DVD Audio and SACD comparions

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by Sutjahjo Ngaserin, Mar 6, 2002.

  1. Sutjahjo Ngaserin

    Sutjahjo Ngaserin Stunt Coordinator

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    I have been spending a lot of time listening to both DVD-Audio and Multichannel SACD in the last 2 weeks. and I am more than happy to say that both formats presents an obvious and significant improvements over normal Audio CD or any variations of CD like HDCD or XRCD
    I was exposed to DVD Audio earlier using Toshiba SD9200 connected to Denon AVC-A1SE (equivalent to 5800 in US) to 6
    identical B&W SNT-CNT speakers (only 5 used in the case of DVD-Audio) and Sunfire Subwoofer.
    Recently I have the chance to play with Pioneer DV-S733A (equivalent to 47A in US and 747A in Europe) DVD Audio and
    multichannel SACD players and I have been asking every help I can get, to collect the maximum number of software I can find on both formats.
    and here is the softwares I have tried listening to:
    Multichannel SACD
    Jacintha - Lush Life
    Ginuwine - The Life
    Earth Wind and Fire - Gratitude
    Billy Joel - The Stranger
    Billy Joel - 42nd. Street
    Chrisy Baron -Steppin'
    Jeff Beck - Blow by Blow
    Steve Tyrell -Standard Time
    Roger Waters - In the Flesh
    Charlotte Church -Enchantment
    James Taylor - Hour Glass
    Sony SACD Two-Channel and Multichannel demonstration disc
    Joe Beck & Aly Ryerson -Django
    Chris Botti - Night Sessions
    The Isley Brother - 3+3 featuring that lady
    Alice in Chains - Greatest Hits
    Ana Caram - Blue Bossa
    Hacken Lee - Live
    Celine - All the way, a decade of Songs
    DVD-Audio
    Christy Byron -Steppin'
    Fleetwood Mac -Rumours
    Alice Cooper - Welcome to my Nightmare
    Alice Cooper - Billion Dollar Babies
    Toy Matinee - Toy Matinee
    Dave Koz - The Dance
    Al Green - Greatest Hits
    George Benson - Breezin
    Miss E - So Addictive
    Foreigner - Foreigner
    Foreigner - 4
    Carly Simon - No Secret
    Joni Mitchel - Both Sides Now
    Bird3 - Bird 3
    America - Homecoming
    Eric Clapton - Reptile
    Eric Clapton - Riding with the King
    Eagles - Hotel California.
    Deep Purple - Machine Head
    Inside the Music, New Wave
    Inside the Music, Classic Country
    Rambient - So Many Worlds
    Inside the Music,Women on Top
    Natalie Merchant - Tigerlily
    Neil Young, Friends & Relatives - Road Rock
    K.D. Lang - Invincible Summer
    Stone Temple Pilots - Stone Temple Pilots
    Aaron Neville - Devotion
    Take 6 - Doo Bee Doo Wop Bop
    Larisa Stow - Moment by Moment
    Willie Nelson - Night and Day
    Emerson, Lake & Palmer - Brain Salad Surgery
    Studio Voodoo
    Barenaked Ladies - Maroon
    olivia - One woman's Live Journey
    Glen Phillips - Abulum
    Steely Dan - Two against nature
    David Alan - Live Music
    Paul Gilbert - Aligator Farm
    Steve Stevens - Flamenco Agogo
    Luis Miguel - Romances
    DV-S733A is connected to AVC-A1SE by the 6 RCA cables (analogue out in player and analogue in in amp), speakers are 6 Blueroom Minipods (only 5 used in both formats) and a Sunfire Subwoofer in a small bedroom with good acoustics.
    DVD Audios are impressive in its immediate expansive sounds and wide dynamic range. In many pop recordings like
    Eagles' Hotel California or the 2 Eric Claptons Albums, it has very tight impressive sounds with a lot of amazing details that we have not heard elsewhere.
    My general impressions are that good SACD are extremely lush, warm, smooth and sweet, making a generally mid-end
    system like this sounds high-end without paying the exhorbitant entrance fee. Nothing sounds smoother and more
    realistic than Jacintha's Lush Life, James Taylor's Hourglass or Hacken Lee's Life (3 best recorded SACD, in my opinion). The good tonal qualities of SACD however lacks the required dynamic ranges. In most of the Pop recording, e.g. Alice in Chains (well recorded) or 2 Billy Joel's albums, or Roger Water's In the Flesh (and other SACD), In most SACD the dynamic range felt compressed. while SACD can sounds very good, no albums can be as impressive as the Eagles and Eric Clapton's DVD Audio's detail (I am well aware of SACD's specification of better dynamic range, especially to the sky high frequencies).
    The respecitve strengths of both formats become obvious when Christy Byron's Steppin' DVD-Audio and SACD are tried
    in the 733A, with the SACD sounding warmer and smoother while (DVDA) with more tonal details and better dynamic range in the DVD Audio version(my Car DVD-Audio shows Chrysty Byron DVD-Audio as a 24bit/48Khz recording, even when the 96Khz track is chosen)
    Personally, I think both formats are a great gifts to audiophiles, with SACD of simple audiophile recording (not too complicated, trio and quartet, vocals with cello, piano etc) sonding much better and the DVD Audio of pop and rock recording sounding superior.
    Let us hope more and more DVD Audio and SACD will be issued! and left fans of both formats with little to complain.
    If anyone wishes to ask questions regarding the hardware setups or my opinions on any of the discs mentioned, please let me know either in this thread or Email me...
     
