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Crisis On Infinite Earths - Arrowverse Crossover 2019

Discussion in 'TV Shows' started by Garysb, Aug 4, 2019.

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  1. Thomas Newton

    Thomas Newton Screenwriter

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    My impression was that, on the outside, the building looked less like the headquarters for the Justice League than like the headquarters for the Super Friends. Then throw in the music, and the mention of Gleek (the blue space monkey who belonged to the Wonder Twins) …
     
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  2. NeilO

    NeilO Producer

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    I really enjoyed the final two parts, yelling out in glee several times. It was a really nice finale and I am looking forward to seeing where the shows pick up from here. Nice summaries by Adam above of what looks like the new status quo.
     
  3. David Weicker

    David Weicker Producer

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    The biggest omission was Thea. From an Oliver standpoint obviously, but also for the Sara story (however awkward it would be for killer/victim meeting).
     
  4. NeilO

    NeilO Producer

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    Does anyone know what the story is about this scene in the fifth part (found out, but still leaving post in):
    The two Barry Allens. Anyone know who the second one was? Who is the actor? Something to do with the movies?

    Just looked it up on google. It is Ezra Miller - the Flash in the 2022 movie. Just amazing!
     
  5. Message #185 of 201 Jan 15, 2020
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2020
    Garysb

    Garysb Producer

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    Some burning questions answered from TVline.

    Crisis on Infinite Earths' Burning Qs Answered!


    January 15 2020, 11:38 AM PST

    [​IMG]
    Courtesy of The CW

    The CW’s five-part “Crisis on Infinite Earths” crossover event, which concluded Jan. 14, left us with lots of questions — here, from Arrowverse overlord Marc Guggenheim, are several answers, about no-show Reverse-Flash, Laurel, Baby Sara, MIA Iris, that big-screen cameo and other topics.

    [​IMG]
    PHOTO : COURTESY OF THE CW
    WHY DIDN’T THE FLASH FACE OFF AGAINST REVERSE-FLASH, AS IRIS’ NEWS STORY HAS LONG FORETOLD?
    “I guess what it really comes down to is not being beholden to a headline from six years ago that was not written by any of the showrunners involved in the crossover,” says Arrowverse EP Marc Guggenheim. “A lot of things drive our stories, and a lot of things determine what choices we make….. To me, tracking toward a headline written six years ago is literally the definition of ‘the cart driving the horse.’

    “We’ve had Reverse-Flash so prominent in the Arrowverse over the years, including in last year’s crossover and the crossover before that…. I love the character and I love Tom [Cavanagh] as a person, and I certainly love Matt Letscher’s version, but you have to make choices.”

    [​IMG]
    PHOTO : COURTESY OF THE CW
    WAS THERE ANY ELEMENT FROM THE COMIC BOOKS THEY REALLY TRIED TO INCORPORATE , BUT SIMPLY COULDN’T?
    “Good question. I’ll leave the answer to that to the folks on my Twitter feed,” Guggenheim jokes.

    “Obviously, there are always financial limitations we run up against. We made the decision very early on that we were going to spend our money on bringing over as many characters from other universes and other properties as possible, and we did that knowing that it would probably limit the scale and grandeur of some of the fight sequences. But you make your bed and you lie in it.”
    [​IMG]
    PHOTO : COURTESY OF THE CW

    DOES THE NEW MULTIVERSE OLIVER CREATED HAVE DOPPELGANGERS? LIKE, IS THERE A STARGIRL ON MULTIPLE EARTHS OR JUST THE NEW EARTH-2?

