Classic films to be released in fake 3D! Blasphemy!!! (1 Viewer)

[Brian Kidd]

This is an offshoot of some information in another thread, but I felt that it needed its own topic, as it'll get buried otherwise. (Thanks to David Lambert for the original info.)
The skinny is this. A company that manufactures and sells 3D films and viewing apparatus, Razor 3D, is preparing to sell what are purportedly 3D versions of films such as NIGHT OF THE LIVING DEAD and THE CHINESE CONNECTION.
Link Removed
They have already released 3D versions of some classic FLASH GORDON and COMMANDER CODY serials.
None of these were originally filmed in 3D!
To me, this is as bad as colorizing films. How does the rest of the membership feel?

 

[Steve Phillips]

It is especially shameful because even when viewed with the field sequential 3-D glasses, these films will NOT look three dimensional. It's all hype, it doesn't work, it simply isn't possible to convert flat films to 3-D successfully at this time.

All this will do is anger consumers who get one of these, see that they don't deliver, and then be wary of the actual real 3-D releases out there.

The field sequential 3-D systems are incredible and work very well with movies or material shot in 3-D. There are lots of true stereoscopic movies available on VHS and now DVD, including everything from classic 50s stuff to recent shot on video amateur flicks. I'd recommend many of those, but steer clear of this fake stuff though!

 

[Rain]

To me, this is as bad as colorizing films.

I completely agree.

 

[Steve Phillips]

It would be as bad you mean. Remember, it is a hoax. These movies must be viewed with the 3-D glasses, but even with them on you still see a flat image.

At least with colorizing, the result was in color!

I LOVE 3-D, but this stuff is isn't. Anyone see FRIDAY THE 13th PART 3 in 3-D in theater? It startes out with a lengthy sequence from the flat PART 2. You have the glasses on, but you still see a flat picture until the real 3-D begins. That looked better than this stuff does.

So before we get in to a debate about if we should convert flat movies to 3-D or not, everyone should understand that day hasn't come yet.

 

[GregK]

I'll second what Steve said, for if I am going to wear 3-D glasses, I expect to see real depth, and some occasional out-of-screen 3-D effects if the director intended it that way. Turning a standard flat (2-D) film into 3-D is somewhat like using a black box to turn monophonic single channel into stereo audio.. it just doesn't work! You may get a different sensation over mono, but true stereo it's not.. for both stereophonic and stereoscopic!
And the "Friday the 13th Part III" intro is classic, as the first part is a flashback from Friday II, which was shot in standard 2-D. For the theatrical 3-D prints, there was a notice right after the opening Paramount logo: "The following scenes are not in true 3-D, but your 3-D glasses will still be required". This was followed by a slight simulated 2D to 3D flashback of Friday II. My friend sitting next to me said "This 3-D is great!" ..while we were still watching the flashback! Then came the true stereoscopic opening credits and the theater crowd really went nuts! From the opening credits to finish it was 100% true stereoscopic 3-D.
Some here :wink: ...say your only getting half the picture when you see a 2.39:1 scope film panned-n-scanned. I'd say the same thing when you watch Paramount's 2-D DVD of Friday III. ..I think it's the "left eye" side.

 

[Matt Perkins]

Ya know, I hate to be the devil's advocate but ... what's the problem? Honestly, I think it's kind of cool. Sure, in a purist sense it's totally ridiculous (akin to colorizing), but let's face it: not everyone it a purist. Frankly, if someone released The Empire Strikes Back in 3D, I think I would collapse with joy!

Turning a standard flat (2-D) film into 3-D is somewhat like using a black box to turn monophonic single channel into stereo audio.. it just doesn't work!

Funny you should think so. So how do you suppose we have Dolby Digital 5.1 mixes of The Wizard of Oz, then? Sure, the techies could have re-assembled the tracks from the original stems (likely what was done), but they also could have engineered some filters to split sound types into tracks from the composited original.
On to video: The Matrix is a recent example of breakthroughs in frame interpolation, where frames that weren't shot can be assembled electronically by using reference points in the frames that were shot. Of course, that's almost trivial compared to "3D-ing" a static image ... but are you seriously suggesting it can't be done?
"Hoax?" Man, you guys! Computers! Anything is possible, even digital image manipulation I'm told! Seriously, I think this would be really cool. I'd be very interested in seeing how successful they are at getting convincing 3D without totally destroying the screen positioning and spacing.
Finally -- people who declare moral outrage whenever someone invents a new way to enjoy movies should remember this: inventing new ways to enjoy movies is a good thing! We're not talking about burning all surviving prints of the 2D version. Get a grip.

