Does the longer version of SOUTH PACIFIC still exist? (3 Viewers)

[TonyDale]

Your memory certainly doesn't jive with Joe Caps' assertion...were those Pennsylvania showings special sneak previews which occurred before the official roadshow opening, before it showed in New York and Los Angeles?

The first, at the Manor Theater - where I also purchased my Souvenir Book - was the premiere engagement in Pittsburgh; the other viewing, at the Liberty was a special matinee long after the roadshow, but, still it contained the Prologue, the rest of "Beautiful Things," as well as all of Rex Harrison's songs.

Joe has has his hands in the Fox vaults, so he should know what exists NOW. He is a wonderful source of information regarding the musicals of the 60s and 70s. I have only experience one other time that my memory was not in sync with Joe's - and that was a minor trifle over the release date of ths soundtrack recording of VALLEY OF THE DOLLS.

 

[Joe Caps]

I also saw this "other " version of Doolittle - but that is a prerelease version. When the film officially opened, it had already been shortened. the longer version does not exist at Fox. Also cut from the film (and not on the soundtrack album) is a reprise fo Where are the Words, sung by Samantha Eggar (dubbed by Diana Lee).

 

[Joe Caps]

To clear up a few South Pacific things -
when the film was cut, it wasnot just chopped up but the parts that were cut were also redubbed to smooth out the cut.
One scene, Joe cable singing Bali Hai on his way to the island, was cut and replaced with new footage of Joe on the boat while the chorus alone sings the song.
However, it seems the release of the restored version is a year from this November, so we have a lot of waiting to do.

Anyway, the restoration of south Pacific to full length has been an pbsession with me. When I was allowed in 1990 to go through the holdings of South Pacific in storage at goldwyn, some fun things were found. - scnes cut from the preview print, the underscore by Alfred Newman, a song - Loneliness of Evening recorded but not used in the film, the audio tests for possible dubbers for John Kerr including John Kerrs own voice. There is also the alternate opening reel for the foreign prints that resotre the film to its Broadway continuity.
What I did not find is the missing sections of Gonna wash That Man right OUghta My Hair - and don't expect to see them in the restored print. These scens never even made it to the first preview print. Oscar Hammerstein was onlocation with the Fox crew and he took a disliek to the number. the number was then cut to the bone.

A couple of months ago, there was a 70mm film festival in the north of England. Part of the festival was a print of south Pacific. Several friends of mine were there and the next day I was bombarded with emails from them saying the uncut version was ran.
I then called a gentleman in California who sometimes acts as a go between for collectors and studios. The print belonged to a collector. He quickly cleared the way with the studio and the collector, and the uncut print was in the U.s. in a matter of weeks. The print was all pink and fox began the long task of taking eeach frame of the print and feeding into high resolution computers to preserve and color correct the film. That is still going on and work on the soundtrack is also going on.
The restoration of theis film has beena holy grail for me and I can not wait until a year from now to see it.

 

[Howard S]

Thanks very much for the information.

A couple of months ago, there was a 70mm film festival in the north of England

Assuming that was the Bradford Film festival, I live only 10 miles away!! I can't believe it...small world indeed. If only I'd known!!

A quick search on the internet, and I've found that the organisers of the event commented that "...this print..., sadly, has left it’s glory days behind".

If this is the case, presumably Fox may have the ability to only take and restore the previously missing/re-dubbed portions from this print, and insert them into the best available alternative source material.

Do you happen to know whether the discovered print contains a scene relating to Jo Cable being in hospital, so explaining the dialogue in the cut version which refers to his stay?

 

[Joe Caps]

No, there is no such scene fo Joe in the hospital. It is not in the shooting scripts and is not in any of the cutting continuities even for the first preveiw print.

 

[RolandL]

I don't have it anymore but, I thought I remember reading a review of the laser disc of South Pacific and also how it was originally shown in the movie theatres.

The filter use was supposed to be very light but they made it very heavy for the 70mm release prints. When the laser disc was released, they somehow reduced the filtering and more of the natural color came through.

I hope I'm explaining this correctly.

 

[Brian Sharp]

Going back to the 70's the one remaining 70mm print of South Pacific in the UK was certainly the longer version. At that time it was being distributed by a small company called Eagle Films. On booking, we were given the shorter running time and, finding that it was the longer version, it really screwed up the scheduling for the couple of weeks.
Last known resting place of this print was with Rank Dispatch at Cardiff South Wales, residing alongside 70mm prints of Oklahoma and Taras Bulba. Could this be the print that has found its way to Bradford?