    “The thing that excited all of us is that we’ve created this new status quo,” says Guggenheim. “You got a taste of it in [‘Crisis’] Hour 5, but the fun for all the shows now, going forward, is you get to peel back the layers of the onion on that. So, I don’t actually want to answer; I would much rather see those answers come in the form of the actual episodes.”
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    PHOTO : COURTESY OF THE CW
    LEX LUTHOR REGARDED AS NOT JUST A GOOD GUY BUT ‘THE BEST GUY’ IS A FUN THING FOR SUPERGIRL TO PLAY WITH. WILL WE SEE OTHER RIPPLE EFFECTS? IS CONNOR STILL ADOPTED BY JOHN AND LYLA, WILL WE SEE BABY SARA IN 2020…?
    “You won’t see Baby Sara in [Arrow] Episode 809 [airing Jan. 21], but we have absolutely talked about how if that [Green Arrow and the Canaries] backdoor pilot goes to series, what does Adult Baby Sara look like — including what we are going to refer to her as. [Laughs]

    “But the thing that has us really excited is we have now put into our universe a new mystery which is: What does this post-Crisis universe look like? Each of the shows gets the chance to tell a piece of that story, and that’s really cool. I know, for example, what they’re doing on Batwoman and it’s friggin’ awesome, with some unbelievable, ‘What-the-f–k?!’ kind of moments. In addition to the heart and emotion, the ‘what-the-f–k?!’ is the Arrowverse all about.
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    PHOTO : COURTESY OF THE CW
    IS THE LAUREL IN ARROW‘S BACKDOOR PILOT, LIKE, A ‘MERGED COMPOSITE’ OF THE ORIGINAL AND HER EARTH-2 DOPPELGANGER?
    “[Episodes] 809 and 810 [aka the series finale airing Jan. 28] will answer that question very definitively. You’ll learn which version of Laurel we have been left with in 809, and you will learn why that is the case in 810.”
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    PHOTO : COURTESY OF THE CW
    SPEAKING OF LAUREL…. WHERE WERE SHE, AND IRIS, AND CISCO, AND MIA? ESPECIALLY IN ‘CRISIS’ PART 5?
    “Maybe one day we will tell that story,” Guggenheim hedges, “but again, all of those actors need to be paid, and they need to be paid a crossover rate that is above and beyond their episodic rate. That forces us to make hard financial choices that unfortunately occasionally drive the creative choices.”
    [​IMG]
    PHOTO : COURTESY OF THE CW
    WERE SMALLVILLE‘S VERSION OF CLARK AND LOIS ‘RETURNED’ AFTER CRISIS?
    “I absolutely can confirm that they’re still alive, they’re still living their happy ending,” Guggenheim reports. Previously established to have given up his Kryptonian powers to lead a normal life as a family man, “Clark is getting the hero's ending he deserves."
    [​IMG]
    PHOTO : COURTESY OF THE CW
    SPEAKING OF SMALLVILLE, WHAT WAS THE PLAN FOR THAT LEX LUTHOR IF MICHAEL ROSENBAUM SAID ‘YES’ TO THE CROSSOVER?
    “We had a version where he would have been in the scene [on the Kent farm] with Tom [Welling], and then the clock ran out on that [due to Welling’s availability],” says Guggenheim. “I then had the idea of having [Rosenbaum] and [Supergirl‘]s Jon Cryer have a scene together, which would have been really, really cool.

    “It’s a bummer,” Guggenheim concedes. “Michael is definitely the one that got away.”
    [​IMG]
    PHOTO : COURTESY OF THE CW
    WHY WAS IT A PRIORITY TO HAVE THE DC MOVIES’ FLASH, EZRA MILLER, MAKE A CAMEO?
    “It’s not that it wasn’t a priority, but it was something that only became a possibility for us after we wrapped the crossover,” Guggenheim shares. “The crossover was done, we had finished. And then I got a phone call from [Warner Bros. TV chief] Peter Roth saying, ‘Would it be possible…? Could we logistically and creatively make it happen?’ I said, ‘Absolutely!’ But that was something that was presented to us by the Warner Bros./DC organization. Peter said to me, ‘How are you going to do this?’ and I said, ‘I have no earthly idea. You’ve just thrown me this amazing ball!’

