CowBoy Bebop (1 Viewer)

[Andy_B]

Why not just watch it in OSL and go home happy? The actors are much better, even if the dub cast did a tolerable job.

Please, this is just your opinion, stop stating it as fact.

IMO, the dub actors blew away the original actors. I know that kills some people to hear but I would take a good english dub any day over a language that I can not understand.

If I want to read, I will simply go to the library.

Andy

 

[Joseph Young]

I happen to agree with Jeff Kleist on this one..
It's not just about 'reading subtitles.' If that was the only point to watching Original Language tracks, I wouldn't do it, either!
I want to hear the original spoken Japanese language... that is the whole reason I do not listen to dubs. Regardless of whether you understand Japanese or not, regardless of whether you prefer the English dub or not, there is no denying the inflections and subtle wordings unique to Japanese that do not come across in any other language.
There are expressions of 'humor' and 'anger' and other emotions unique in Japanese language that I have a real fondness for. For me, that's almost the whole appeal of anime. It's a visual art style very unique to its culture and it goes hand in hand with the language. If you're watching dubs, good for you, you're watching a well done and engaging translation and you don't have to 'read anything.'
I am deeply interested in linguistics, and when I watch anime I am always partially watching it in a cultural context. Despite the fact the English dub is great (the acting is fine), when I hear English actors I'm not getting the same semantics... just different ones. Ones that I feel rob me of the purest viewing experience possible.
I guess that makes me a snob. Just as this forum advoates OAR, I am a staunch advocate of the original language track. And I respect other peoples' rights (and sometimes due to physical issues they have no control over) to need the english dub.
Peace,
Joseph

 

[Jeff Kleist]

Joseph said it before I got back to the thread

If you insist on OAR, but shun OSL, you are hypocritical, no way around it. The original performances are just as integral to the film as the AR.

 

[Jeff Ulmer]

While I wouldn't begrudge anyone a dub track, I'm in the same camp as Jeff Kleist and Joseph Young. I watch films of all languages in their original soundtrack with subs. Anime is very much about the use of Japanese language and expression, which can not be translated verbally into English. My opinion of course.

 

[JasonRH]

I don't usually worry about watching something in it's "true form". I will watch all language tracks and decide for myself which one I like better. Sometimes, IMO, the dub can surpass the original language (if other than English,of course). I admit that it is rare but it does happen. Just because something was recorded originally as one track doesn't mean a new track with new actors in another language can't be more effective. It may be that English is just more identifiable but I don't think it is impossible to have "better" english VA's, assuming the script wasn't altered too much. Just my opinion.

 

[JasonRH]

While I'm in this thread I'd like to thank JEFF KLEIST, JEFF ULMER, and others for recommending the animeigo Macross boxset. Seeing that the way it was originally intended was a pleasure.
That is one GREAT example of the original recording being FAR superior to the English dub. I do admit that, in general, you guys are absolutely right about the original language track being superior. Cowboy bebop, to me, was one of the rare exceptions though.
Thanks again, especially the two Jeff's.

 

[John Spencer]

Count me in with Jeff, Jeff, and Joe. Even if it is a well-done dub, it's just that: a dub. I enjoy watching any movie in its OSL if at all possible. If anything, it lets you know how the makers wanted the characters to sound. Have you ever listened to the OSL track for Princess Mononoke, then tried listening to the (very well-done) English dub? Boy, some of the characters just don't seem the same, and it's all due to vocal representation. Same goes for movies like Akira. I grew up watching dubbed VHS tapes and loved the movies then. But now, boy, I have a whole new outlook on a lot of my old faves. I still love them, but E-dubs just don't cut it anymore.

 

[Morgan Jolley]

Usually, I watch something first in english to get an idea of whats going on, then watch it a second time with the subs so I can learn what it is supposed to sound like originally. I could care less about which one is better, as long as I get to see it and at least one is good.

For Cowboy Bebop, I have yet to finish the series, or watch the subs, so I for now will say that the English dub is very good and I would not mind just having it. There is something to be said for a good Japanese dub, but if the english is as good as it is for Cowboy Bebop, the Japanese dub is just an extra feature of the DVD for me.

