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Denon 1600 DVD player? (1 Viewer)

KeithH

Senior HTF Member
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Mar 28, 2000
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9,413
Reggie, Good Guys does not ship merchandise outside of its region, which is the west coast of the US. Crutchfield is the only mail-order dealer that I know of that is authorized to ship Denon merchandise anywhere in the US.
 

ReggieW

Screenwriter
Joined
Mar 6, 2001
Messages
1,571
Thanks for clarifying this Keith.

I guess since I'm on the west coast, Then I could probably take advantage of this Good Guys deal. Then there's forum member Earl "the pearl" Simpson, who claims I can get the best deals on Denon merchandise at Denon authorized 6th avenue buy using him as a reference.

We'll see...

Reg
 

ReggieW

Screenwriter
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Mar 6, 2001
Messages
1,571
Keith,

I too am disappointed that the "Secrets" review didn't at least compare the 1600's DVD-A/CD performance to that of the Onkyo 939 which they reviewed last year. My take on their review is that it is a reference quality player in terms of video quality, but John Johnson didn't comment as much on the audio quality - which he did say was very good.

Reg

Note: Denon Jeff over at the AVS forum did say that the Denon 3800 and 9000 were superior to the 1600 in the audio department (he has tested all three). I would only guess that the 1600 is probably nearly as good as the Toshiba 9200 and Onkyo 939 since these are older models, but not as good as the new higher-end models on the market (and those forthcoming like the Toshiba 9500).
 

KeithH

Senior HTF Member
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Mar 28, 2000
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Reggie, no problem. See what Good Guys can do for you. If you get the '1600, let us know.
You wrote:
I would only guess that the 1600 is probably nearly as good as the Toshiba 9200 and Onkyo 939 since these are older models, but not as good as the new higher-end models on the market (and those forthcoming like the Toshiba 9500).
I wonder how "outdated" the Toshiba SD-9200 and Onkyo DV-S939 are. DACs only tell a part of the story, remembering that you have to use the analog outputs for DVD-Audio. So, if the '1600 has state-of-the-art DACs, it could be lacking in other areas as a $500 player in comparison to the '9200 and 'S939. The '9200 originally retailed for much more than the '1600, and the 'S939 still sells for much more than the '1600. I'm also not sure if the '47A would beat the Onkyo or Toshiba players. Furthermore, the Rotel RDV-1080 is a very good player and probably still holds its own with DVD-Audio.
Although I haven't used the 'S939, I've listened to the Integra version, the DPS-9.2, as well as the Integra Research flagship RDV-1 a few times in a store, and I came away impressed with both. Strangely enough, one of the British magazines in a review of a handful of DVD-Audio players last year gave the 'S939 and '1 poor ratings on the audio side. I was surprised.
I only have limited experience with the '9200, but it is a nice component. There have been some reliability issues associated with it, which is a shame. I would like to see how the '9500 compares.
If I were serious about replacing my Technics DVD-A10, I would demo the Rotel, Onkyo, Integra '9.2, Denon '3800, and Toshiba '9200 or '9500 players. No one dealer in my area would have them all, so I would have to test some leading candidates at home, which is a good idea anyway. It would be worth the effort and interesting at the same time.
 

Joe Cole

Second Unit
Joined
Aug 1, 1999
Messages
282
No problem Keith. I do have that xa777es, if I didn't I might have been interested in the new Phillips. I'd like a dvd-a player and since I am looking for a chroma problem free player this denon dose sound good. I am definitely a SACD fan but would like to check out the other HD music format as well. So far SACD seems to have much more of the type of music I listen to. There is a Beethoven 6th piece on dvd-a I'd like to hear.
Thanks for all the info on authorized and unauthorized dealers. My current dvd player is the Pioneer Elite dv-37 which according to secrets is one of if not the worst offender for the chroma error problems. I do notice it once in a while but not much. Oh, and I bought it from a non-authorized dealer on the web before I knew what that meant. They said they would take care of any problems, of which there have been none in the 18 months I have owned it. But, one never knows. I had been waiting for the 3800 but since it has the chroma error I am passing on that one. Why would Denon do this, allow the error to be on their expensive models but not their 'lower end' model? Most disappointing! :frowning:
I should have never have read up on this problem. ;)
 

KeithH

Senior HTF Member
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Mar 28, 2000
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Joe, give DVD-Audio a try. Since progressive-scan output is important to you, the '1600 might be the right player for you. The 'RP91 is also excellent on the video side, but I would bet the '1600 beats it on the audio side.

Pioneer's progressive-scan players are known to be very bad with the chroma bug. The Denon '1600 would probably beat it on the video side. Give it an audition!

You said:

I had been waiting for the 3800 but since it has the chroma error I am passing on that one. Why would Denon do this, allow the error to be on their expensive models but not their 'lower end' model? Most disappointing!
The '1600 is a rebadged Panasonic 'RP56, which does not have the chroma bug. Denon decided to go with its own design for the more expensive models and blew it on the video section. It boggles the mind.
 

stephen_z

Stunt Coordinator
Joined
Mar 20, 2002
Messages
117
KeithH and others,

Sorry for the typo on MSRP for DVD963SA... it is re-quoted at $499. This came from the audioasylum site as follows:
 

stephen_z

Stunt Coordinator
Joined
Mar 20, 2002
Messages
117
Sorry, lets try that again... AudioAsylum post as follows:
http://www.audioasylum.com/forums/hi...ges/63380.html
I know it seems crazy that the 963 should be lower in price than the 962, but that's the electronics business.
The upsampling comment came from this forum's post from
the "Any Philips DVD Experts Here?" by ManojM.
And my comment on "do you have to buy this immediately?" was addressed to Randy B A.
 

