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Dead or Alive 6

Discussion in 'Gaming' started by Bryan^H, Mar 9, 2019.

  1. Message #1 of 59 Mar 9, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 9, 2019
    Bryan^H

    Bryan^H Lead Actor

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    I picked this up today, and to be honest it might take the place of DOA 4 as my all time favorite fighting game. The graphics, and gameplay are beautiful, and flawless. It is catered to new players as well which is a good thing, it needs more fans than a game like Mortal Kombat (which I plan on getting as well:D).

    But one of the things that has been a staple in DOA games since released 22 years ago has been nerfed:
    https://www.lakebit.com/koei-tecmo-explains-why-it-changed-its-approach-to-sexual-imagery-with-dead-or-alive-6/
    “Sexual imagery has been a part of the series’ image and its marketing, but things change. That kind of imagery is less acceptable than it was, and can even mean that some media outlets don’t want to show those images. So we changed”, said Shimbori.


    I don't even have the words to say how disappointing this is. The media is controlling minds, and it is frightening!

    And in case you were wondering....the reviews for this game (even being toned down) down are still getting bashed by reviewers for being sexist. :angry:



     
  2. Clinton McClure

    Clinton McClure Rocket Science Department
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    I have to admit that I bought DOA 4 (I think that was the one, although it might have been 3) on Xbox 360 when it came out because I really wanted a good fighting game. While I found it frustratingly more difficult than the Tekken games I was used to, I think the shapely women that bounced and jiggled in interesting places was one of the chief reasons I played it as much as I did. I haven’t bought a fighting game in years but I might look into DOA 6.
     
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  3. Jeff Cooper

    Jeff Cooper Cinematographer

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    Well, one only needs to look at the $96 first(!) season pass to understand why they took all of that out. It's all included there instead of the main game for a low low price, of course!!
     
  4. Clinton McClure

    Clinton McClure Rocket Science Department
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    I don't buy into all the season pass garbage.
     
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  5. Bryan^H

    Bryan^H Lead Actor

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    Nothing new. DOA 5 has $1,200 worth of DLC. Not kidding.
     
  6. Morgan Jolley

    Morgan Jolley Lead Actor

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    The only DoA game I played was 2 back on the Dreamcast and PS2. I remember it being good but very Japanese in style (the characters are very soft-looking, versus something like Street Fighter looking like cartoons or Mortal Kombat looking "gritty") and fast, but I was playing a lot of fighting games back then and it didn't have enough in it to make it my favorite.

    As for toning down the sexual stuff, I think that's fine. It's a fighting game, so anything that detracts from the fundamentals and potentially puts off 51% of the public by being too overtly sexual about mainly one gender is only going to hurt the reputation of the game and undermine the serious amount of work that the developers put into it. Having games focus too much on appealing to teenage boys really helps the non-gaming public stereotype the hobby negatively. If you want to see boobs bouncing around while two girls wail on each other, there's the previous 5 DoA games along with the entirety of the internet to scratch that itch.
     
  7. Message #7 of 59 Mar 11, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 11, 2019
    Bryan^H

    Bryan^H Lead Actor

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    Nice insult to the game developers and fans of the series Morgan.
    I don't appreciate that dig. And as far as negative impact of the game on the hobby because of sexual tone (even though it is rated Mature) do you think all games should be sensored because they may be too violent, or sexual?

    The beauty of video games is that there are vast types of games to play for everyone. When video game developers have to alter their vision, and change a game because of the fear of public outcry, or a sign of the times, that is a huge artistic compromise and a huge step backward for the gaming industry.
     
  8. Message #8 of 59 Mar 11, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 11, 2019
    Morgan Jolley

    Morgan Jolley Lead Actor

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    When an artist is showing self-restraint, it's not censorship. It's an artistic or business choice, one which I fail to see as having a negative impact on the game. No government or media watchdog organization forced Dead or Alive 6 to have the jiggle physics turned down or the bikinis covered up with more clothing.

    I am not really a fan of the DOA series but I do have a large interest in gaming. I would rather the industry be able to produce experiences that cater to a wide variety of people with a wide variety of tastes, but in a way that also respects the audience. While the DOA games have always been well-made fighting games, the sex appeal was a large piece of it's popularity. Dialing that back in order to let the talent of the designers shine is not exactly a bad move.

    There's also a difference between having some sexiness in a game versus having an "age" setting that acts as a subtle jiggle-physics toggle for the female characters' boobs.

    Would you feel the same about the game if all of the male characters were completely naked?

    EDIT: Also, I think one aspect that you highlighted and I may not have touched on a lot was that this was probably a business decision, and a rather good one. I see this game having a better chance at selling well and having media coverage highlight how good the mechanics are with less attention on things that would turn people away, simply because they're not pushing the sex so much. Maybe it's a sign of the times, maybe it's a business decision, but either way it's the right call on a larger scale than appealing to just you or me.

    EDIT 2: Also also, I want to clarify that I would not boycott this game or the developer if it has more sexy content, nor do I support the idea of that. In the end, they should make the game that they want to make for the reasons that they want to make it and the audience should decide if it's good, bad, and whether they want to spend their money on it. I don't favor official censorship but I do support developers taking a more...progressive approach.

