DVD-R vs. DVD+R

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by MarkHastings, Mar 4, 2003.

  1. MarkHastings

    MarkHastings Executive Producer

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2003
    Messages:
    12,013
    Likes Received:
    1
    I just went to Staples today to buy some more blank DVD's. Usually I get DVD-R's, but I also noticed DVD+R's. What's the difference? The price and packaging were exactly the same except for the following:

    On the Maxell ones, the only difference was that the DVD+R's said they are compatible with 2.4x burners whereas the DVD-R's are compatible with 2x burners.

    I also noticed that the DVD+R said it could contain up to 8 hours of video???? and the DVD-R said up to 6 hours??? But both were 4.7GB (Single Layer)

    What's the difference?
     
  2. Rob Gillespie

    Rob Gillespie Producer

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 1998
    Messages:
    3,632
    Likes Received:
    5
    It's just a slightly different writeable DVD format. A little big analogous to the VHS vs. Beta bullshit we had all those years ago. They're incompatible with each other (if you have a '-' burner you can't use '+' discs and vice versa.
     
  3. MarkHastings

    MarkHastings Executive Producer

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2003
    Messages:
    12,013
    Likes Received:
    1
    I just found out some info on DVD+R. It seems that they are a different beast than DVD-R's. Even though they use different burning methods, they both play the same in DVD players.

    Has anyone used the DVD+R's?


    EDIT: Rob, I just read your post. What advantage does the + have over the -?
     
  4. Patrick Larkin

    Patrick Larkin Screenwriter

    Joined:
    May 8, 2001
    Messages:
    1,759
    Likes Received:
    0
    I'm pretty sure that DVD-R will play in most any consumer DVD player sold thus far. (A reason Apple sticks with DVD-R).

    DVD+R will not play in a lot of consumer DVD players. If your object is to make a DVD and send it to grandma, then the safest bet is DVD-R.
     
  5. Wayne Bundrick

    Wayne Bundrick Cinematographer

    Joined:
    May 17, 1999
    Messages:
    2,358
    Likes Received:
    0
    The most comprehensive test I've seen is at dv.com. The test was made just before the DVD+R format hit the market. (HP and others starting shipping DVD+R/+RW drives when the DVD+R spec wasn't finished and only DVD+RW worked.) dv.com tested multiple brands of discs against dozens of DVD players.

    The test found that among the consumer formats, DVD-R was most compatible with players, but it was far from 100%. It passed only 65% of the tests. DVD-RW passed 58% of the tests and DVD+RW passed 56% of the tests.

    When they loosened the test criteria to include instances where a player passed some tests but failed others, DVD-R widened the gap, scoring 87% against 62% for DVD-RW and 58% for DVD+RW.

    When they limited the test to only players made in the past three years, the RW results were much improved. DVD-R had 93% compatibility, while DVD-RW had 89% and DVD+RW had 80%.

    90% of the players tested failed at least one of the tests.

    Given the similar results of DVD-RW and DVD+RW, I'd guess that DVD+R has almost but not more compatibility than DVD-R.
     
  6. MarkHastings

    MarkHastings Executive Producer

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2003
    Messages:
    12,013
    Likes Received:
    1
    Maxell has a white paper on DVD+R:
    http://www.maxell-data.com/techinfo/...+r_white.shtml

    They mention (in comparing DVD-R to DVD+R) that
     
  7. Robert McDonald

    Robert McDonald Stunt Coordinator

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 1999
    Messages:
    134
    Likes Received:
    0
    Mark, there are major format wars going on. -R was developed by the DVD Forum; +R was developed later by other companies, some of which are part of the DVD Forum. It does use a different method of burning.

    I believe the compatibility rates are steadily increasing, especially with newer dvd players.

    For your reading pleasure:
    DVDplusrw.org (pro +R webpage, but interesting discussions in the forum pages)


    dv-info.net (not as much info but I believe it is run by a -R enthusiast)

    dvd-recordable.org (misc. info)

    Microsoft has apparently joined the +RW side, and certain computer manufacturers, including Dell, only ship with +RW, I believe.

    Happy reading [​IMG]
     
  8. DarrenH

    DarrenH Agent

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2003
    Messages:
    37
    Likes Received:
    0
  9. Brian Ruth

    Brian Ruth Supporting Actor

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2002
    Messages:
    563
    Likes Received:
    0
    Mark:

    You're stirring up a hornets nest here, but I'll do my best to summarize.

