denon 3803 vs pioneer 45tx (1 Viewer)

[Dave_La]

Has anybody ever compared the two? I currently have a Marantz 7200. Originally the receiver was meant to power my Perfomance line Paradigms. But I recently went all out for Paradigm Reference line setup. The result is not what I expected. I expected more clarity and midrange. The speakers sounded better at my friend's house using Denon 1602. Would an upgrade to a denon 3803 or pioneer 45tx be any help. These are the two I have narrowed down to. They're about the same price. I use it for 70/30 HT/music.

 

[DavidVT]

Dave,

I do not have Paradigm Reference speakers, but I do have the 45TX, and love it. I have heard the 3803, but was not for me. I have Klipsch Reference 3 speakers and 2 SVS Subs, for a 7.2 system.

From all that I have read, to get the most from YOUR speakers you need alot of power to supply your speakers.

Probably not going to get the power from either receiver on your short list, so IMHO you may need to check on a seperate amp.

Hopefully someone with more knowledge on the Paradigms can chime in for more assistance.

 

[Dave_La]

Dave, is the Elite 53tx a newer model of the 45tx?

 

[DavidVT]

Dave,

The 53TX replaces the 43TX, the 55TX is replacing the 45TX.

 

[Jon_Welker]

When I was looking at receivers in that range, the Denon wasn't even on my short list. Ended up with a 45TX, and haven't looked back. It's been able to do everything that I have asked of it since I bought it, which includes a 5.1 surround system, 2 channel stereo for CD's, powering some outdoor speaker, switching component signals etc.

 

[Gerry S]

The two replacement models for the 45tx are the 53tx and 55txi.

Both these receivers are the same, except the 55txi has the Ilink connection (IEEE 1394)and a nicer remote. Check out the Pioneer website for pictures of the different remotes.

 

[David Judah]

They are both great receivers in the around a $1000 price range(the 45TX is being discontinued so it is discounted quite heavily). I prefer the 45TX for both music and movies over the 3803, but I don't think you could go wrong either way. Of course, it will boil down to personal preference, so you should listen to both before purchasing.

The Pioneer's MCACC gives it the edge, IMO.

DJ

 

[Dave_La]

I'm considering the 53tx. Hope it'll outperform my Marantz 7200 in both music and HT. Ebay has it for $750 and the retail is $1500, is that right? That's a big bargain.

 

[Will^B]

In my opinion if you're going with the latest models, I'd hit up the 55 instead of the 53, cause from what i have seen the 53 isn't much better then the 43 which you can find for 300+ dollars cheaper.

 

[DavidVT]

Dave,

Personal preference here, but I too would go from the 45tx - 49txi or the 55txi. The 53 just does not have the feature set of the older models. I have heard the 53, but liked my 45 better, but maybe the 53 was set incorrectly, i dont know, the sales rep wouldnt allow me to mess with it. Have you did a search on paradigm reference via the speakers and subwoofers forum. I audition the paradigm 100s which I loved. Which model did you end up choosing?
Check out some of the on-line electronics marts for cheaper prices on the 55. Although sometimes you can get a good deal via ebay, sometimes you bite the bullet via gray market equipment....what is gray market? NO WARRANTY !!!

Sometimes even this is not bad, when they offer you a warranty and the price is usually way under the MSRP.

Below is one example, I have heard good things about this one:

Click here !

Whatever you end up choosing, I am sure you'll love the sound for both movies and music.

 

[Gerry S]

Guys maybe I am missing the boat here but the 53tx and the 55txi are pretty much the same with the exception of the Ilink and the remote. I checked out Pioneer's website just to be sure. I think the 53 is better than the 43 - one thing that stands out is the 53 has auto calibration and the 43 doesnt. I think the numbers are confusing people, because my dealer has told me the 53tx is the replacement for the 45tx.

Please list the different features between the 53tx and the 55txi before I make a mistake and get the 53tx. I want to be sure I havent been misinformed.

Thanks.

EDIT: Just visited pioneerelectronics.com again! The only difference between the 53tx and the 55txi are:
I-Link – Advanced Resolution Multi-Channel Digital Audio Interface & Control
RS-232
USB Input
Phono Input
-It also has a nicer remote.

 

[MikeRP]

Hi Dave:

I have Paradigm Studio 40s, CC, and ADPs. I also own the 45TX. I bought the 45 last September before the 3803 was out so I only have the 3802 as a comparison.

However, the 45 TX is a fine receiver and I think very difficult to beat. However, I'm sure the 3803 is good and it comes down to features. Which ones do you like best?

I don't know about sound - I think I could make either one sound the same but one thing is for sure - I can't beat the MCACCs presentation. I've worked hard on bettering it but I can't do it.

The only thing I've noticed about the MCACC is when you have your listening position up against a wall (which you shouldn't do anyway but I do because of wifey:frowning: ) - the MCACC will deemphasize the rears and up the fronts. But, that's not an issue for me.

