Denon AVR-3803 in stock at Crutchfield.

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by KeithH, Nov 23, 2002.

  1. KeithH

    KeithH Lead Actor

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  2. ReggieW

    ReggieW Screenwriter

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    Keith,
    Thanks, as I've said in the past, Crutchfield is simply to expensive for me. I realize that they have excellent customer service and a nice payment plan, but I can also get excellent customer service from other authorized dealers for FAR less. I will be picking up the 3803 next month from an authorized dealer in Southern California area where I live for around 850.00. I have a few people willing to give me 300.00 for my 1802, which'll bring the price of the 3803 down to about 550.00 for me.[​IMG] [​IMG]
    Reg
     
  3. RichardMA

    RichardMA Second Unit

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    Anyone who pays MSRP price on
    a product must like to waste money. I am amazed a place
    like Crutchfield can actually survive. There is one example of them in Toronto where I live, it's called Bay Bloor Radio but it sells mostly to wealthier inner city people who need them to come and install their equipment
    for them, and don't have the time to really shop nor will the lack of any discount strain them financially.
    I believe the term for this type of customer in the retail industry is "lay down." They simply come in and say
    "I don't have a clue, just give me something good."
     
  4. Kevin_Kr

    Kevin_Kr Supporting Actor

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    It does not mean they like to waste money, some people put value in the ability to know they are going to be taken care of and are willing to spend the money to make sure of it.
     
  5. Wayne Ernst

    Wayne Ernst Cinematographer

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    Crutchfield isn't only about paying retail price for a product, but it's all about their service. While it's true, I'd never pay retail, but there are plenty of people who would because of the service that they get offered. I've used Crutchfield before when purchasing car audio gear. The information that I received from them in addition to my gear was quite extensive. They provided complete instructions on the radio removal process for my particular vehicle along with all of the speaker wire connectors so I wouldn't have to cut any wires. For a first-time installer, Crutchfield provides a very good service. However, I'm not too sure how much of a benefit their service would provide with a home theater receiver. There's basically little they could offer - other than some hand-holding over the telephone if you were to run into some setup issues.
    While I do think that Crutchfield provides a valuable service for consumers who need the extra assistance, I can no longer afford to pay retail. And since I live in Virginia, I also get stuck paying state sales tax on top of Crutchfield's prices - which is a double whammy for me. [​IMG]
     
  6. NickFoley

    NickFoley Stunt Coordinator

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    I've been looking for a new receiver and there are are tons of web-sites that offer better prices than Crutchfield.
     
  7. Thomas_Berg

    Thomas_Berg Screenwriter

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  8. KeithH

    KeithH Lead Actor

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    Reggie,

    No problem. I rarely order from Crutchfield. I only buy from them if I can't get an item elsewhere. For example, I bought a Kenwood minidisc player from them back in April because no one else had it.


    All,

    In my experience, the Crutchfield's customer service is a bit overrated. It is true that you can return an item to Crutchfield within 30 days with no return shipping fee or restocking fee, no questions asked. That is nice and is rare in the mail-order business. However, I can return items to brick-and-mortar dealers that have the same merchandise at the same prices or less within 30 days for a full refund with no questions asked. Also, when I was new to this hobby, I used Crutchfield's tech. support line and found it to be largely ineffective. Most of the time, I ended up figuring out the problem myself or I had to call the manufacturer after calling Crutchfield to get the matter resolved. It is not easy for the people at Crutchfield to be experts in the subtle nuances of so many products from different manufacturers, so I no longer expect it.

    The discount mail-order dealers like Oade Bros. and OneCall charge a restocking fee for returns. J&R Music World doesn't charge a restocking fee, but you do pay return shipping. However, I try to research a product as much as possible before buying from these discount dealers to minimize the risk of my not liking the product. The significant savings from these dealers is with the limited risk involved. I have returned merchandise to J&R for a refund and have never had a problem with them. I've also done exchanges with J&R, and since I had to pay shipping to return the first item, I have usually gotten a good discount on shipping for the new item. In fact, I have gotten them to erase the shipping charges on the new item entirely in a couple of cases. That's great customer service.
     
  9. ReggieW

    ReggieW Screenwriter

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    Keith,

    I know a few months back that you were considering replacing your Sony ES receiver with a new one and said you would be considering the 3803 as a contender. I wonder What do you think of it so far. I know a few people on the HTF who own 3802's have said that they would not be upgrading because they didn't see drastic improvements, or wouldn't be utilizing the improvements made for the 3803 such as DTS 24/96 and the high band-width for component video switching and the upconversion. Since I am coming from an 1802, I don't have this dilemma. You are correct regarding Crutchfield's service. I have always wondered how much better they were than Oade Brothers, 6th ave, or J and R. I have bought from all three with NICE DISCOUNTS on my items from Sony ES and Denon coupled with excellent customer service. I remember someone taking issue with my critique of Crutchfield prices about a year ago, and thought that Crutchfield must have mind-blowing customer service for me to rattle someone over this.

