Denon 2802 or Yamaha 2200?...Do I even need to ask?

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by DerekF, Nov 27, 2001.

  1. DerekF

    DerekF Stunt Coordinator

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    I need to decide whether to purchase a Yamaha RX-V2200 or the Denon 2802--both available to me for the same price (it's a long story...).
    The way I see it, the following are the associated pros and cons--please add any you feel appropriate. I would appreciate any and all advice on this!
    Denon AVR-2802
    Pros:
    I've heard it, and I like the sound
    Reputation
    Tons of positive press/reviews
    Cons:
    Remote
    Yamaha RX-V2200
    Pros:
    More power (100 vs 90)
    DSP modes galore
    Remote
    Component vid goes to 60MHz (Vs 27 in Denon)
    More ins/outs
    Front ins/outs (I have 2 console games...)
    Cons:
    I haven't heard it--no reviews available
    Generally an unknown....
    Thoughts? Thanks!
     
  2. Dan Hitchman

    Dan Hitchman Cinematographer

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    Denon 2802. Gotta love that DTS-ES Discrete 6.1 IMHO (until the next big format-- whatever that may be).

    Don't worry about the manufacturer's specs. of 10 watts difference in amp power. You'll never hear it. The specs. don't tell the whole story anyway and are sometimes even misleading.

    As for the component video bandwidth on the Denon, it's fine for DVDs at least. HDTV is moving towards a digital video interface of DVI and/or FireWire at the demand of the MPAA. Analog wide-band component is something Hollywood does not like since it's not digitally encrypted and IMHO its days are numbered for full resolution HDTV video signals.

    Dan
     
  3. Kyle_Y

    Kyle_Y Stunt Coordinator

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    I'm willing to hear the long sotry[​IMG] How did you get the price of a 2200 to the price of a 2802. I would have to side with the Denon. What kind of TV are you using and what kind of speakers? I don't think the 60mhz video signal will make any noticable difference. Denon's also have a nicer sound, not as harsh as some Yamaha's.
     
  4. DerekF

    DerekF Stunt Coordinator

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    Actually they both have DTS ES discrete 6.1....their feature set in the "6.1 arena" is pretty much a tie...
    *sigh* which makes it all the harder to decide.... [​IMG]
     
  5. DerekF

    DerekF Stunt Coordinator

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    Kyle: Here's the abridged version of the long story....

    I buy a Denon 2802 (yesterday) after weeks of research. New neighbor comes over for a beer, sees HT and says "Oh, by the way, I have a very good friend who owns an AV/HiFi store, and if you ever need to buy anything, just let me know and he'll swing you a deal..." And it turned out to be true.

    RE my equipment: This is my first serious purchase, upgrading from a Technics (pre digital) HT in a box, w/a 32" Hitachi Ultravision....
     
  6. Jeff Weight

    Jeff Weight Stunt Coordinator

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    How can you even consider the 2802 compaired to the Yamaha? The 2200 is comparable to the 3802. While the 2802 is comparable to the 1200.

    As far as sound is concerned, the Yamaha wins. It is more nuetral than Denon, and has cleaner highs. I have listened to the 2200 side by side with the 3802 on the same B&W speakers.

    I'd get the Yamaha, but you have to be happy with your purchase in the end. Let your ears be the judge.
     
  7. Bob_A

    Bob_A Supporting Actor

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    IMHO you would be quite happy with the Yamaha...but you still want to find a receiver which matches best with your speakers. Whether this is denon or yamaha, who knows?
     
  8. MatthewJ S

    MatthewJ S Supporting Actor

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    I sell both and without knowing the specifics of your set-up ,etc....I would have to give a large nod to this yammie(vs that denon) in most situations...if you have not heard their ToP-Art amps this year then go and listen....smooth
     
  9. Kevin. W

    Kevin. W Screenwriter

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    If your spending more than $1600CDN and unless you really need 6.1 then how about getting into seperates? Rotel makes a nice 6 channel AMP that can be configured anywhich way you like(6x60, 5x70.., 3x150) and you could pair it with a Marantz AV560(ebay.ca, new in Box with RC-2000 MKII remote worth $300CDN). Just a thought.

    Kevin
     
  10. JonathanJ

    JonathanJ Auditioning

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    Derek,

    I've been looking into the RX-V2200 for some time now. I've had the opportunity to directly compare both the Yamaha unit and the Denon 3802.

    Everyone on this forum will tell you that your decision will be based on a number of other factors such as your speakers, Percentage of home theater use versus music use, and finally just your own personal taste when you hear the unit play. With that said, I still found it useful to get someone elses opinion, so here it is.

    Both of the receivers bascially have the same options, wattage, etc. I'm not really into the specifics concerning their inputs because I'll never fill them all anyway! I listened to the Denon and the Yamaha and I found the Yamaha to be much clearer and cleaner when listening to music. I sounded as if the speakers were muffled when the Denon was playing. I also didn't like the appearance of the Denon, I thought it looked and felt a little cheap compared to the new Yamaha.

    I know there are a lot of Denon fans on this forum, and I've only heard good reviews about the 2802 and the 3802 so it must be an excellent unit. However, my personal taste leads me to the yamaha.

    By the way, you think your friend can give any of us a good deal on the RX-V2200????