    “Why move heaven and earth to make this happen after you’ve already wrapped production on the crossover? The answer is ‘because it’s really friggin’ cool!'”
    [​IMG]
    PHOTO : COURTESY OF THE CW
    DID EZRA MILLER NEED TO BE SNEAKED ONTO SET, AWAY FROM THE PAPARAZZI’S PRYING LONG LENSES?
    “The funny thing is you would think that we had to employ all these ‘CIA techniques,’ but he flew into Vancouver, paparazzi didn’t notice, he drove onto the Vancouver Film Studios [lot]….

    “I want to say a sincere thanks to the cast and the crew — particularly the crew of The Flash. Any one of them could have ratted us out, and you’re talking about a couple hundred people, but everyone worked together to keep this secret. We thought about announcing it, but decided it’d be so much more fun to surprise everybody."
    [​IMG]
    PHOTO : COURTESY OF THE CW
    IS THERE EVEN A HALF OF A HALF OF AN IDEA FOR THE ARROWVERSE’S NEXT CROSSOVER EVENT?
    “I would say I have ‘ideas for ideas,’ and I’ve sort of pitched to [The CW CEO] Mark Pedowitz and [executive producer] Greg Berlanti what, if left to my own devices, I would like to see us do. There is a rubric that is semi in place… and both Mark and Greg have signed off on that, and as we go onward, things will get more and more specific. I was emailing Mark just the other day, that we have to all get in a room together to talk about this. We typically do a post mortem about what went right, what went wrong, what did we learn…. We always learn something."
    [​IMG]
    PHOTO : COURTESY OF THE CW
    IS ANOTHER MASSIVE TEAM-UP EVENT OFF THE TABLE?
    “Look, I hate comparisons to [Avengers:] Endgame, beause it’s just not fair — we’re working with Endgame‘s catering budget — but Marvel didn’t follow up Endgame with Endgame 2. I think you’ve got to build to an event of this kind. The one thing we’re all in agreement on — cast, crew executives, you name it — is that we’re not going to go as big next year. In fact, Mark [Pedowitz] and I were talking about ‘returning to the roots’ of our crossovers, and I’ll leave it to people to interpret what that means.”

    More Burning Questions From EW

    Crisis on Infinite Earths' boss answers burning questions about Earth-Prime, Ezra Miller, and more


    January 15, 2020 at 01:01 PM EST

    Warning: This article contains spoilers about the final two parts the Arrowverse’s “Crisis on Infinite Earths” crossover, which aired Tuesday.

    Worlds lived. Worlds died. Worlds were reborn. And the Arrowverse will indeed never be the same.

    This year’s five-part crossover “Crisis on Infinite Earths” threw a lot viewers: Oliver Queen’s two deaths; Beebo!; Ezra Miller’s cameo as The Flash; the death and rebirth of the multiverse; and of course the creation of Earth-Prime, which is now home to all of the CW’s superhero shows, Arrow, The Flash, Supergirl, DC’s Legends of Tomorrow, Batwoman, and Black Lightning. Naturally, all of this left us with some questions. So EW hopped on the phone with crossover executive producer Marc Guggenheim to get some answers.

    [​IMG]
    COLIN BENTLEY/THE CW; INSET: PHILLIP FARAONE/GETTY IMAGES
    ENTERTAINMENT WEEKLY: You tweeted that DC Entertainment CCO/Publisher Jim Lee played a pivotal role in pulling off the Ezra Miller cameo. How did he help it all come together? Also, did any of the people on the film side have input on the contents of the scene?
    MARC GUGGENHEIM: Absolutely. Basically, I was really working hand-in-hand with Jim. From the moment we found out that this was a possibility, to once we knew Grant Gustin was cool and on board with it and Ezra was on board with it, I would send drafts of the scene to both Jim Lee and [DC Entertainment’s film VP] Adam Schlagman and we would just go back and forth. The trick with the scene is that I didn’t want to and they didn’t want me to do anything that stepped on the toes of the Flashpoint movie that they’re developing. So, we really worked hand-in-hand. Jim was really great about just making sure that all the parties were talking to each other, that nothing was getting stalled. He was a cheerleader when he needed to be, a diplomat when he needed to be. He really stepped up in every way one could do it. His enthusiasm really helped make this possible.


