality control of their many sets over the years. Basically too many defective discs with unreadable bad sectors due to shoddy disc manufacturing.

Though in more recent times, their disc quality control got slightly better. I have encountered less defective discs in their sets which were manufactured more recently.
 

The Obsolete Man

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Here's something odd...

I dug out the CBS sets. There is about a 10 second difference in episode runtime on the season 1 episodes, CBS being the one with the slightly longer run times. They do match up otherwise, except that slight difference. So, going by the CBS disc runtime, I'm guessing the later discs with episodes over and around 44 are essentially uncut (music aside), and the show just had some weirdly fluctuating run times between 44 and 46 minutes, since no one ever said the old CBS discs included cut episodes.

The ones in the 42s and maybe low 43s probably do have cuts. But 44 seems to be the magic number and a lot of the episodes in those two final seasons are close.

In the end, all I can say is "but dont take my word for it", since I'm just guessing and going by the times on the old CBS sets. But if they were running 44 minutes in 1996, 43:30 and above four years later wouldnt be out of line IMO.

Oh, and one final edit... seeing what the earlier seasons ran on the CBS discs, I feel better about the VEI set. I'm almost sure there are edits to the body of some episodes, most likely where music is concerned, but I'm also now pretty sure they didnt just hand off syndicated cut episodes for the last two seasons.
 
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The Obsolete Man

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One more plus for the VEI set...


As I'm sure we all know, there are some Hallmark channel rips of the show floating around out there in places we don't discuss.

Those versions of the episodes generally run in the 41s and 42s. So, unless the old Hallmark airings were timesped, the VEI discs have versions of the episodes that run longer than what we got in syndication.

As you may have seen, I'm not a VEI fan. I've been trying to rip this apart, but for the most part, its held up as far as episode runtimes go. Music will likely be another matter, but it really doesn't look like CBS provided syndication cuts for seasons 3 and 4. So if that's your hangup, maybe now you can feel a little better about that.
 

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As I'm sure we all know, there are some Hallmark channel rips of the show floating around out there in places we don't discuss.

Those versions of the episodes generally run in the 41s and 42s. So, unless the old Hallmark airings were timesped, the VEI discs have versions of the episodes that run longer than what we got in syndication.
Actually, I think that the Hallmark rips are time-compressed. I recall someone showing an episode from them and noticing the high-pitch. I believe that they were recorded in a PAL territory. Perhaps my memory is fuzzy, as that was many years ago and I do not have copies to check against (I only have my own personal recordings from the PAX channel). This is not to say that the VEI set wouldn't still be a huge step up from lower resolution, time-compressed, high-pitch, low bitrate, recordings! Just trying to note that if syndication edits were done to the show, it might not have been that drastic in length changes.

On an unrelated note, does anyone know if this set is being sold anywhere other than VEI's website?
 

The Obsolete Man

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Actually, I think that the Hallmark rips are time-compressed. I recall someone showing an episode from them and noticing the high-pitch. I believe that they were recorded in a PAL territory. Perhaps my memory is fuzzy, as that was many years ago and I do not have copies to check against (I only have my own personal recordings from the PAX channel). This is not to say that the VEI set wouldn't still be a huge step up from lower resolution, time-compressed, high-pitch, low bitrate, recordings! Just trying to note that if syndication edits were done to the show, it might not have been that drastic in length changes.

On an unrelated note, does anyone know if this set is being sold anywhere other than VEI's website?
Do you have an easy way to time some of those Pax episodes?

And would Pax have been airing syndicated versions anyway? IIRC, they weren't heavy on advertisers.
 

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Do you have an easy way to time some of those Pax episodes?

