Denon 3802/3803 vs 5800

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by Gil D, Dec 16, 2002.

  1. Gil D

    Gil D Supporting Actor

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    I recently picked up the 3803 as an upgrade to the 3802 used as a preamp but not 100% pleased with the 3803's brighter presentation.

    I have the opportunity to return the 3803 for a Demo 5800 for another $500. While the 5800 I always thought was a very good receiver it seems outdated today featurewise. One thing I will miss is DPL2:Music and a straightforward remote of the 3802. I've heard the gripes about the Atkis remote but not sure how bad it is or what is a good alternative remote. I do have a Sony RM-AV2100 hanging around not getting much use. I've also heard of the Denon upgrade for the 5800 to near 5803 status but not sure how long this will be available.

    The priority for this system is very good 2 channel with good HT reproduction using Sonus faber speakers and Hsu TN1220 sub. If the 5800 (hopefully I could do the upgrade kit later) is a bad idea then I will probably look at replacing the 3802 with something from B&K, Rotel, and hopefully a new Sony ES pre/pro if that ever happens.

    Whaddaya think?
     
  2. Yogi

    Yogi Screenwriter

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    You mean the 3803's preamp is brighter than the 3802's? If you already have amps then go with a separate prepro like the Rotel or Outlaw that are close to the 3803's price? Receivers will be receivers so why dont you go the next step and get a separate prepro instead?
     
  3. Gil D

    Gil D Supporting Actor

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    .
     
  4. Phil Mays

    Phil Mays Second Unit

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    If it were me I would get the 5800 in a "skinny minute". You could have the unit sent of for the upgrade for under $500 additional $'s that will make it a 5803.

    To me $1,000 additional $'s for a 5803 -vs- keeping a 3803 is a no brainer.

    Phil
     
  5. Gil D

    Gil D Supporting Actor

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  6. Wayne Ernst

    Wayne Ernst Cinematographer

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  7. Yogi

    Yogi Screenwriter

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    My feeling is that the upgrade option will run out soon. Denon would have made only limited quantities of this upgrade cards and I don't think they might have made one for every 5800 out in the field. So unless you can act on it quickly you might end up with a 5800 without the possibility of an upgrade.
     
  8. Jerry Klawiter

    Jerry Klawiter Screenwriter

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    There are some real fire sales now at Audiogon on used some with full or near full warranties via dealers on the B&K AVR 305-307, Prices from one dealer at $1400+ - $1600+ respectively.
    Not sure how these prices compare with your Denon deal,
    The only catch is B&K has not released the upgrade or cost.
    This just may come in the first quarter of 03.
    I have the older flagship Denon AVR-5700, Still love the magic it preforms, Also had the B&K Ref 20,30 and now 50.
    Audition several B&K 305-307s just for kicks.
    They are all very comparable. [​IMG]
     
  9. Gil D

    Gil D Supporting Actor

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  10. Jerry Klawiter

    Jerry Klawiter Screenwriter

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    Gil,
    The upgrade should include the Motorola 56367 chipset on a new board with the new DAC's, this should include all the new DSP modes of the current products.
    Maybe They will offer the 10.1 (MX-700) remote as a option to purchase with the upgrade.
    Denon had the edge feature and format wise?

    How is this? I have the 5700 and only wished it offered the features of the 305. I do like the Denon personal memory plus, Although the B&K matched that and much more with setup source default flexibility. The fixed cross-over on the Denon should have been flexible. Help me out, what features did the Denon have that was missing from the other?
    I feel they both sound fantastic.
     
  11. PatrickM

    PatrickM Screenwriter

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    As for the Aktis remote. Its not as bad as some people say but then again, its not as good as a Pronto. I find it quite usuable and I've programmed in macros and "learned" other remotes I have with no problems.

    Patrick
     
  12. Gil D

    Gil D Supporting Actor

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  13. Jerry Klawiter

    Jerry Klawiter Screenwriter

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    Gil,
    One nice feature of Denon is the addressable digital inputs.
    As for speakers used.
    Wow, I have used Paradigm 100's 60's 40's 20's all v2
    and the CC, CC450
    I even had the B&W N802 for a short while.
    These had been used with both the 5700 and a Ref30
    I will stay away from speakers used over the years.

    Now I use the Ref50 with Mirage OM-5 mains, OM-C2 center
    and the OM-R2 for the surrounds. with a Velo HGS sub.

    The denon is in a scaled back second system only used with a Toshiba 36" HD direct view tv.
    Infinity RS3 mains with center, and of all things atoms for surround duty. The sub is the Earthquake supernova MKIV.

    Since we installed the dlp pj and a 103" screen the Denon does not see much work, the reason the better speakers have been sold off. Plus the addition of some in-wall speakers. I think the next to go will be the Mits Diamond hd rptv, as that seldom gets used after the pj.
    I felt Paradigm was a good match, although a bit forward to my liking. This is not a Paradigm knock.
     
  14. Gil D

    Gil D Supporting Actor

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    I returned the 3803 today.

    The 3802 I have unquestionably has a warmer and more musical sound. The sound was just flat out of the 3803 with a poor stereo image compared to the 3802. I am hoping the 3803 I had was a faulty unit and may audition another one along with the 5800 and 5803.

    Anyone else compare the 3803 to the other Denon's?
     
  15. Yogi

    Yogi Screenwriter

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    I am getting a feeling that with the current rate of format changes and all the feature wars manufacturers are starting to overlook the most important aspect of audio gear and that is sound. I had a feeling that the 3801 sounded better than the 3802 (atlest on my speakers) and now people are finding that the 3803 even sounds worse than the 3802. There were findings elsewhere that the 1803 sounded worse than the 1802 so this does look like a trend. This doesn't look so good[​IMG] esp for the people that are looking to upgrade to the new models.
     

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