    The Crisis comic destroyed the multiverse and condensed everything into a single Earth. Here, though, you guys decided to reboot the entire multiverse. Why did you want to do that?
    Basically, I promised DC and all the powers that be that if they just let me destroy all the various different shows in hour 1, I would bring them back in hour 5. I promised that I would put all of the toys back in the toy box once we were finished. For us, the most important status quo change was, of course, combining the CW shows into a single Earth. I like to think that I’m a considerate enough showrunner that I’m not going to destroy the shows of other showrunners.

    The Legends hour establishes that the DC Universe show Stargirl takes place on Earth-2 in the new multiverse. What does that mean for all the characters who were on the old Earth-2, specifically with Earth-2 Laurel who is a major character on Arrow? How is her continued existence explained?
    Actually, that question is very directly asked by Laurel herself in the Arrow series finale. There’s actually a really, really poignant scene between her and Paul Blackthorne, who plays her dad, that explains that. Speaking to that larger question, one of the things that really excites all of us involved with the Arrowverse shows is that by rebooting the universe, we’ve given ourselves a new central mystery, which is the question: Okay, what does this new universe look like? You got a little bit of a taste of it in hour 5, and going forward we’re going to continue on all the shows to peel the layers of the onion on what that looks like. That’s really, really exciting for all of us.


    [​IMG]

    Arrow‘s next episode is the Green Arrow & The Canaries backdoor pilot. How does this new Earth-Prime affect Star City 2040 and Mia’s storyline, especially since she wasn’t present in the final two hours?
    I don’t want to spoil too much the backdoor pilot. I will say that this universe restart affects the entire universe, which includes the future. I will also say the backdoor pilot gives you a very clear answer to that question.

    “Elseworlds” setup Psycho-Pirate as a player in the coming Crisis, but the character ended up not appearing in the episode. Was there ever a version of the crossover that included him?
    No, we actually had Psycho Pirate in various iterations, in various different ways. It’s funny, you go into this type of event thinking, “We’ve got five hours and that’s going to be all the time in the world to tell every single story and include every single character we want to and do every single moment we have in mind.” When you actually start breaking it, you discover wow, there’s still never enough time and there’s never enough space to do all the different ideas. Psycho Pirate was one of those characters that was in and out, and in and out. We basically realized that given the story we were telling, the only reason we were having him in there was because he was in the original comic. When we’re finding ourselves forcing moments just to be faithful to the comic, that stuff is usually the first kind of moments to go, actually, much to chagrin of my Twitter feed.

    So far this morning I’ve seen some mixed reaction to the Arrow hour. How did the idea to trap some of the heroes in the Speed Force come about?
    Basically, that was something I sort of came up with [when] I was flying back from Prague. Because we knew we were killing off Oliver, I wanted to come up with a conceit…You know, back when we had the writers’ room, we had talked about basically the characters being scattered throughout the Speed Force and Barry would sort of have to hunt for everybody. We didn’t quite have a clear idea as to what that would look like, but what occurred to me was that it was an opportunity to kind of revisit a series “greatest hits” for Oliver, key moments in terms of his relationships. That was very important to all of us involved with the crossover because we knew Oliver was dying at the end of the episode, so it’s a little bit of a “Before you die, your life flashes before your eyes” kind of feel. That was really important to us that we look backwards before Oliver’s death.

    You could’ve placed Kate, who is relatively new, in a number of places. How did you decide to drop her into that scene between Oliver and Ray from season 3’s “Suicidal Tendencies”?
    I’ll be honest: We kind of knew that Brandon was already contracted to be in that episode, so we knew he would be in that episode. Originally, we were going to do a scene where we revisit Arrow [617] where Oliver and Diggle fight and she would have to break up Oliver and Diggle’s fight. But season 6 was relatively recent and we kind of wanted to go a little further back in the canon and that episode “Suicidal Tendencies” is actually one of my favorite episodes; it’s certainly one of my favorite episodes of season 3 because I just love the tension between Ray and Oliver, and I particularly love it in light of how much all of the shows have evolved and relationships between the characters have evolved. In picking those moments we were looking back to, that kind of idea of showing how far the characters have come really drove a lot of those selections and decisions. Like, let’s show Oliver and Kara really not liking each other. Let’s show Oliver and Ray really not liking each other. It’s fun to illustrate how far everyone has come right before you kill off Oliver.
     