And would Pax have been airing syndicated versions anyway? IIRC, they weren't heavy on advertisers.
So I have some answers for you:

Season 1 & 2 from CBS DVDs (may not be exact matches)

EE 101 Pilot - (44:32)
EE 102 The Choice - (44:20)
EE 103 Baby - (44:41)
EE 104 The Paper - (44:08)
EE 105 Thief Swipes Mayor's Dog - (44:12)
EE 106 Hoops - (46:09)
EE 107 After Midnight - (44:32)
EE 108 Gun - (46:06)
EE 109 His Girl Thursday - (45:46)
EE 110 The Wrong Man - (44:56)
EE 111 Christmas - (44:26)
EE 112 Frostbit - (45:02)
EE 113 Mob Wife - (44:50)
EE 114 The Wall, Part 1 - (45:04)
EE 115 The Wall, Part 2 - (43:00)
EE 116 Bat Masterson - (44:25)
EE 117 The Jury - (45:42)
EE 118 Psychic - (46:18)
EE 119 The Cat - (45:10)
EE 120 Phantom at the Opera - (45:55)
EE 121 Faith - (44:24)
EE 122 Dad - (44:25)
EE 123 Love is Blind - (44:17)
EE 201 Home - (46:15)
EE 202 The Medal - (44:22)
EE 203 The Wedding - (46:06)
EE 204 Jenny Sloane - (46:01)
EE 205 Downsized - (44:13)
EE 206 Angels and Devils - (45:54)
EE 207 Redfellas - (44:21)
EE 208 March in Time - (44:17)
EE 209 A Regular Joe - (46:15)
EE 210 A Bris is Just a Bris - (45:49)
EE 211 A Minor Miracle - (46:15)
EE 212 Romancing the Throne - (46:12)
EE 213 Walk, Don't Run - (45:05)
EE 214 The Return of Crumb - (44:37)
EE 215 Mum's the Word - (46:11)
EE 216 Where or When - (46:06)
EE 217 The Fourth Carpathian - (46:03)
EE 218 The Quality of Mercy - (45:04)
EE 219 Show Me the Monet - (46:08)
EE 220 Don't Walk Away, Renee - (46:18)
EE 221 Hot Time in the Old Town 1 Regular Ending - (45:30)
EE 222 Second Sight - (46:14)

And here are the runtimes for the PAX airings:

Seasons 3 & 4 from PAX airings

EE 301 Blackout - (43:35)
EE 302 Collision - (43:33)
EE 303 A Horse Is a Horse - (43:31)
EE 304 Lt. Hobson, USN - (43:31)
EE 305 Saint Nick - (43:33)
EE 306 Halloween - (43:12)
EE 307 Up Chuck - (43:36)
EE 308 Deadline - (43:35)
EE 309 In Gary We Trust - (43:33)
EE 310 Nest Egg - (43:27)
EE 311 Teen Angels – (43:41) – Original CBS airing
EE 312 Slippity-Doo-Dah - (43:29)
EE 313 The Last Untouchable - (43:32)
EE 314 Just one of Those Things - (43:27)
EE 315 Funny Valentine - (43:33)
EE 316 Number One with a Bullet - (43:29)
EE 317 Two to Tangle - (43:21)
EE 318 Fate - (43:33)
EE 319 Crumb Again - (43:35)
EE 320 Pinch Hitters - (43:29)
EE 321 Home Groan - (43:37)
EE 322 Play It Again Sammo - (43:32)
EE 323 Blowing Us is Hard to Do - (43:34)
EE 401 The Out-of-Towner - (43:33)
EE 402 Duck Day Afternoon - (43:34)
EE 403 Take Me Out to the Ballgame - (43:33)
EE 404 The Iceman Taketh - (43:05)
EE 405 Camera Shy - (43:29)
EE 406 Wild Card – (43:43) – Original CBS airing
EE 407 Fatal Edition, Part 1 - (43:35)
EE 408 Fatal Edition, Part 2 - (43:32)
EE 409 Weathergirl - (43:32)
EE 410 Run, Gary, Run - (43:05)
EE 411 Rose - (43:34)
EE 412 Snow Angels - (43:27)
EE 413 Gifted - (43:33)
EE 414 Performance Anxiety - (43:31)
EE 415 False Witness - (42:38)
EE 416 The Play's The Thing - (43:42)
EE 417 Blind Faith - (42:54)
EE 418 Occasionally Amber - (43:30)
EE 419 Mel Schwartz, Bounty Hunter – (43:28) – Original CBS airing
EE 420 Time - (43:19)
EE 421 Everybody Goes to Rick's - (43:34)
EE 422 Luck o' the Irish - (43:22)

At first, this looks like the PAX airings were syndicated cuts. Note, however, the length for episodes 311, 406, and 419. These were from original CBS broadcasts (PAX did not air those episodes for various reasons, likely moral objects to content) and so we have comparisons to the original lengths for episodes within the same seasons. It appears that seasons 1-2 episodes ranged from 44:00 to 46:00+, but seasons 3-4 were more closely targeting a 43:30 goal (with some variations). I cannot guarantee that the PAX episodes are uncut in length.

