Diva and Rocket Speakers (1 Viewer)

[Rich Malloy]

I disagree with the last bit of advice, DeT. If you're running without a sub, the usual advice would be to set your two mains to large and keep that center at small.

FWIW, I have my C3 set to small and crossed over at 80hz. I previously set the small/large crossover at 60hz with my old speakers, but I find the 80hz setting to be much better with the Divas. But I do not think yoy should be sending a full-range signal to the C3. It simply will not reproduce frequencies below 60hz, and you will only muddy up your sound if you try. Let the larger mains do the bass-work.

But I'm as perplexed as the others when it comes to the problems you're having. I know I'm not the first to say that the C3 is, quite possibly, the best designed speaker in the whole Diva line-up. I'm getting dialog clarity I never thought possible.

I happen to have the model with the top-mounted tweeter, but reportedly the sound characteristics are essentially identical, so I can't believe this could be the issue. Is it wired properly (in-phase)? Does your amp send the same strong signal to the your center as to the other speakers? (Some old, pro-logic only receivers really skimped out on the center wattage.)

 

[DeT]

Thanks for all your help guys, but perhap because I am a newbie, therefore maybe I don't know how good the C3 is until I found another center elsewhere and bring it home, hook it on to see how it compare.

FYI, my receiver is the Denon 3802 and I had test all channels, which working normally. And all the wires are in phase, checked twice. And this is the 2nd C3 I got from av123. I thought the first one got the problem, send back to Sean. He send me another one, he told me that the one I send back got somekind of distortion, which I did not hear. I thought it was just flat and boxy. Maybe it need a subwoofer, that's why there is a .1 in 5.1, I don't know...

Another last thing. I don't really care about the center speaker to tell you the truth. When I sit in my position, I can hear everything come from the center if it meant to be anyway, so this is not buggin me in anyway. I'll do something about it when I got enough money.

Thanks again

 

[Rich Malloy]

Hmmmm... the C3 should sound mighty fine with the 3802, and going without a sub shouldn't detract from its performance (unless you've been running it full-range).

I must say, my first instincts were to blame your "entertainment center". But since you tried the C3 on a stand in front/below your TV, I didn't bring it up. Ever since I experimented by moving my previous center speaker to a stand in front/below my screen, I've never gone back. And, previously, my speaker was merely on top of the TV - not stuck inside a cabinet!

Like all speakers, the C3 needs some room to breathe. I have approx. 6" of clearance between the rear of the C3 and the front of my tv, and I found this is the minimum distance before the tv/stand began to alter the performance of the speaker. I also have the tweeter aimed up to ear level (actually, shooting just a hair above ear level).

And while I agree with you that "phantom center" is the best way to go (so long as you're in the sweet spot), I find the C3 to be so wonderful on dialog (guess it's that bumpy little midrange driver) that I always use it for movies. And even though it's not quite a perfect match for my 4.1 mains, timbre-wise, I even use it for stuff like Diana Krall's "Live in Paris" DVD and "The Last Waltz". Never on two-channel stuff, of course...

 

[PomingF]

DeT, there's no reason for you to accept compromised performance esp given the quality of equipment you have. That said I have to agree with Rich that your entertainment center probably bears most of the problem. First off it wouldn't hurt to borrow some other center speakers to see how they sound in the same enclosure and after you are convinced there's better places for center speakers you can start out by placing the speaker on more solid (concrete blocks with good isolation devices such as cones, spikes or at least rubber bumpers, for temporarily measure) ground outside of the EC. As for speaker phase is concern, it probably wouldn't hurt to try switching the polarity to the C3 just to see if that changes things for sometimes mistakes do happen. Cheers.

PF

 

[DeT]

Alright, I am gonna pull EVERY single wire out, check them, then put them back again. I'll keep you guys update on how it goes.

btw, Is there anyway I could go to a dealer and "ask" them to lend me one of their center for demo ? I don't think they will. But I don't know anyone that got a decent center beside Bose.

Thanks

 

[PomingF]

DeT, Spokane WA should have other Diva or even Rocket owners. Have you post @ AVS or submit request @ AudioEnvy to see if anyone out there can help? As for wiring change you can just swap the two speaker terminals to the C3 @ the back of your receiver. Btw, when I said 'mistakes', I mean those made during manufacturing. One of my Diva 6.1 did come with a defective bass driver I had to swap out with parts AV123 sent me.

PF

 

[Walt N]

DeT, failing calibration and everything else, you may just be one who prefers the sound of a phantom center configuration. It certainly is different sounding and it has it's good points, especially if you're consistently sitting in the sweet spot. Nothing wrong with that if it sounds better to you.

 

[SkiingNinja]

Hey everyone. Thanks for helping DeT out.

Just an FYI, I personally tested the C3 he has before it left...everything is wired correctly and it sounds excellent. I really am at a loss to why it does not sound good in your home. Please keep me updated.

Regards,

Sean

 

[DeT]

Thanks Sean, I forgot to mentioned that. Sean told me he did check out the C3 that he send me to make sure that it working like the way it should.

btw, I did post on AVS to find any C3 owner or anyone in Spokane willing to lend me their center to test out on my system. But none respond, which is okay because I don't think there are many people from Spokane on here anyway.

I'll pull the wires out tomorrow.