    For what it's worth, DoA 6 is currently getting some very average reviews (sitting around ~75% average) and they aren't docking points because it isn't sexy enough.
     
  9. Clinton McClure

    Clinton McClure Rocket Science Department
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    The jiggly physics is really the only thing that has made the DOA games stand out for me. Mortal Kombat, World Heroes, Street Fighter, Tekken, and Samuri Showdown have always been superior games in my eyes. Now that they’ve neutered their cash cow, I expect it to not sell super well and the devs will change course with the next one. Of course, I could always be wrong.
     
  10. Morgan Jolley

    Morgan Jolley Lead Actor

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    Honestly, Mortal Kombat was a so-so fighting game (especially compared to stuff like Street Fighter and Tekken) but with tons of violence. The appeal WAS the violence. They've evolved it over the last 2-3 iterations to something more mechanical and technical while retaining the gore, but it wasn't exactly a good series (even though I'm a fan, I'm saying this).

    Dead or Alive has always had a pretty great combat system. The majority of the series got mid-range review scores because it didn't evolve much, even though it started pretty strong. DoA2 is a high point for the series...20 years ago. The games only got jigglier after that and scores/sales didn't seem to significantly change.

    I can't say that any one particular person's taste is good or bad because it's subjective, so I can't say that your interest in this series only involving the boob physics is good or bad. But I think your broader assessment that this game is going to be a failure BECAUSE of the toned-down nature of it is misguided. The series has sold about 10 million units across 5 games, but when you count the various editions (there were 4 versions of DoA5 alone), we're looking at roughly 1 million units per game, about 1.5 million for the last few installments. It's my understanding that DoA6 is on track to beat that pretty quickly.

    I'll also note that a similar controversy popped up while they were making DoA5 and the developers decided to keep the skimpy stuff in the game because the fans wanted it. I believe it also had slightly lower sales than DoA4. So far, 6 hasn't been doing so well, but I imagine that's because the reviews have talked about the not-so-fun single-player modes and the outrageous DLC costs (even though that was also an issue for 5). I haven't seen much backlash because of the toned-down sex.
     
  11. Message #11 of 59 Mar 12, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2019
    Bryan^H

    Bryan^H Lead Actor

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    Judging from Japan launch numbers which are a fraction of what 5 sold, and very weak North American launch as well this may be the last installment of the series. The absurdly priced DLC has finally forced a backlash. It will sell well under a million copies worldwide.

    Here is a pretty good video review for 6 that has a nice history of the series
     
  12. Bryan^H

    Bryan^H Lead Actor

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    In other news the latest Dead or alive Extreme which like the last entry on the PS4 will only be released in Japan (but still playable and in English on PS4, and Switch) is getting censored for the PS4
     
  13. Bryan^H

    Bryan^H Lead Actor

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    I had to change my messages/voice chat to " friends only" as random people I beat online send me angry messages. I'm having flashbacks of 2007 playing DOA 4 on the 360.

    Some things never change, but if you can't handle losing, don't play online.
     
  14. Message #14 of 59 Mar 18, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 18, 2019
    Bryan^H

    Bryan^H Lead Actor

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    Artistic business choice...which was essential for the developers that feared the backlash of American critics, and the media's refusal to cover the game because of the content. in other words the game has been compromised, as stated in the very first post of this thread.

    And the negative impact is that we are going backward in time. That isn't progressive, that is degressive.

    Honestly Morgan, why are you not understanding this?
     
  15. Message #15 of 59 Mar 18, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 18, 2019
    Bryan^H

    Bryan^H Lead Actor

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    First, DOA has always been over the top--- true Japanese style game. As their sense of humor, and likes are different from American audiences (which sadly is much less so now because of their will to change the game in accordance to American standards).
    The "jiggle physics" have always been less about titillation, and more about humor.


    Second,
    There is no one completely naked in any DOA game, and never has been. in fact we are talking PG-13 style brief nudity for a few females in cut scenes in DOA 4, and before. Most of the male characters in the game have much less clothing that the female characters in DOA 6. In my opinion the DOA games being MATURE, and not TEEN rated, should have pushed the envelope more. They had every right to do so.
     
  16. Morgan Jolley

    Morgan Jolley Lead Actor

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    What exactly have you, as someone who is playing DoA6, lost from the game as a result of them opting to be slightly less overtly sexual? Are the mechanics worse? Is the story worse? Is the game no longer worth even buying? Or is there just less side-boob and under-butt?
     
  17. Bryan^H

    Bryan^H Lead Actor

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    Never mind
     
  18. Morgan Jolley

    Morgan Jolley Lead Actor

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    I'm trying to figure out what part of the artistic vision of wildly flailing boobs and almost-nudity was REALLY lost when the developers decided to tone it down, because the reviews seem to highlight other issues with the game as negatives that are completely unrelated to the lack of titillation.
     
  19. Jeff Cooper

    Jeff Cooper Cinematographer

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    This whole discussion is moot anyway. The bounce physics are alive and well just fine in DoA 6.

     
  20. Morgan Jolley

    Morgan Jolley Lead Actor

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    Which, again, goes back to my question from before: what exactly was lost from the experience with this "decision?"
     

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