Update: Found some additional recordings. The PAX airings of 101 were 43:40, 221 were 43:33, and 222 were 43:49, so they did air cut episodes for seasons 1-2. We cannot trust their episode lengths for seasons 3-4, but the CBS original airing lengths that I reported for three S3-4 episodes are still informative.
 
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Friendsfa32

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i checked my Hallmark episodes, and although most episodes are shorter in length, with season 4 episodes going as far down as the 41 min mark for certain episodes, season 3 stays mostly around 42:40 ish (so roughly a min. shorter)
but there are some episodes that are longer than the ones on the list above....

306 Halloween = 43:43
310 Nest Egg = 43:46
316 Number One with a Bullet = 43:37

if someone could check the runtime for the VEI set on season 3 and 4, we could easily see how much has been edited (or not)
 

The Obsolete Man

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With your painstaking work, I could do no less. Plus, you did all the typing for me.

EE 301 Blackout - PAX (43:35) VEI (45:26)
EE 302 Collision - PAX (43:33) VEI (44:07)
EE 303 A Horse Is a Horse - PAX (43:31) VEI (44:13)
EE 304 Lt. Hobson, USN - PAX (43:31) VEI (44:05)
EE 305 Saint Nick - PAX (43:33) VEI (44:18)
EE 306 Halloween - PAX (43:12) VEI (45:22)
EE 307 Up Chuck - PAX (43:36) VEI (44:13)
EE 308 Deadline - PAX (43:35) VEI (44:15)
EE 309 In Gary We Trust - PAX (43:33) VEI (44:05)
EE 310 Nest Egg - (43:27) VEI (45:34)
EE 311 Teen Angels – Original CBS airing (43:41) VEI (43:33)
EE 312 Slippity-Doo-Dah - PAX (43:29) VEI (43:12)
EE 313 The Last Untouchable - PAX (43:32) VEI (44:49)
EE 314 Just one of Those Things - PAX (43:27) VEI (44:06)
EE 315 Funny Valentine - PAX (43:33) VEI (44:44)
EE 316 Number One with a Bullet - PAX (43:29) VEI (45:12)
EE 317 Two to Tangle - PAX (43:21) VEI (43:53)
EE 318 Fate - PAX (43:33) VEI (45:05)
EE 319 Crumb Again - PAX (43:35) VEI (44:48)
EE 320 Pinch Hitters - PAX (43:29) VEI (43:42)
EE 321 Home Groan - PAX (43:37) VEI (43:49)
EE 322 Play It Again Sammo - PAX (43:32) VEI (44:34)
EE 323 Blowing Us is Hard to Do - PAX (43:34) VEI (44:34)


EE 401 The Out-of-Towner - PAX (43:33) VEI (44:48)
EE 402 Duck Day Afternoon - PAX (43:34) VEI (44:54)
EE 403 Take Me Out to the Ballgame - PAX (43:33) VEI (44:29)
EE 404 The Iceman Taketh - PAX (43:05) VEI (42:53)
EE 405 Camera Shy - PAX (43:29) VEI (43:35)
EE 406 Wild Card – Original CBS airing (43:43) VEI (43:08)
EE 407 Fatal Edition, Part 1 - PAX (43:35) VEI (44:54)
EE 408 Fatal Edition, Part 2 - PAX (43:32) VEI (43:07)
EE 409 Weathergirl - PAX (43:32) VEI (43:08)
EE 410 Run, Gary, Run - PAX (43:05) VEI (43:05)
EE 411 Rose - PAX (43:34) VEI (44:55)
EE 412 Snow Angels - PAX (43:27) VEI (44:08)
EE 413 Gifted - PAX (43:33) VEI (43:37)
EE 414 Performance Anxiety - PAX (43:31) VEI (43:24)
EE 415 False Witness - PAX (42:38) VEI (42:34)
EE 416 The Play's The Thing - PAX (43:42) VEI (43:49)
EE 417 Blind Faith - PAX (42:54) VEI (43:09)
EE 418 Occasionally Amber - PAX (43:30) VEI (43:07)
EE 419 Mel Schwartz, Bounty Hunter – Original CBS airing (43:28) VEI (43:54)
EE 420 Time - PAX (43:19) VEI (43:25)
EE 421 Everybody Goes to Rick's - PAX (43:34) VEI (44:17)
EE 422 Luck o' the Irish - PAX (43:22) VEI (43:28)

Alright, so, VEI's versions generally match or surpass the Pax versions, and even the few original CBS versions, with a few exceptions.