 

[Joe Caps]

I am told that the 70mm print fox is using for the restoration was borrowed from a private collector in England.
For R and H fans, it was recently found that Marni Nixon dubs one line of singing fo rShirley Jones in Carousel. In the song, IF I LOVED YOU< Marni sings "and I always say two heads re better than one to figur it out. "

 

[Mike Frezon]

Joe: What ever might have precipitated the need to have Marni dub just one of Shirley's lines in "If I Loved You"? D'ya suppose Shirley was unavailable when it was discovered the dub needed to be done?

I cannot imagine its anything Shirley herself wouldn't have been able to handle.

 

[Joe Caps]

Who knows? Maybe that part of the track had some last minute damage and it had to be done quickly. Maybe that line was a little bit too low for Shirley. We can only guess. Still, Marni does a great imitation of Shirley.

 

[Greg_M]

I always knew that line was Dubbed

 

[Mike Frezon]

Still, Marni does a great imitation of Shirley.

I'll have to go give a closer listen.

 

[TedD]

For those who feel the filters on South Pacific degrade the resolution of the image:

Please note that the reduction in detail and resolution when certain filters are used was not present in the original prints.

This is purely an artifact that is induced by the reduced chroma resolution available in the video domain. MPEG processed video chroma resolution is 1/2 to 1/4 of the luma resolution.

The Laserdisc was the worst as it introduced both the softness and a large amount of chroma noise. Hopefully this is being scanned in a format that preserves ALL of the chroma resolution available in the original.

Ted

 

[ChristopherDAC]

Well, the difference between luma and chroma resolution in video actually shouldn't affect material which has been given a constant tint, since the picture detail still consists in variations of brightness and not tint; it's not like anaglyph 3D which becomes a total mess. On the other hand, that's only strictly true in a constant-lumimnance system, and neither NTSC nor MPEG-II achieves this [MPEG hardly even tries].

 

[Jefferson]

Back to the totally off topic "Marni dubbed a Shirley Jones line in CAROUSEL"...
has anyone else noticed that the film itself (and the mono LP of the soundtrack album) have what sounds like Shirley in a very "quavery" voice on that line...it doesn't sound so nice.
But the stereo LP (and CD) have what sounds (now that in know) like the Marni dub.

Now...this could be the other way around,
or they could BOTH be Marni,
or......hell, at this point, maybe it was ME, i dont know HAAA.

But...I own two different "takes" of that line.

Along the same dubbing lines,
has anyone noticed in the trailer for SOUND OF MUSIC,
you hear Anna Lee's own voice sing the line, "Maria makes me laugh?" but in the movie and the album it is someone else?

 

[Joe Caps]

Jefferson, you are quite right - Ann Lees own voice is only in the early trailer. In the film and on the lp and CD she is dubbed by Marie Greene.

 

[Jefferson]

I'll tell you...i'm learning something new all the time...
I'm pretty skeptical about these details,
and i pride myself on being more knowledgable than the average bear about 'em......

So, little me listened carefully to the CAROUSEL line
from the CD last night.........no question at all that it is Marni Nixon on that one line.
Holy COW.

But my question and wonder is, why on EARTH? Shirley
is such a fantastic singer...but, that one line is very, very low for her range.

Well, i'm just babbling at this point,
this stuff fascinates me.
I'm also fascinated that any lost footage from SOUTH PACIFIC will finally make it to dvd.
Wow.

 

[DeeF]

I'm guessing that that one line was done in the post-production of the Carousel movie. Somebody decided Shirley's original sounded bad, and Marni happened to be around, doing The King and I, so they asked her to step in and loop that one line from Carousel.

At the time, Shirley was nobody, and Marni was nobody, too, so it didn't occur to anyone to actually call Shirley back into the studio.

 

[Jack Theakston]

The print shown in Bradford was indeed the Roadshow print (I was there). I personally enjoyed the filter effect as an atmosphere setter, even though the print was faded. The lack of definition is due to certain details being colors that the filter obviously filters out. Weak reds that make up the features of fine lines on the face are drowned out by the magenta filter because of the increased contrast-- an old black and white photography trick.

As for the "I'm Gonna Wash That Man" number, it's a pretty stupid song to begin with and the staging of it wasn't particularly well done in the film, so I don't find it to be any great loss.

Come to think of it, the film as a whole hits the middle-ground of mediocrity... a handfull of good songs and an OK cast, but so overlavish a production for such a simple story that one can't help but remember the old quip: If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them with bulls**t!

 

[Bob Graham]

As for the "I'm Gonna Wash That Man" number, it's a pretty stupid song to begin with and the staging of it wasn't particularly well done in the film, so I don't find it to be any great loss.

But it was a pretty popular tune back in the day. It was used in a TV commercial and was well-know enough to inspire a Mad Magazine song parody "I'm Going to Drink that Fink Right Out of My Life"