Denon DVD-9000 Now Available (1 Viewer)

[Michael Lee]

The answer to the numero uno question about this player is yes. There is a chroma upsampling error evident here but it is a mild one. The argument that a $3000 player should not exhibit this problem is a valid one. I did have to look pretty closely at my 9' screen to confirm this. We looked at Toy Story at the menu section and where Woody is giving his speech with the red microphone. I think it was most noticeable on the menu with the blue lettering...on the curves. We also viewed North By Northwest and it was quite minor here.
I encountered difficulty getting the DVD-A to work through the Denon Link. I have to check the instructions for both the 5803 and the 9000. I must be missing something.

 

[KeithH]

Michael, thanks for the info. If the '9000 has the chroma bug, then the '3800 most certainly will too. It's about time that Denon get this right. Apparently, they keep using the wrong the chipset. I said that I would be buying the '3800 primarily for DVD-Audio, and even if it is excellent in that department, I would have a hard time dropping $1200 on a player that is known to have the chroma bug.
It is absolutely inexcusable to see DVD players with the same flaw generation after generation.

 

[Andrew P]

Very disappointing... If I was going to spend $3,000 the player better be perfect and this is inexcusable. Shame on Denon.

Andy

 

[KeithH]

Andrew, two things bother me about the '9000. First, the fact that Denon has the nerve to release a $3000 player with the chroma bug. Panasonic has a $200 player on the market that doesn't show it (DVD-RP56). Someone here mentioned recently that Denon Jeff posted on another forum that Denon is aware of the chroma bug problem and is continuing to work on it. Give me a break.

The second thing that bothers me is that at $3000, the '9000 was supposed to offer DVD-Audio and SACD playback. Now, I don't fault Denon because SACD compatibility never came through. That is likely due to Sony's issues with Denon's new digital output (I like the fact that Denon is pushing the envelope). However, the bottom line is that the '9000 was originally touted as a reference-quality universal player. Now that a key element, namely SACD, has been omitted, I feel strongly that Denon should have dropped the price of the '9000. It isn't all that it was supposed to be. $3000 is a lot to pay for a progressive-scan DVD-Audio player from Denon, even if it is a first-rate component (which it may not be anyway).

 

[Andrew P]

Keith:

I agree with you. The most important thing to me though on a dvd player is video. Maybe Denon should have borrowed from the RP-56 for their $1,000 and up players. Im trying to think who would purchase this $3,000 dvd player and I cant think of any group of people. Usually you spend thousands for a player that has excellent video quality and the chroma bug is an issue that should have been solved by 2002 already and it should never rear its ugly head in any dvd player yet alone in ones that are $1,000 and up.

To be honest though I expected nothing after the Denon 2800 debacle from last year. Denon makes great audio, they rebadge good dvd players, and they make poor dvd players in house.

Andy

 

[Craig F]

The second thing that bothers me is that at $3000, the '9000 was supposed to offer DVD-Audio and SACD playback.

This is not true. Some stupid web site said this during CES. They totally misconstrued info from Denon. If Sony had allowed it, the 9000 would have been able to pass the SACD data stream to the 5803 via DenonLink for decoding. But it was never going to be able to playback SACD.

 

[KeithH]

Craig, everything I had read coming out of CES said the '9000 would play SACDs. Maybe everything I read came from one bad source. Still, I feel $3000 is too much for a Denon player that only does DVD-Audio. I could see a boutique company that produces players in far lower quantities than Denon and sells through far fewer dealers charging $3000 for such a player, but not Denon. I'm not saying I agree with it, but I could see it happening. Anyway, I feel that for $3000, a Denon player should do both SACD and DVD-Audio. I'm sure the '9000 will be a very good player, chroma bug aside, but $3000 is still a lot of money for what it won't do, namely function as a universal player.

As for the chroma bug on the '3800, let me first say that I am assuming it will show the chroma bug simply because the more expensive '9000 does. I feel that is a safe assumption. The chroma bug on the '3800 wouldn't be huge problem for me from the standpoint that I too have a 27" TV with no component video inputs. Furthermore, I would be buying the '3800 for DVD-Audio first and foremost. In the 15 months that I've had a Technics DVD-A10 DVD-Audio player, I have only watched a movie on it once. I would probably never use the '3800 for movies. However, there is the possibility that I will get an HDTV at some point and will want to use the '3800 for movies. Even if I never get an HDTV, I have an issue spending $1200 for a player with a video problem that should have been solved by now.

 

[Michael Lee]

I myself asked the Denon presenter at CES in January about SACD capability in the upcoming 9000 player. His reply was merely, "We are working on it but no promises." I took that as a definite 100%, absolute "maybe". He really made no commitment there and I remember distinctly hoping there would be SACD on the 9000, but surely not counting on it.