 

[Brook K]

I just hooked my Diva 4.1's and C3 up tonight. You'll have to take my opinions with a big grain of salt since I've never before had "real" speakers and don't have a trained ear for music. My previous setup was a Boston Accoustics VL10 center and Micro dipole rears with fronts of unknown origin bought off a truck by my father-in-law
I'm also using a Sony ST-DE925 receiver, which I've been told I really need to upgrade for this setup, that said, I'm extremely impressed so far:
From the very first disc I popped in when I only had the center channel connected, "42nd Street" I could hear the difference, and on this disc, and a few others I played, the difference was as dramatic as going from stereo to 5.1 on my old stuff. So far I've only got the center and fronts hooked up (I started listening to stuff to make sure everything worked and got lost in listening. I really could have listened to it all night, had to tear myself away and it was too late to hook the rears up), but the difference on "42nd Street", "Taxi Driver", and "Midnight Cowboy" was huge.
I was picking material I knew well that was musically rich, and without the rears connected, I didn't want to listen to a newer film yet. These tracks just really come alive now, there's a much richer sound and you can pick out the individual instruments where before music was sort of glopped together, like listening on my factory car stereo. Like Rich was saying, now I hear little details I'd never heard before. I now know what "imaging" means, even on Midnight Cowboy, which I'm sure will be blown away by Dancer in the Dark or Fifth Element, there was clearly defined imaging across the fronts and actual envelopment which I never heard before on my old stuff. Even without the rears, sounds seemed like they were coming from the sides and different locations in the room.
I could have just kept listening, I want to listen to everything I've got to see how it sounds- Hedwig, Oh Brother Where Art Thou, Do The Right Thing's "Fight the Power", West Side Story, Apocalypse Now, Eyes Wide Shut, In The Mood For Love, Aguirre the Wrath of God, Perceval, Passion of Joan of Arc, SUSPIRIA, on and on and on
Bernard Herrmann's Taxi Driver might be my favorite film score, I've seen it plenty of times, including in a commercial theater, I've never heard it sound anything like this, it was so great..... Definitely worth every penny, and the thought that these are going to "break in" and sound even better? WOW!!!
I now understand the HTF guys who spend loads on their home theaters, I never knew the difference quality components can make.

 

[PomingF]

DeT, you got PM.
PF

 

[DeT]

PomingF, PM replied

Updated: I take out the wire today, check it, put in banana plug on both end. Plug it back in, still sound like before which is boxy and flat.

So it can't be the speaker fault cause Sean already test it before he send me. Maybe my ears are shot. Maybe my receiver sending bad signal to the center. Maybe I need a subwoofer. Or maybe like Sean told me "Maybe the C3 isn't right for you".

I don't know, but I am tired and my back hurt from moving the 6.1, its heavy.

Anyway, I am done with it for now, until I have enough money to buy a subwoofer.

Thank you everyone for your suggestions and help regarding my C3 issues. I appreciated it.

DeT

 

[SkiingNinja]

DeT, I will offer to buy your C3 back. I would not want any Diva speaker sitting around unused and unloved
Please call me and I will arrange it.
Regards,
Sean

 

[Walt N]

Didn't your accountant tell you that AV123 would be much more profitable if you blew stuff like this off? There must be some "big picture" long range Zen customer satisfaction thing going on there that's so unfamiliar to me I can barely understand it.

 

[DeT]

Thanks Sean for standing behind your product. Make me feel much better. I have more stuff to try out, if all fail, I'll give you a call.

I just give a local dealer a call and he agree to let me bring my C3 in for testing, this should eliminate all the "problems" in my system that effect the C3 performance, if there are any.

Will keep you guys update on this.

 

[Walt N]

DeT, see if they'll let you compare your C-3 with one of their better center channel speakers. If you can reject the possible noise coming from the direction of the salesman, you might be surprised at how well the C-3 does in an A/B. Either way you'll know for sure whether you're just a "phantom center" kind of guy, have placement/configuration/calibration issues at home, or if you truly don't like the sound of the C-3.

Good luck, and don't let them sell you any cables!

 

[SkiingNinja]

Understood Duc. Keep us posted!

Regards,

Sean

 

[David Sim]

Thanks for everybody's input.
I ended up buying Paradigm Studio 100s.
I love them but I am having a bit of buyers remorse because I wanted to get rockets. I am not going to read anymore comparisons between the two until I am ready to upgrade.
It was a combination of not hearing the rockets and plain lack of patience and the fact my klipsch quintets needed to go that made me get the Paradigms.
There is always next time.
The Paradigms sound great with my new Outlaw 950/770 combo. I didn't know what I was missing!
I'll never doubt my brother-in-law again.
Next, the SVSub.

 

[Mark LS]

Hello DeT...

Please do let us know how we can help further... I've just tuned into this thread... and I'm just feeling so worried about all of this...

Please let Sean know what you would desire as the next move... We are here to help in any way possible...

Wishing you all the very best...

mls

 

[DeT]

Update
I decided not to give up on the C3 cause everyone said its that good.
I found a couple of people that willing to help and we found out that the problem is the center channel signal send out by the Denon. For some reason, the tweeter on the center channel didn't get all the signal, or really weak signal (we tried it with the 2.1 too, and the result is the same). That explain why my center always sound like a box. If I stick my ear really close to the tweeter, there is very little sound coming out of it, but all other channel is working fine. I think the reason I don't hear this before when testing is because maybe I turn it up too loud.
And yes, the C3 is that good after testing it out one someone else system. Now I just have to get the Denon fix then everything should be perfect.
Thanks for sticking with me through on this issue guys, I really appreciated it