    Reg
     
  10. Wayne Ernst

    Wayne Ernst Cinematographer

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  11. KeithH

    KeithH Lead Actor

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    Reggie, I was considering the Denon '3802 or '3803 along with some other receivers at the time that I didn't think Sony would repair my Sony ES receiver. In the end, Sony did repair it (good as new), so I have stopped looking seriously at receivers. One thing that impresses me about the '3803, assuming Crutchfield is correct, is that it has 16 24/192 DACs. That looks good on paper.
     
  12. ReggieW

    ReggieW Screenwriter

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    Keith,

    If I read the specs correctly from the Denon webpage, then the 3803 is pretty much a 5803 without THX Ultra, The Digital Denon-link, two multi-channel input connections, more optical/coaxial plugs, the dolby headphone feature, and the beefy amps and power output of the 5803. This is quite a difference, but the 5803 cost 3k more than the 3803. I don't know why Denon did not incorporate the Dolby headphone feature on the 5803 into its lower models. This seems like a feature you would utilize more in a lower end receiver anyway, I mean, how many people have Denon 5803's in their bedroom with headphones plugged in? I was surprised to see this missing on the 3803. I will add a 140wpc THX-cert Parasound amp to the 3803 early next year which should bring me up to snuff power-wise with the 5803 for far less money.

    Reg

    btw, I've settled on Paradigm Studio 20's as my main/rear/surround speakers...FINALLY. I waffled on and on for months over what speakers to settle with, and now I think I've found the right speaker for me.
     
  13. KeithH

    KeithH Lead Actor

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    Reggie, you are upgrading fast! Which Parasound amp are you looking at? Parasound makes excellent amps for the money. I'm sure you will be happy with whichever model you get. It's too bad there are really no pre-pros in the price range of the Denon '3803, as I would rather have "true" separates than use a receiver as a pre-pro. Oh well. Just my $0.02.
     
  14. Matt Jesty

    Matt Jesty Second Unit

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    I believe the term for this type of customer in the retail industry is "lay down." They simply come in and say
    "I don't have a clue, just give me something good."
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ++++
    Actually a "lay down" is when someone comes in knowing exactly what they want and not asking ANY questions....
    Most wealthier people have done some research and consulted with some friends so they know enough to test your knowledge and see if your "b.s.ing" them, then once they are convinced that you know what you're doing then they feel more comfortable...there are many people on this forum, i'm sure, who run their own buisnesses and have made themselves "experts" in every aspect of it (ie; computers), while othewrs have more money than time and simply hire the experts....I'm sure that many customers know that there are cheaper deals available on-line and still choose to buy at msrp because the time/hassle factor outweighs the price...my cousin went out to the local radio controlled air field to get familiar with the gear neccesary to get started witha really good set-up, he flies takes it into the hobby shop ,has them fix it, tune it up ,etc. then flies some more ...he does not have (or want) the workshop in his basement to fix everything himself , but he spends that time flying his planes with his son.....differant strokes...
     
  15. KeithH

    KeithH Lead Actor

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    When I was in high school, I, admittedly, lived in a wealthy area (not being snobby, just honest) and worked in a toy store. For a good part of my time there, I worked in the Nintendo department. Games were priced between $35 and $50, and customers would regularly come in and say something like, "My son's birthday is coming up and he likes Nintendo. I want to get him a few games. What's good?". Since I didn't get a commission and because I was never comfortable taking advantage of people, I didn't just recommend the most expensive games. I would simply recommend the games I thought were best. It's still funny that people would ask me to help them spend their money. Many people would spend $200-300 on games based solely on my recommendations. Amazing.
     
  16. Tomas_S

    Tomas_S Agent

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    I picked up my 3803 from my local retailer this weekend along with a new Definitive Technology set up. I was the first one to buy one since they just got them in the day before.

    I previously owned the 3801 and this is definatley a better made product. Although I haven't had a lot of time to break it in and review it, I can say that the 2 channel audio is killer on this compared to the 3801. The 3801 seemed very bright to me but this is much warmer with tighter bass.

    The remote is re-designed. Much easier to use. I hated the 3801 remote!

    Off course I've got brand new speakers too..But I still say this is a great receiver for the price. I was able to pick it up for $1020.
     
  17. Phil_O

    Phil_O Stunt Coordinator

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    Tomas, did you compare the two receivers with the same speakers or different ones? That will make a huge difference in the perceived sound of the receiver.
     

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