 

[KeithH]

Michael, thanks for the info. I figured you would chime in. Frankly if it were true that Denon never intended to include SACD playback in the $3000 '9000, that would be worse in my book than if they had and Sony had not allowed it. I would applaud Denon for pushing the envelope, as I said before. Still, if Denon wanted SACD playback and couldn't get it, then they should drop the price of the '9000 to $2000.
By the way, I had heard that the '9000 would sell for $3000. What is the exact retail price? Www.audiolab.com , which is an authorized Denon dealer, is taking pre-orders for the '9000 for $3150. Audiolab usually discounts, so I am guessing that the retail price is a bit higher.

 

[KeithH]

I just answered my own question about the retail price of the Denon DVD-9000. Crutchfield put it up on its web site today. It's in stock for $3500. Here is the link:
http://www.crutchfield.com/cgi-bin/S...VD9000&o=m&a=0

 

[ReggieW]

I agree Keith.

It is strictly a matter of principle. If it would've taken Denon another six-months to clear up the chroma error, then they should've waited. Period. Some lesser companies would've done it with a 300.00 player. I have always sworn by Denon, but this really tarnishes their reputation in my book. I don't want to hear the excuse that they could not have waited until the chroma problem was solved, because the few select buyers of this 3,500.00 player would've gladly waited until the problem was solved. The 9000 is out of my price range, and maybe by the time I can afford the 3800, they'll have fixed the chroma problem on it. Keith, I am sure that DVD-A playback on the 3800 & 9000 will be reference quality, as I've heard pretty stellar things regarding the audio playback on the mid-level 1600.

Reg

 

[Craig F]

Still, if Denon wanted SACD playback and couldn't get it, then they should drop the price of the '9000 to $2000.

The cost of adding the SACD would be insignificant. The price of the 9000 comes from the design and layout of the overall system, analog stages, noise isolation etc.

Bottom line to all this, is that Denon has many customers with different interests. They are releasing what they have now for those who want it. Who's to say in six months they won't have a player with the Chroma Bug fixed or an upgrade. Time will tell. They tried to fix it and it fell short. There are buisness protocols to abide by. It's not so easy to just dump a supplier you have a good working relationship with. Denon has a very tough descision to make right now as to whether they will give ESS one more chance or not.

 

[Andrew P]

Its a $3,000 dvd player. The video should be flawless from day 1. For those of you who do not care about the dvd video quality then im sure its a great $3,000 dvd audio only player.

Andy

 

[KeithH]

Reggie said:

Keith, I am sure that DVD-A playback on the 3800 & 9000 will be reference quality, as I've heard pretty stellar things regarding the audio playback on the mid-level 1600.

I hope you are right. I am really intrigued by the '3800. Hopefully Denon will get its act together in the video department.

 

[Geo]

Some bold statements from those who have never used or even seen the player.

 

[KeithH]

Geo,

Yes, some bold statements. No matter how good the player is, $3500 is a lot of money. In my opinion, as I have said already, a $3500 component from Denon should do SACD. Even with SACD, $3500 is a lot of cash, regardless of performance, but the price is more easily justified with SACD. There are a number of progressive-scan DVD-Audio players out there for a lot less than the '9000 that offer outstanding video quality. The '9000 could be outstanding with DVD-Audio, but the format, as much as I like it, is severely hampered by a dearth of software. So, I just don't feel that one is getting enough for $3500. SACD offers many more titles, which is why I feel a $3500 component should offer it.

Craig said:

That's a valid point for poeple who want SACD. I personally have yet to see any SACDs I'd want to buy, therefore it is not important to me.

I can understand your views on SACD, but as I said to Geo above, $3500 is steep for a progressive-scan DVD-Audio player from Denon, especially one that has been reported to have the chroma bug. Even if SACD means nothing to you and you are satisifed with the feature set of the '9000, what if Denon never offers an upgrade to correct the problem? I can't see spending that kind of money on the player in the hopes that Denon offers a fix for the chroma bug. As for SACD, you might not be interested now, but in dropping $3500, I'd want the option for down the road.

 

[Michael Lee]

At CES, I also asked if there would be any scaling ability, like the Panasonic RP-91 and the (sibling) Denon DVM-4800. The reply was no-but the picture quality was supposed to be so good that it would be awfully darn close. I must say the picture did look really good utilizing the Zoom mode on my Sharp 9000 on Titanic and Criterion Armageddon.

In the Setup menus, there is an option called Squeeze Mode..and in the instructions, it says it is "Used to play 4:3 images on a wide (16:9) TV". Now that sounds like some sort of zooming to me but I am not sure. Any clues?

 

[Geo]

I look at the 9000 as the last non HD DVD player I will ever buy.

This may be a reach for the 9000 (or not) but Meridian, Theta among others make some pretty pricey DVD players that are not only non SACD compatible, they are not even DVD Audio players.

I'm quickly becoming a Denon believer. My gut and Denon recent history (follow through with promised 5800 upgrade) tells me Denon will not hang their products out to dry.

I guess time will tell.

geo

 

[Andrew P]

Denon cannot make a quality DVD player. Hopefully in the future they will, but not today.

Andy

 

[StaceyS]

Geo,

Actually Meridian has the only DVD-A player on the market today that can pass copyright protected content across a digital link.