Denon DVD 3800 questions

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by Sach, Sep 20, 2002.

  1. Sach

    Sach Stunt Coordinator

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    I am very much interested in buying this player as have read a lot about it but had a few questions:

    On the specs it says that the Denon 3800 has a separate 54 Mhz DAC for interlaced signal, which is different from the 12 bit 108 Mhz DAC. As I will be upgrading to a progressive scan TV in the very near future, I would like to know if this separation produces a good interlaced signal?
    Also is it fair to assume that there is no DAC > 54 Mhz for interlaced signals on any other DVD player?

    Secondly I wanted to know this player's redbook CD performance. Is this a really good sounding CD player?

    Third - has anyone compared the video to the Denon 1600, which uses the Faroudja chip?

    thanks.
     
  2. Mark Norman

    Mark Norman Extra

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    The 3800 is having severe lock-up problems. I am also very interested in this player but on the AVS forum approx 90% of the owners reporting in have returned the player due to lock-up issues.

    Thought you should know.

    Mark
     
  3. Glenn Marshall

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    Mark,

    I just ordered a 3800 on 9/19. Haven't received any shipping info yet. Perhaps I can cancel. Have you heard
    any follow-ups on the 90% that had the lock-up problem? I understand that Denon will supply a software correction for the chroma bug, if you request it. Is this correct and does it work.

    What is the full handle for the site you referred to as AVS? I would like to read-up on this.

    Glenn
     
  4. Ken Smith

    Ken Smith Stunt Coordinator

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    Glenn,
    The site is avsforum.com. I think the 90% figure is way off. Some people have a few dvd's momentarily freeze. I myself have had only one disc freeze.Other people don't even have the problem. I think it's because of a few hairline scratches. It's true that other players will play these same discs without any problems. Denon is currently investigating the problem.I started to play Panic Room last night and it froze on the dvd setup menu. I took it out and cleaned it and it played flawlessy. As long as you don't have bad scratches I wouldn't worry about it. This player has the best picture going for it, I doubt that you would be sorry. It has a 30 day return policy from any auth. dealer, so if it's bad just return it.
     
  5. Phil Nichols

    Phil Nichols Second Unit

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    Ken,
    I sure hope it's less than 90%, as my 3800 hasn't locked up yet and it would be easy to slide from 10% over to 90%!
    I hope Denon gets to the bottom of this soon and easily. A firmware patch in the field would be an ideal way to up the reliability regarding this issue. [​IMG]
     
  6. Glenn Marshall

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    Ken,

    Thanks for the feedback! Between my 1st post and this one, I received a reply to my shipping status. It is out of stock until the end of the week. That should give me enough time for more evaluation on this puppy.

    I'm not saying I'm out of the woods yet, but I've heard, what you mentioned, happening to other players. I could live with that until Denon does a tweak.

    Anyone else, out there, want to make me feel good, or bad?

    Glenn
     
  7. Glenn Marshall

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    Ken & Phil,

    Forgot to ask about the chroma bug or lack thereof. Have you had any problem with this? And does the Denon issued fix work?

    Glenn
     
  8. ManojM

    ManojM Stunt Coordinator

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    The chroma bug has been fixed by a firmware update.
    I believe that units of the 3800 manufactured after Feb-March of 2002 do not lock up. Phil, I believe you know which build dates are good...
     
  9. Brian Corr

    Brian Corr Supporting Actor

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    I have a 3800 (april build date) that replaced a panasonic rp-91.
    Beautiful picture and sound and not a single lock up.
    I haven't noticed a layer change either.
    I've watched probably 10 movies since I got it a couple weeks ago.

    I'd buy it again without hesitation.
     
  10. Phil Nichols

    Phil Nichols Second Unit

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    Glenn,
    My 3800 is a Feb build time-frame. Actually my S/N ends with a bunch of zeros and "194" at the very end. I may be WAY OUT on a limb with my unit, as it could be only the 194th 3800 built! I could be fortunate regarding this particular 3800 though, as perhaps Denon payed very special attention to the first few units off the line - with engineers even personally involved with checking out very early units. I used to work in manufacturing and sometimes this process occured with respect to new products ....... but you can't count on this ...... the best rule is to AVOID early units if you can wait. (I couldn't after reading the 3800's spec sheet ~87 times!!)
    DenonJeff listed a specific starting S/N with the built-in chroma bug fix due to a revised decoder chip being used. I believe I'd pay more attention to this specific starting S/N rather than a build time-frame. Here's DenonJeff's actual post on S/N's: "I just got the starting serial numbers for Chroma Bug Free players from Japan. For DVD-3800, xxxx1935, available late August. DVD-9000, xxxx00600 again late August. These units will not need the firmware as they have been updated at Factory. All current units can be updated with the firmware."
    (Be aware though, that the revised decoder chip in the latest 3800's may also be introducing unwanted chroma delay into the component video signal!)
    My 3800 is still performing flawlessly. I don't get a lot of run time on it though, too busy right now ..... so you guys who've run 40, 50 DVD's through it with no problems are the real data points.
    I do not see the chroma bug at all after doing the firmware update as the FIRST DVD I put into the machine - done it right away. Colors are super-pure so far. I use "Auto" mode and "Mode 1".
    I may be treating my 3800 somewhat uniquely, though: I use it with it's front display always completely OFF (not dimmed) and with it's DTS/DD digital output always OFF. (I use it's analog output for my HT sound.) I have NOTHING on top of it, its' out in the open (not in a cabinet) and I also have the HT piece of equipment right next to it always OFF when using the 3800 and I try to always have my SAT box, that is fairly close to it, OFF when using the 3800. This buys me some insurance against "maybe" the lock-ups not happening because, A) This keeps the 3800 as cool as possible and, B) This keeps the 3800's circuits from being exposed to radiated energy from other nearby ON HT equipment. These precautions probably mean nothing, but just in case .........
    The result is incredible, pristine, 3D-like images with nary a sign of a layer change and no sound from it's drawer or drive mechanism. IMHO, what DVD players should have been doing as of 3-4 years ago. Far superior to what I'm seeing and experiencing in theaters lately, just a "little smaller" screen size, though. [​IMG]
     
