I recently picked up the 3803 as an upgrade to the 3802 used as a preamp but not 100% pleased with the 3803's brighter presentation. I have the opportunity to return the 3803 for a Demo 5800 for another $500. While the 5800 I always thought was a very good receiver it seems outdated today featurewise. One thing I will miss is DPL2:Music and a straightforward remote of the 3802. I've heard the gripes about the Atkis remote but not sure how bad it is or what is a good alternative remote. I do have a Sony RM-AV2100 hanging around not getting much use. I've also heard of the Denon upgrade for the 5800 to near 5803 status but not sure how long this will be available. The priority for this system is very good 2 channel with good HT reproduction using Sonus faber speakers and Hsu TN1220 sub. If the 5800 (hopefully I could do the upgrade kit later) is a bad idea then I will probably look at replacing the 3802 with something from B&K, Rotel, and hopefully a new Sony ES pre/pro if that ever happens. Whaddaya think?