 

[Michael St. Clair]

Robotech isn't really a good example of dub versus sub, since they were actually changing the story from Macross.
Remember when Nausicaa was butchered into 'Warriors of the Wind'? I do...
Anyhow, anime is typically produced with the voices recorded after the animation, unlike most western animation. In fact, based on the strict definition of the term in the industry, anime is dubbed in japanese!
Frankly, where cultural differences are great, even subs have to often oversimplify because there is not enough room to keep up with the dialogue.
Some anime directors have liked some dubs, and there have been cases where the english voice talent was preferred by the director over the japanese voice talent!
Sherlock Hound (Miyazaki) is coming...it was first dubbed in english, then translated into italian and japanese...which language will you choose? Yes, this is not a typical case.
That said, I use the original soundtrack over 90% of the time, and I never buy a release that does not have the original soundtrack.
But there are some differences between anime and other movies, and sometimes an english dub is not against the intent of the creators (and not just on Sherlock Hound).

 

[JasonRH]

Michael,

The story was changed, true, but in that case I meant the quality of the voice acting, not in the competing scripts, per se. I should have clarified how I meant it was a good example of dub vs. sub. In general, I refer to the acting when I compare the two, and not the script, unless that applies or becomes an issue.

Strangely, the story wasn't changed as drastically as I expected it would be.

 

[Chad Ferguson]

While I agree with a movie always having the original language and subtitles for those who don't speak the language, I feel Cowboy Bebop has something going most Anime's don't. While I think we all agree the Dub is far from being just average. Also, it had recieved an even bigger fan base from the show been shown on The Cartoon Network which I'm guessing was shown in subbed form. If I'm right about that then they are in the same pool as me. These are the characters we have grown to love, so it would be a huge blow to mylsef if the dub was not included with it. I feel we should have the best of both worlds in this and I think everyone would agree. Columbia, please come through on this title. I guess we'll find out when Metropolis is released cause it will have the trailer for the movie on the disc.

 

[Jim_K]

If you insist on OAR, but shun OSL, you are hypocritical, no way around it. The original performances are just as integral to the film as the AR.

This is exactly how I feel. If I come across as an OSL snob then so be it.
BTW the Bebop dub from the portions that I tried was mediocre at best IMHO. Comparable to Saturday morning kiddie cartoons.
Personally I don't care if someone listens to the OSL or the lame-ass Dub track. What bothers me is having to wait an extra so-many months so they can do this spoon-fed dub track and having that space on the disc used up which could go to improved picture quality or more episodes per disc.
If I offended anyone I'm sorry but to me OAR & OSL are no different.
One more thing to add BTW:
Reading is good
peace.

 

[Jeff Kleist]

Sometimes, IMO, the dub can surpass the original language

So, by your logic any movie, like, say STAR WARS that might be able to be performed better is open for a dub track by "superior" actors?

That's been done, see Mad Max, dubbed from English to English because someone thought Americans were too stupid to understand Australian accents. the Australian performances were far superior.

 

[Chad Ferguson]

I think it's unfair to compare dubs that are done in Film to ones that are done for Anime. All do repesct, anime just doesn't have that real of mouth movements, so It's that makes it easier to put any language then it would with real people, but this is just my opinion.

 

[Joseph Young]

If you insist on OAR, but shun OSL, you are hypocritical, no way around it. The original performances are just as integral to the film as the AR.

Amen.

I'm honestly surprised by the number of 'dub apologists' on the HTF. I assumed most of us would largely advocate and understand the value of something we like to call

[rant]Original Intent[/rant].

And don't get me started on how what you lose when you dub something like Bebop - with all its references to American culture that are totally lost when everything's in English.

Cheers in advance to all who disagree with me.. this is a debate that will never be settled, I assure you.

Joseph

 

[Jose Q]

Hey, if they can't get the guy that did the voice of Spike in the TV series may be they can get the guy that did the voice of Roger Smith in the Big O.
(hopes Sony falls for that one)

 

[Morgan Jolley]

I watch both the sub and dub of any anime I get so that if they screw it up, I get the picture for what it was supposed to be.

 

[Joe_C]

Quote:

Here we go again...

 

[Joe_C]

Some regard trigun as having a very good dub. Any opinions, since I haven't seen it yet but am thinking of buying it??

Yes, it is one of the better (and more "tolerable" ) dubs out there. Although I will admit, the Japanese VA's did a damn good job too (which is not always the case). For example, I hated both the English and the Japanese VA's for Record of Lodoss War: Chronicles of the Heroic Knight. The original Japanese VA's for the ROLW: OVA were amazing, but unfortunately they changed them all for the TV series.

 

[Jeff Ulmer]

Do we really need to deride this into yet another dub vs sub debate?

I hope for the sake of those who enjoy it, that CT will get the same voice talent.