  11. Glenn Marshall

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    Phil,

    Thanks for all the unbiased evaluation. After getting all this great feedback (hope your listening Sach, after all, you started it) and surfing thru AVS, I'm going to let the
    unit come in. It sounds like I have a good chance of getting a newer unit which has had both the chroma & skip/lock problem addressed.

    Glenn
     
  12. Gregg_M

    Gregg_M Stunt Coordinator

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    Glenn.

    I have had my 3800 now for a couple of weeks. Picture is FANTASTIC and the cd quality is good. It is a well built machine that i fall in love with everytime i watch a movie. It got even better once I did a bit of calibration with the avia disk. The only thing i have yet to try is the dvd audio. That will happen soon. Good luck.

    gregg
     
  13. Sach

    Sach Stunt Coordinator

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    Thanks Phil for all the comments you have made here and on the avsforum.

    The other day I stopped by the dealer and checked the Denon 1600, which has Faroudja processing; watched the Kenwood Sovereign Test DVD. One of the test signals is the waving flag image and certainly that image had no "jaggies" at all.

    However I would definitely go for the Denon 3800 considering it has some better features. Also the build quality is amazing.

    Can anyone comment on the interlaced processing? (please check my first post). Also is it possible to check the serial numbers on the box itself? rather than the unit inside the box.
     
  14. Greg Johnson

    Greg Johnson Stunt Coordinator

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    I pick up my 3800 Thursday and have a question. I currently am using a Tosh DV5700 and an ICBM for DVD-Audio playback. After downloading the 3800 manual and reading it twice I am questioning if I should use the ICBM with the 3800. The ICBM allows for different crossover frequencies. Which is nice but am I going to screw up the time alignment the 3800 processes using the ICBM.
    I have to admit I'm nervous as hell about whether I'll get a player that freezes and locks up. I got the 3 year warranty for 30.00 that will allow me to exchange the player if needed. That's OK but the dealer doesn't stock the 3800 so I'm sure it would still be weeks before I got a replacement. Only time will tell.
    Any feedback on the ICBM question will be appreciated.

    Greg Johnson
     
  15. Levesque

    Levesque Supporting Actor

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    I got the exact same question considering the ICBM is between my pre-amp and my amp. All you guys out there having the ICBM, how do you use the DVD-3800?
     
  16. Greg Johnson

    Greg Johnson Stunt Coordinator

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    My ICBM would be between the 3800 and my preamp (sony TA-P9000ES).

    Greg Johnson
     
  17. Levesque

    Levesque Supporting Actor

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    Greg. I'm using a Yammie RX-V3200 for my pre-amp, and then stuck with a fix crossover. Putting the ICBM between the pre-amp and my amp was way better for me, because I had a different crossover value for all the different speakers. More flexibilty then the Yammie.

    So you think I should put the ICBM between the DVD player and the pre-amp???
     
  18. Greg Johnson

    Greg Johnson Stunt Coordinator

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    Levesque,
    I have read that it is not a good practice to do bass management after time alignment (speaker distance settings)has been processed by your pre/pro. It did not work well at all in my system. Yours may be different all together.
    I use my ICBM now just for DVD-Audio completely in the analog signal path to my analog only preamp. This has worked quite well with the Tosh DV5700 because it has no bass management or time alignment for the six channel audio outputs. The Denon 3800 has this and that's why I question using the ICBM with the Denon.

    Greg Johnson
     
  19. Levesque

    Levesque Supporting Actor

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    I'm sitting at exactly the same distance from each of my 5 speakers. So I tought that time delay were insignificant in my situation for DVD-Audio. Am I mistaken?? I tought people where adjusting delays when the sitting position was not equidistant to all the speakers...

    Can someone clarify this time delay notion for me please.
     
  20. Levesque

    Levesque Supporting Actor

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    I'm sitting at exactly the same distance from each of my 5 speakers. So I tought that time delay were insignificant in my situation for DVD-Audio. Am I mistaken?? I tought people where adjusting delays when the sitting position was not equidistant to all the speakers...

    Can someone clarify this time delay notion for me please.

    Here is the answer an Outlaw rep gave me by E-Mail:

    "Using analog bass management can theoretically effect time
    delays. Assuming you have delays set in your Yamaha, you can see how
    important proper bass management is in your system with a very minimal
    effect on delays. Therefore, you may need to configure the system both
    ways and decide for yourself. Sorry I can't offer a more concrete answer,
    but I hope this helps."
     

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