 

[Steve Phillips]

We know because we are experts/techies in the 3-D field; and we have seen the results. It doesn't work. This is NOTHING like making a 5.1 soundtrack.

CGI movies like ANTZ or the Tv special SANTA VS THE SNOWMAN have been painstakingly transferred to IMAX 3-D; due to the nature of the original production this can be accomplished. However, again I state, there is no way to convert a standard live action flat movie to anything which even remotely looks close to something shot in 3-D.
Buy one of these; you'll be pissed. At least you were warned!

As for the argument of whether or not it should be done when it is actually possible, that's another argument. Some would argue that panning and scanning and colorization and digitally putting product placement into old "Bewtiched" episodes is "inventing a new way to watch a movie". I think lots of HTF members would agree we don't think those are good things....

 

[GregK]

Get a grip.

I take back everything I said Matt. These discs were made for people just like yourself. I suggest purchasing them right away.

 

[Darren Gross]

One thing to keep in mind is that these are all public domain films (or at least assumed to be so). There has been no digital conversion or computer work done to add dimension to these films, the fields have just been separated.

Also, these will also be the usual hideous transfers from worn out 16mm prints and in the case of MONSTER FROM A PREHISTORIC PLANET (aka: GAPPA THE TRIPHIBIAN MONSTER) will be a pan n'scan print of a NikkatsuScope original. Cropped, panned and scanned, bleary, poor colors with ineffective 3-D.

Is Slingshot (who should be commended for spearheading field-sequential DVD releases such as the Imax and camcorder horror dics ENCOUNTER IN THE THIRD DIMENSION, HAUNTED CASTLE and ZOMBIE CHRONICLES) aware that they might be shooting themselves and all their efforts in the foot?

 

[Brenton]

I don't think it's a big deal if it's viewed as a "novelty version" of the film. But I sure hope that no one takes the fake 3D as THE version of the film.

 

[cafink]

digitally putting product placement into old "Bewtiched" episodes

Did this actually happen?

 

[Peter Kline]

Any changes in a film to make them 3D, or color or 5.1 surround sound should be condemned. Unfortunately, the latter seems to be OK by many.

 

[Steve Phillips]

The Bewitched thing was done as a demo for a digital FX company. It was just a test scene; they added a box of cereal to a table. They were also planning to do this with actual TV series, I'm not usre if it happened or not.

 

[Dick]

Anyone who purchased any of the ROLLER COASTER THRILLS videos, lasers or DVD's also got fake 3-D. The type of cheesy "glasses" provided - one lense completely transparant and the other darker - work with any movie in which the foreground moves in relation to the background or vice-versa, or when there is an object or person moving horizontally or laterally across the screen (again, providing there is a relative fore or back ground). You can reproduce this effect (albeit with some discomfort) by simply squinting one eye as you watch. This is simply a way of tripping up the brain's perception and has nothing to do with true (i.e. filmed with two cameras) 3-D.

 

[Steve Phillips]

Correct, Pulfrich (motion illusion) is not real stereoscopic 3-D; but that is not what is going on with these DVDs. At least under controlled circumstances, the pulfrich gimmick actually seems to be three dimensional!
These DVDs will NOT look 3-D at all; they are just being processed so that you need glasses to watch them! Wear the glasses and you get a flat picture!

 

[Brian Kidd]

This whole debacle is frustrating to me. Why doesn't this company go about acquiring the rights to REAL 3D films that are languishing in studio vaults? There were a bunch of 3D films made in the 50's and 80's. I'm sure that no studio who owns the rights to them plan on releasing 3D versions of them. I know that there are 3D field-sequential VHS tapes of studio films out there so there is a precedent. Who released these? Was it the studios?

 

[Steve Phillips]

Several of the studios licensed some of their 3-D films to a company for release in Japan on the defunct VHD videodisc format (not laser, and not RCA, CED, but a third one) back in the late 80s.

There are signs that some of the studios are starting to see a market for these flicks, and are considering adding field sequential 3-D versions on DVD (along with a flat print). Anchor Bay was very close to doing this with PARASITE but backed out in a stupid decision; especially since the widescreen 3-D version is not hard to track down on VHS.

I don't think you are going to see the majors license them to anyone else though.

There are hundreds of 3-D films that could be made available. Warner, Columbia, and Universal alone have a great back catalog of stereoscopic stuff. Paramount, MGM, RKO, FOX and many smaller producers also made 3D movies so there is plenty of material! A nice mix of westerns, action adventure, comedy, musicals, horror, even adult, etc so there is something for all tastes.

Hold tight. Write to the studios and tell them you want to see 3-D movies in 3-D on DVD. Remember, snail mail is far more effective than on-line petitions and emails.