  6. Dave Scarpa

    Dave Scarpa Producer

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    Can someone explain to me the ending showing all the earth and the doom patrol, swamp thing etc, I thought the multiverse was gone at the end and all the heroes were on earth prime at the end
     
  7. Thomas Newton

    Thomas Newton Screenwriter

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    In the comic book Crisis, there was only one universe at the end. Simplifying continuity by dumping all of the others was the point. (Until later, when there was another big crossover to reverse this.)

    The ArrowVerse Crisis replaced the destroyed multiverse by another multiverse. Many of the characters from existing ArrowVerse series are now grouped together on Earth-Prime. But there are other characters on other "new ArrowVerse" universes. This leaves the door open for the writers to tell alternate universe stories if they feel like it.
     
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  8. Josh Steinberg

    Josh Steinberg Executive Producer
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    That last shot of Routh as Superman... that made my night.

    I wish someone, somewhere would greenlight something with more of him in the cape.
     
  9. ponset

    ponset Second Unit

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    Overall pleased with CRISIS ON INFINITE EARTHS. 'B'
    Nice seeing Marv Wolfman with a cameo asking Flash and Supergirl for an autograph.
    Wolfman also co-wrote the ARROW episode.

    All the CW DC Shows are now Earth-Prime.
    Glad to see the multiverse was also reborn.
    Big Smile cross my face when I saw that Stargirl and the Justice Society are on Earth-2.
    In the Pre Crisis comics thats where the Justice Society hail from.

    Like Josh this scene gave me another Big Grin.

    brandonrouthsupermanfarewell.
     
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  10. Garysb

    Garysb Producer

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    That costume must have been very expensive to make for just for that one shot. As one of the youtube bloggers said you never know maybe they have something in mind to use the suit again.

    I liked how one of the producers mentioned they could have called it Earth CW instead of Earth Prime. In the comics Earth Prime originally was the Earth with no superheroes or essentially our Earth where the only superheroes were in the comics. Then Superboy Prime happened.
     
  11. Thomas Newton

    Thomas Newton Screenwriter

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    As in, an extremely sociopathic version of Superboy. A spoiled, destructive, uninteresting brat who managed the rather difficult task of being less sympathetic than Darkseid or the Anti-Monitor.

    if I remember correctly, he once tried to fly through Oa at top speed because he thought that destroying that planet would cause immense destruction to the rest of the Universe. Anti-Monitor might have claimed that life had no right to exist, and might even have half-believed it. Superboy Prime's motives are more akin to those of a kid who gets his fun by torturing small animals because he can.
     
  12. Sam Favate

    Sam Favate Lead Actor

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    I caught up with all the Crisis episodes, and i enjoyed them, but I have a few questions.

    I'm not really clear on what was going on all the time. Like, in #4, the characters are trapped in the speed force but they're in parts of the Arrowverse's history? Because why? And they have to retrieve one another how?

    The final episode seemed like an epilogue rather than a finale. Now they're on one earth but they're fighting lingering threats from the anti-monitor? And Oliver is nowhere to be seen? It seemed anti-climatic. And I guess Lex Luthor is a hero here? Will Lena's company be called LuthorCorp going forward?

    As for the multiple earths, I see they have the DCU Titans and Doom Patrol on different earths -- but they met each other in season 1 of Titans! I think this was a goof on somebody's part.