I recommend the 45 53 or 55Txi highly and don't think you can go wrong with the Pioneer.

Good Luck!

Mike

 

[Chip Brogden]

Mike, can you or anyone who is reading this explain the MCACC to me, how it works, what it does, auto vs manual, and what competitors offer to its comparison. Thanks.

 

[Scott_Jua]

here are some of my opinions from when I did my buying search. These are taken fromj older threads on the subject, but if you want a comparison between then two here's some rambling:

...I tried to be as neutral as I could with my mini-review. The pioneers I tested were NOT calibrated using the MCACC function and all the receivers were set to source only...zero across the boards for processing and EQs. I took ALOT of time getting that and volume levels set so I could really evaluate the sound differences in the hardware respectively (since each had slightly different specs).

I used a few discs: Pearl Harbor (DTS and DD tested chapters 11,22; full range and surround separation), Toy Story 2 (opening buzz scenes, bass, mids, surround), Tombstone (DTS OK corral shootout for dialogue and naturally recorded sounds), Star Wars EPII/EPI (various scenes, full range, etc.), and some others... I was surprised at the quality level between sound formats and discs. Each test scene had unique characteristics, but helped me hear the differences between each receiver and how they handled different material. I think the Pioneer was the most accurate and consistent in my experience. The Denon seemed consistent as well, but had no tonal characteristics I favored. The 4ES varied more...but oh so slightly. The differences are there if you REALLY listen for them and pay attention. I wouldn't think you would tell much if not switching between receivers often enough. Just coming in off the street or home from work they all sound pretty bad arse. (Don't want to make this an outright Pioneer fan fest.)

Ian, I did do the comparo at Ultimate, but not just the one in Plano (I hit them all basically), Tweeter (more than one location), and even hit Hillcrest. There are more places that sell the receivers but I wanted to get the speakers I am looking at also (other than the SVS I have, which nothing can match in store) identical or as close as possible so I could keep a relative constant in the listening results for myself.

I even threw in Onkyo as a possibility but listening to that once threw it out of contention for me. Overly bright, with good mid but poor lows for me. Decently accurate though.

all that being said, once I got my 45TX home, I realized how much more of a difference AUTO MCACC made compared to manual calibration. It's worth it weight in gold for my crazy room shape. The 45TX in my house made such a huge difference it wasn't even funny.

Hope this helped...

 

[Dave_La]

Wow, long post. I have:

Mains - 60s
Rears - 20s
CC - CC
Sub- PDR-12

I'm seriously considering an upgrade to PS-1200, hoping it'll give me more tigther bass and go lower than 35Hz. Mike what sub do you have?

Anyway, a knowledgeable guy from ecoustic.com just told me Elite would not pair up Paradigms well at all. He's suggesting I should add an amp. Maybe the Outlaw 7100 100x7. And that's what I'm looking at right now. Not going the new receiver route.

 

[Scott_Jua]

Anyway, a knowledgeable guy from ecoustic.com just told me Elite would not pair up Paradigms well at all. He's suggesting I should add an amp.

??? ???

 

[MikeRP]

I don't know who the guy is at ecoustics but I'd guess I'd question how much knowledge he has.......


Check out the Manfacture Date thread over on AVSForum under receivers. Do a search on MikeRP and you'll find it. Many of the users there have Paradigm.

How loud will you really the music consistently? If you have Studio 100s an amp maybe in order but Brae on this forum has the 45 with 100s,CC, and ADPS and drives his setup to very loud levels. I bought a 2 channel ADCOM amp and after a while I decided it was a worthless distraction.

The euro version of the 45 tested 135 WPC driving 5 channels - not a bad amp section.

However, if you can afford it an additional IS great. And you'll find the 45 is an excellent pre-pro.

Right now I haved a Def Tech Pro 100 and in my room it is fine but I'm going to upgrade to a Servo or the V3 Pw-2200 or an SVS. Not sure which yet.

Good Luck on your decision.....

Mike

 

[Scott_Jua]

I don't know who the guy is at ecoustics but I'd guess I'd question how much knowledge he has.......

I have to second that remark... per my confused look post above

 

[JackS]

Scott- I've read your post and still beleive that many people will buy what they think best be it Elite, ES, Denon etc,etc. All these receivers are serving their purpose to their individual owners and their opinions may differ from yours and mine. However, the one thing I think we can all agree on is that the Elites' are the Farrari's in the parking lot in a sea of other just as capable but mundane looking receivers. Anyone walking into a shop cannot help but notice the Elites'. The look of the Elites' is a feature unto itself. Couple this with fine proformance and it's easy to understand why many people may use this "looks" feature as the final deciding factor in their purchase. I don't own an Elite but I can't argue with anyone with this perspective. Very very nice receivers.

 

[Adam_Reiter]

Considering you can get a FULLY WARRANTIED Denon 3803 from Dakmart*com, for $809, I would say HANDS DOWN go for the Denon. That is just my opinion.