And, for that era with an 8 PM show, 43-44 minutes wasn't unheard of as a runtime, considering the sitcoms were at 21:30 to 22:30 by that point.

One notable exception, 312, Slippity Doo Dah, was one of those music heavy shows, so I'm betting there are music cuts in there making it shorter.

Seasons 1 and 2 for VEI have a 10 or 15 second difference in runtimes, with CBS being longer.
 
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Ron1973

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Actually, I think that the Hallmark rips are time-compressed. I recall someone showing an episode from them and noticing the high-pitch. I believe that they were recorded in a PAL territory. Perhaps my memory is fuzzy, as that was many years ago and I do not have copies to check against (I only have my own personal recordings from the PAX channel). This is not to say that the VEI set wouldn't still be a huge step up from lower resolution, time-compressed, high-pitch, low bitrate, recordings! Just trying to note that if syndication edits were done to the show, it might not have been that drastic in length changes.

On an unrelated note, does anyone know if this set is being sold anywhere other than VEI's website?
I think Hallmark is bad at time compressing. I attempted to watch Little House on the Prairie one day, and Michael Landon sounded like he'd been sucking helium!
 
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bmasters9

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I think Hallmark is bad at time compressing. I attempted to watch Little House on the Prairie one day, and Michael Landon sounded like he'd been sucking helium!
IINM, that has been a common complaint with the original Imavision seasonal releases of that 1974-83 NBC family series.
 

WhitneyG

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Thank you, Obsolete Man! This was very helpful!

Alright, so, VEI's versions generally match or surpass the Pax versions, and even the few original CBS versions, with a few exceptions.
I should note a couple things about the runtimes that I provided. For the CBS ones, they do not include the next-episode preview and the end-credits run 25 seconds. Also, I was incorrect earlier about PAX not airing 419; they did, but weather prevented me from capturing the full episode when it aired and my recording is about 10% PAX and 90% CBS. The PAX recordings also have 25 seconds for the end-credits (obviously no next-episode preview for them either). I'm not sure if that accounts for any of the difference. I can't imagine that the VEI releases are more complete than the CBS airings (looking at you, 419), though black-time for commercial breaks and slightly different end credit lengths could account for a few seconds difference. It's also possible that the PAX airing was cut and it just happened to be from the part of the episode that I captured from PAX (the first 3:40).

In any case, it seems pretty clear to me that the VEI release is probably not cut for time in the vast majority, if not all, of the episodes, but there might be a few small cuts to eliminate music. I will definitely be purchasing this set, though that might not be for a few weeks, so I probably won't be the first to start checking for music. Looks like we'll need to check each episode to be sure. I suspect that if the music is intact, we can be confident that those episodes are intact (Time Has Come Today, aside, of course). I wish that we had the runtimes for all of the original airings, but sadly I (foolishly) discarded most of my VHS recordings after getting better quality recordings off PAX.
 
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Garysb

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Early Edition is one of the series being broadcast on the new channel replacing Decades on CBS O & O beginning tomorrow. 3 episodes a day overnight 2 AM to 5AM on East Coast.
 

The Obsolete Man

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Alright, into season 3 after watching the CBS released sessions since before the VEI set got here.

PQ is on par with the CBS sets... maybe even a bit better. S2 of the CBS sets had 5 episodes on some discs, so 6 isn't too much of a stretch. So if you have the CBS sets for the first two seasons, season 3 isn't a major change. It's not a downgrade.

Also, there's virtually no black or dead space.between acts for the VEI episodes, which may explain the 10 second difference between the CBS and VEI versions of the episodes.

Period appropriate CBS Productions and KingWorld logos are there, though not always Columbia TriStar.
 

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