Neil Weinstock

Stunt Coordinator
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Nov 28, 2000
Messages
176
The Secrets review failed to address two issues (well, partially) that are of primary interest for me with the 1600:

1) does is suffer from the "flicker bug" that afflicts the RP-56?

2) How does the DVD-A "bass management" really work? On avsforum there was a massive discussion that all it did was to add the low frequency content from the mains to the sub channel, without a high pass filter on the mains, or something like that. The review says about 2 words on the subject, stating that there's a HPF on the mains (suggesting the presence of a true crossover) but not going into nearly enough detail to convince me.

Does anyone know the answers to these questions? If Denon addressed both of them, the 1600 really could be the ideal not-quite-entry-level prog-scan DVD-A player; if not, then $500 seems way too much for it (for me, anyway), and I'll wait to check out the new Sony and Panasonic players.
 

Joe Cole

Second Unit
Joined
Aug 1, 1999
Messages
282
Neil,
What is the 'flicker' bug?
I just got back from Tweeter where I demoed TS 1 and 2 on the 1600. The red and blue images where spot on great. There was a couple of places where there was some ringing(maybe)at the bottom of a red rectangle. A sort of shimmering effect. The TV was a 32" Sony Plasma 16x9 screen. The video was hooked up using very cheap audio cable, the kind that comes with vcrs, for the component cable. Even with these cables the picture was very good. However Tweeter would not come down even $50 off of their list price. I just can not pay list in this business. Which is too bad since I like to try this player at home for a month. Maybe I am being too 'cheap' over $50 but to me it is a principle.:)
Now I am kind of thinking that the privilege of taking the unit home for 30 days, no questions asked, is worth the extra $50.
After further research on this forum, I now know what the 'flicker' bug is and the 1600 has it some what. At least on the TS DVDs I watched. I'd like to take the Enemy at the Gates DVD to the store now since someone said that it was one of the worst DVDs for this problem.
 

Nick Cicutti

Auditioning
Joined
Jan 10, 2002
Messages
8
I now wonder if perhaps this player's video section is a not a complete transplant of the Panasonic RP56? I don't recall the 6.75 resolution test to reveal this level of detail with the Panny. By comparison, the Panny is somewhat rolled off in the high frequencies providing a slightly soft image (at least when contrasted to their own RP91). This would suggest that Denon does not use any sharp high frequency filter in this unit as they did with the 2800. If this is the case than the 1600 would indeed be a superior player and arguably the bargain of the year if this added detail is not accompanied by excessive ringing.

nc
 

Joe Cole

Second Unit
Joined
Aug 1, 1999
Messages
282
I broke down and bought the 1600 Friday evening. After watching TS 1 and Enemy at the Gates and parts of StarWars my comments are as follows:
1. The colors are great. It is very nice not to have banded colors and ziggys.
2. There is no flicker bug on this model.
3. The over all image is much sharper and cleaner than my Pioneer. So much so I now understand why folks complain so much about edge enhancement. I only saw a small amount of it before.
4. Have not tried the dvd-a portion of the unit yet. Maybe today.
5. It is much smaller than my Pioneer Elite DV-37. ?????
6. Oh, the optical only out seems to be very good and just as detailed as the digital coax out on the Pioneer. The bass may be a tiny bit less explosive. Just turn up the gain on sub out.
Toy Story was so much brighter and colorful on this player than my old one. :D It is almost too intense to watch. Looking forward to TSII viewing.
I hated buying from a dealer that would not come down in price but they do have a good return policy and a 4 month trade up policy.
 

KeithH

Senior HTF Member
Joined
Mar 28, 2000
Messages
9,413
Joe, congrats. on the pick-up. Let us know what you think of DVD-Audio on the '1600.
 

Jonathan Burnett

Auditioning
Joined
Jun 30, 2000
Messages
7
Chroma bug aside, does anyone have an opinion regarding the progressive scan processing chips in the 1600 versus the 3800? Faroudja DCDi on the 1600 and Silicon/DVDO on the 3800.

Also, has anyone tried the 1600 connected to a Pioneer RPTV? I have the 710HD an am concerned about the progressive output of non-anamorphic DVD's and the Pioneer's automatic switch to FULL aspect ratio "feature". Is there a switch or mode setting on the Denon that would help the Pioneer display non-anamorphic DVDs correctly?

Thanks!

Jonathan
 

Chris Madalena

Stunt Coordinator
Joined
Mar 6, 2001
Messages
126
Johnathan,

Yesterday I bought the 3800 and was VERY disappointed in the video quality. Tonight, it's going back. My pioneer 533 did a better job at 3:2 pull down then the 3800, and quite honestly I didn't see that big of a difference in video quality over my Technics A10. Certainly not worth 1200.00. I think I'm going to try the 1600. Gotta have that dvd-a!!
 

Marc_E

Supporting Actor
Joined
Oct 9, 2001
Messages
769
I have had the 1600 for about a month now and I love it. I have a pansonic H1000 also and the 1600 has a better picture. Sound IMO is great redbook and DVDA. A great player at a great price.

Marc
 

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