  2. Sutjahjo Ngaserin

    Sutjahjo Ngaserin Stunt Coordinator

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  3. Shawn C

    Shawn C Screenwriter

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  4. DarrylWHarrisJr

    DarrylWHarrisJr Stunt Coordinator

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    as for as the eagles...yes!!!!!!!!

    guess that's what the 192k sample rate will do for a recording....i wish this was the standard (24/192) for 2 channel dvd-a for all dvd-a's
     
  5. Sutjahjo Ngaserin

    Sutjahjo Ngaserin Stunt Coordinator

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    Willie Nelson - Night and Day
    Yes, this Instrumental DVD Audio sounds amazing, showing how good pianos and Guitars can sound.
    Ray Benson described the musical Style in his liner notes as "Gypsy", although I cannot get swaying Hawaiaan dancers out of my mind while listening to this great sounding disc.
    The full fidelity of Piano sounds are obvious in track 6 Gypsy for example. Track 1 Vous et Moi and Track 2 Nuages are equally impressive in Willie's effortless guitar playing/tonal qualities.
    The musical style is laid-back and easy, more suitable for late night listening than serious enjoyment.
    For a snapshot of the menu, please click
    http://www.msnusers.com/DVDAudioSoft...hoto&PhotoID=1
     
  6. KeithH

    KeithH Lead Actor

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    Sutjahjo, I wasn't aware that Christy Baron Steppin' was available on DVD-Audio. I'll have to check it out. I've been meaning to pick up the SACD for awhile. The CD is great, and "Will It Go 'Round In Circles" is excellent on the Chesky An Introduction to SACD sampler.
     
  7. Sutjahjo Ngaserin

    Sutjahjo Ngaserin Stunt Coordinator

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    Yes, both formats are great improvements over the original Chesky CD.
    This recording sounds great but I think Chesky might have overdone the recording to please some audiophiles. Christy seems to be singing alone in a small, empty and echoing room. While I am impressed, couldn't help wishing she is closer to me at times :)
    Outstanding tracks are Thieves in the Temple and She's not there. The Shadow of your Smile is also very pleasant
    see the discs and DVD-A menu screenshost by clicking http://www.msnusers.com/DVDAudioSoftware/shoebox.msnw
     
  8. KeithH

    KeithH Lead Actor

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    Sutjahjo, the only DVD-Audio disc I saw on Chesky's web site is Bucky Pizzarelli Swing Live.
     