    The + format is, as Rob mentioned, developed by a different set of companies than the - format.

    I believe that Pioneer, Panasonic, ; while HP, Phillips, and Sony developed the +R format. Sony seems to be hedgeing its bets, as it is now developing drives that write to both formats.

    As for quality, I think they are just about the same. I'd give a SLIGHT edge to the - format, since its been out a bit longer and since it has more units shipped. Fundamentally, though, I don't think there's any large advantage of one format over the other.

    You MAY be able to put 8 hours of video onto the 4.7 GB disc, but the resultant quality would be quite a bit lower than what you have now. It would be squeezing more video onto the same disc size, which would give you something close to VHS quality (or VCD quality). If you want DVD-quality video, you should record somewhere between 4 and 8 Mbps.
     
  10. Greg*go

    Greg*go Supporting Actor

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2002
    Messages:
    941
    Likes Received:
    0
    I just helped a buddy do some research about this, and came to the conclusion that they are both fine formats. The major difference is cost, and whether your dvd player can play those discs. Unlike DVD-A vs. SACD, it is not a life changing decision (j/k [​IMG] ). Before you buy a dvd burner check if the format it uses is compatible with the dvd players in your house. A lot of newer models support both. The prices for +RW burners vs. -RW burners are very close. The price of the media is another story. DVD-R and DVD-RW are much cheaper. Just make sure that particular brand of media burns with your burner and plays on your players.

    Here's a link to DVDRhelp.com explaining it a bit better. http://www.dvdrhelp.com/dvd

    from the link...
     
  11. Brian Ruth

    Brian Ruth Supporting Actor

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2002
    Messages:
    563
    Likes Received:
    0


    Are they trying to bring LaserDiscs back from the dead or something?? [​IMG]
     
  12. Greg*go

    Greg*go Supporting Actor

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2002
    Messages:
    941
    Likes Received:
    0
    Well, I discovered what "Lossless linking" does at iMac's site...
    this is a pdf


    I think this link to Phillips explains it a bit better. Lossless linking deals with VBR...

    DVD+RW: Lossless linking

    quote from Phillips:
     
  13. Wayne Bundrick

    Wayne Bundrick Cinematographer

    Joined:
    May 17, 1999
    Messages:
    2,358
    Likes Received:
    0
    +RW can't hold more info than -RW. They're both 4.7 billion bytes. Disregard anything you see about how much recording time each one will hold. Recording time is entirely dependent on the quality level and the quality level has nothing to do with the type of disc.
     
  14. MarkHastings

    MarkHastings Executive Producer

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2003
    Messages:
    12,013
    Likes Received:
    1
     
  15. Max Leung

    Max Leung Producer

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2000
    Messages:
    4,611
    Likes Received:
    0
    What is infuriating is that some set-top-box DVD players won't play certain brands of DVD-R but will play DVD+Rs, and vice versa.

    A coworker has a Toshiba 1200 DVD player. It reads 2x Princo DVD-R discs fine, but chokes on 2.4x TDK DVD+Rs (my favorite because costco carries them for $5 CDN a pop, while the princos are almost double in price). Another coworker's player can't read the Princos, but reads the DVD+R discs fine. Grrrrrr. Naturally, he doesn't know what brand of DVD player he has.

    Right now, DVD+RWs are almost as cheap as the DVD+Rs. I can get a 4 pack of HP DVD+RWs for $7 CDN a piece. Cheaper than the damn DVD-Rs, which are $8 and higher!

    Anyone else have the problem with DVD-R/RW discs being massively overpriced compared to DVD+R/RWs when buying locally?
     
  16. Rob Gillespie

    Rob Gillespie Producer

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 1998
    Messages:
    3,632
    Likes Received:
    5
    Nope, the + variety are more expensive over here.
     
  17. MarkHastings

    MarkHastings Executive Producer

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2003
    Messages:
    12,013
    Likes Received:
    1
     
  18. Ken Chan

    Ken Chan Producer

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 1999
    Messages:
    3,301
    Likes Received:
    0
     
  19. Patrick Larkin

    Patrick Larkin Screenwriter

    Joined:
    May 8, 2001
    Messages:
    1,759
    Likes Received:
    0
     
  20. MarkHastings

    MarkHastings Executive Producer

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2003
    Messages:
    12,013
    Likes Received:
    1
     

Share This Page