    And here's a more personal question: I just got a new TV, it's an LED screen (my previous TV was a 12-year-old LCD). Why does the LED screen make shows like this look like filming for a soap opera? Is it the TV lighting? I'm aware of how staged everything looks and I can't put my finger on why. (And it's not just this show, it's many.) Will I get used to this? 'Cause right now it's kinda ruining TV for me.
     
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  13. TonyD

    TonyD Who do we think I am?
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    You have to turn off motion smoothing or whatever it’s called on your tv.
     
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  14. Chip_HT

    Chip_HT Supporting Actor

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    It kind of mirrors the structure of the comic Crisis. The main action, including the merging of the finals Earths all finished up in #10, and then the last two issues followed the heroes getting used to the new world and changes. Unfortunately, no one behind the scenes really coordinated the post-Crisis Earth so it didn't really match up with what eventually got established in the individual character reboots over the next few years.


    The multiverse got reset. On one end, we have Supergirl of Earth-38 now living with the heroes of Earth-1. Likewise, the Titans and Doom Patrol might have gotten separated.

    Or...Titans and Doom Patrol have always been on different Earths, and the ones that crossed over were just the dopplegangers from the Earth of the home characters.
     
  15. Thomas Newton

    Thomas Newton Screenwriter

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    Oliver "died" for a second time after the fight with the Anti-Monitor at the Dawn of Time. (If "died" is the word for someone who was already dead.) Whatever happened, it seems that he is no longer the host for the Spectre. So as far as we know, he's gone to his final reward.

    That meeting is part of old history, history that could have been rewritten by the reboot of the multiverse.
     
  16. NeilO

    NeilO Producer

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    Oliver/Spectre explained it. He said that they were lost in the speed force, but their strong connection were through memories. So, by searching through Oliver's memories, Barry was able to collect them all.

    We will have to see what develops on Supergirl to see what the status quo is there. Apparently substituting himself as the paragon of truth and then ultimately acting as a hero against the Anti-Monitor, Lex got a different history in the merged Earth.
     
  17. TonyD

    TonyD Who do we think I am?
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    I’m sure it’s still the same old Lex. Just that now he has the wool pulled over everyone and they all think he’s a good version.
     
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  18. Garysb

    Garysb Producer

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    I didn't think there was any doubt that Lex is still a psycho and that he changed reality so that he is thought of by everyone as this great guy. I mean that wink he made at Kara wasn't gosh how good it to see you Supergirl, more Heh Heh Heh. At least Lena shouldn't be behaving like a 5 year old whose friends keep a secret from her.
     
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  19. Message #199 of 201 Jan 17, 2020
    Last edited: Jan 17, 2020
    Adam Lenhardt

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    I'm thinking that it's the same Kingdom Come suit he wore in the rest of the crossover, and in post-production they just rotoscoped the black parts of the "S" shield yellow for that one shot.

    The Anti-Monitor tried to kick them out of the Speed Force. The Spectre kept them all in the Speed Force, but since he'd merged with Oliver Queen, their locations in the Speed Force were all tied to Oliver's past interactions with them.

    I think the Anti-Monitor is done, but there will be plenty of storytelling opportunities that arise from the merged Earth. In particular, bad guys from "The Flash" and "Arrow" can now show up on "Supergirl" and "Black Lightning" and vice-versa.

    I'm guessing he'll be back one more time in the "Arrow" series finale. The Spectre's narration at the end strongly suggested that he/it survived.

    It sure looked that way.

    Two different versions of the Doom Patrol. For one thing, the Chief on "Titans" was played by Bruno Bichir, with the Chief on "Doom Patrol" is played by Timothy Dalton.

    The Lex of Earth-Prime's timeline might have been a genuinely nice guy, but he got "overwritten" with the Earth-38 Lex that was one of the paragons. So he certainly won't be a nice guy going forward.
     
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  20. Sam Favate

    Sam Favate Lead Actor

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    Now that I think of it, Supergirl's writers can get a lot of mileage out of this Luthor. While everyone on Earth thinks Lex is a hero, Supergirl knows better and can work to show everyone how bad he is, so she'll really be out there on her own (or with Jonn).
     

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