    Jonathan
     
  11. Matt Taylor

    Matt Taylor Stunt Coordinator

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    Derek,

    I might be able to help you out. For two years I had the Yamaha 2095 and loved it. Just this month, I sold it and bought a Denon 3802 (because I couldn't turn it down for $799 from an authorized b&m dealer). I have NHT 2.5i mains and an Audiocenter-1, so they need a lot of power. The Denon is actually rated 10 watts higher than that Yamaha.

    My experience after 3 weeks...the Denon sounds better. I prefer the warmer sound that the Denon sends to the speakers. The Yamaha was very bright, like Yamahas are inherently. I got used to that sound over two years and actually preferred it, but was converted shortly after hearing the Denon in my setup.

    I can't comment on the DTS ES discrete yet becuase I haven't bought speaker wire to run to the surround center channels!

    You would be happy with either one, buy my preference is towards the Denon.

    Matt
     
  12. DerekF

    DerekF Stunt Coordinator

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    Thanks for the feedback everyone--I'll try and answer a few of your questions:
    Speakers
    While I do have five speakers and a sub, they are all relatively low quality, and are my next planned purchase. With this in mind, I am not basing the receiver purchase on the speakers, rather the future speaker purchase will be based on the receiver....(confused?[​IMG] ) Center channel will be next, and based on reviews alone, I've narrowed the speaker audition list to Paradigm, PSB, DefTech and Klipsch.
    Cost, and separates
    The deal I would get on the Yamaha is equivalent to getting a bit of a deal on a Denon 2802 at an authorized dealer in Canada (Denons are more expensive here than in the US if based on exchange rate alone). Since I have already doubled my initial receiver budget (was looking at a *gasp* Kenwood!), the added cost of separates is out of the picture.....for now.
    Spec for spec, the Yammie seems to win hands down--it even appears to have a much nicer remote (not fond of the 2802 remote)...but I'm a review junkie, and there aren't any on the 2200 yet...
    Since the 2200 compares to the 3802 (my first pick, but too pricey in Canada), it seems to be an inherent "step up" from the 2802...
    Still unsure...
     
  13. NickSP

    NickSP Supporting Actor

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    Of those 2 receivers, I would go with the Yamaha 2200. Like someone said before, its a competitor to the 3802. If you are getting both for similar prices, then definitely go with the Yammy.
     
  14. DerekF

    DerekF Stunt Coordinator

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    Sorry--forgot to give some basic background info:

    The receiver will be used 80% HT, 20% music.

    I wired the house for sound when I built, and included a center surround outlet (explains my interest in surround ES)

    The viewing area itself is relatively small, but the entire left side is open to a pool table etc.
     
  15. ChrisAG

    ChrisAG Supporting Actor

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    Has anyone listened to the latest Yamahas compared to the pre-digital Top-art models? I read numerous posts stating that the old models (RX-V995 and below) were harsh.

    Also, I remember reading somewhere that the sound of the 2200/1200 has been changed from the previous 1000/800, which were the first ones with the so-called digital Top-art. Is this true?
     
  16. DerekF

    DerekF Stunt Coordinator

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    I have downloaded the Yamaha 2200 manual, and checked out all the links/comparisons on their site (their fall 2001 catalog is out, BTW).

    Anyone know any other sources of information on this unit? Comparisons, reviews (though it's new), opinions etc....?

    Thanks!
     
  17. Paul Wu

    Paul Wu Stunt Coordinator

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    Chris: I recall reading the same thing wrt Yamaha. The x95's were 'bright - harsh' the 800/1000 was more 'warmer' or 'not as harsh' a noticable change. And the new 1200/2200 are the newest with a slightly different sound, but close to the 800/1000
    I myself have a Yamaha 595 and like the 'detail' but have avoided listening to any new receivers as I can't afford any. But I'm really itching to hear the new 1200/2200's
    Derek: My personal vote would be for the Yamaha. You do need to listen to the receiver as the past reviews on Yamaha's are not relevant tot he sound quality. Not sure if this will make a difference to you, but the Denon has an adjustable crossover for bass going from 80Hz, 100Hz, and 120 Hz; the Yamaha has a fixed crossover at 90 Hz.
     
  18. Bob_A

    Bob_A Supporting Actor

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    I have also heard that the newer Yamaha's are not "bright". Even so, I have never found my DSP-A1 to be bright. Very clear and crisp, but not bright.
    Derek, if you mate Yamaha with Definitive Technology, you should be one happy camper!!! Take a look at my DT setup guide: http://www.hometheaterforum.com/htfo...threadid=28668
    Good luck!
     
  19. Mike_Ch

    Mike_Ch Stunt Coordinator

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    Derek, I have a Denon 2801 and when I bought it earlier this year, I did an A/B comparison with the Yammie RXV-800. To me, the new Yamahas are very smooth and detailed, unlike their bright, harsher sounding receivers of old. Compared to the Denon, the Yamaha had better imaging in 2 channel (it uses better Burr-Brown DAC's I think), and seemed more powerful, especially if you're thinking of driving 5 speakers and no sub. I chose the Denon because I got a good deal for it, and I now also have an external Rotel 3 channel amp so power is no longer an issue [​IMG]
    Hope this helps,
    Mike
     
  20. DerekF

    DerekF Stunt Coordinator

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    I've decided.

    I'm going to go for it and get the Yamaha 2200. Basically, even though I like the Denon unit, I have serious reservations about the remote--and the deal on the 2200 is just too good to pass up!

    Thanks for all the advice--I'll post my 2200 observations as soon as I can.

    Derek
     

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