  9. Sutjahjo Ngaserin

    Sutjahjo Ngaserin Stunt Coordinator

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  10. Shawn C

    Shawn C Screenwriter

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    It sounds like I need to find that Willie Nelson DVD-A. Best Buy didn't have it the last time I went. They had everything else, but not that. I guess I should just pick it up online.
     
  11. LarryDavenport

    LarryDavenport Cinematographer

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    Is there a player yet (in the US) that plays both SACD and DVD-A?
     
  12. Sutjahjo Ngaserin

    Sutjahjo Ngaserin Stunt Coordinator

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    I believe Pioneer 47A is currently the only player that plays both multichannel SACD and DVD-Audio, it should be available in US about now or very soon.
     
  13. KeithH

    KeithH Lead Actor

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    Sutjahjo and Larry, in addition to the Pioneer Elite DV-47A, there is the APEX AD-7701, but it's a piece o' crap.
     
  14. Sutjahjo Ngaserin

    Sutjahjo Ngaserin Stunt Coordinator

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    Oh yes, the everything in one Apex player, of course.

    Thanks Keith!
     
  15. Micahel C

    Micahel C Stunt Coordinator

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    Sutjahjo,

    The Pioneer DV-47A is now available through a few dealers. Mine arrived late today at the office, but I won't get to play with it till tomorrow evening. Looking forward to forming my own opinion as to DVD-A and MC SACD playback on it.

    Cheers!
     
  16. Sutjahjo Ngaserin

    Sutjahjo Ngaserin Stunt Coordinator

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    Congrats!

    Please let us know your view on the player
     
  17. Lee Scoggins

    Lee Scoggins Producer

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    Lee
    Sutjahjo,
    Excellent post. Thoughtful and well described.
    My only concern is about drawing "dynamic range" conclusions with respect to SACD. I believe these may be limited by the electronics in your 47A equivalent. I had a chance to listen to this unit last week and noted some dynamic compression that I do not have with my SCD-777ES.
    I certainly do not mean to be a snob about this, indeed I am jealous of anyone with the convenience of a universal player. I just think it might be a bit dangerous to fault SACD on its dynamics - in fact, Super Audio is known for its frequency extension. A comparison with a higher end Sony may make a better test point.
    As far as detail, I enjoy the detail on both formats but see no advantage here of DVDA over SACD. Check out the sweet guitar and vocals on Willie Nelson StarDust or the DVDA detail on the Eagles.
    MY Keb Mo blues and Analogue Production blues SACDs sound great in this respect.
    As Dennis would say "of course I could be wrong". [​IMG]
    Lee
     
  18. Sutjahjo Ngaserin

    Sutjahjo Ngaserin Stunt Coordinator

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    >>>I believe these may be limited by the electronics in your 47A equivalent
     
  19. Sutjahjo Ngaserin

    Sutjahjo Ngaserin Stunt Coordinator

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    I wish to add something on Christy Byron's Steppin'

    This recording in both SACD and DVD Audio are not the best in their respective formats.
     
  20. John Tillman

    John Tillman Supporting Actor

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    Well thanks to this thread, I picked up the W. Nelson Night & Day DVD-A while browsing Tower this afternoon. I played a couple of tracks in stereo (16bit 44.1kHz) and was impressed with both the material and sonics. Switched over to the 96kHz multichannel and just let it play all the way through. Very nice instrumental album, happy to add it to my collection.

    I only have one other Willie album, Red Headed Stranger, and I noticed that the last track on it (Bandera) is the same as the last track on Night & Day. Doesn't prove anything at all but it was fun to compare the Columbia Redbook (Sony C555ES) to the DVD-A (Panny RP-91) both fed through the Outlaw ICBM. The Redbook was crisp and clean but the stereo DVD-A was warm and full. One other thing, his band was exactly the same after 25 years...

    I think the next time I stumble across the Stardust SACD, I won't pass it up.
     

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