Can I removed LFE from my subwoofer output?

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by richard plumb, Oct 8, 2001.

  1. richard plumb

    richard plumb Stunt Coordinator

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    I'm trying to decide between small and large speaker settings. People here have been saying 'go with what sounds best', but I can't really tell.
    I'd like to compare small+sub with Large, but the LFE gets in the way. I can set the sub to 'yes', the mains and center to 'large' and physically disconnect the sub to hear just the main channels on their own. But I can't think of a way to listen to 'small' speakers + sub redirected bass without LFE.
    Can anyone either:
    1) suggest a soundtrack that has good bass extension in the mains, but no LFE track
    2) suggest a way to redirect bass to my sub when my mains are 'small', but not the LFE?
    My receiver is a Sony STR-DB830, in case anyone is familiar with the range. Is there a setting somewhere that I can turn off the LFE?
    Would listening to music give me the same effect?
     
  2. Chuck Kent

    Chuck Kent Supporting Actor

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    Richard: Anything that has ".1" in the input signal will have LFE (at leastr part of the time) and will be sent to the sub unless you have it set as "off". If you can find a soundtrack that is 5.0, then that would be what you're looking for.
    While I understand you want to compare without LFE, I don't know of any processor that can kill the entire LFE signal from the sub. The best you can do is to turn it down (which you can do through the 830's setup.)
    ------------------
     
  3. Stephen Dodds

    Stephen Dodds Second Unit

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    I'm not exactly sure why you want to try what you suggest, but if you want surround without the LFE channel, try a DTS music disc as they don't have an LFE channel.
    It would be easier to simply use a CD however.
    Steve
     
  4. richard plumb

    richard plumb Stunt Coordinator

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    I thought it'd be easier to judge how well the two different combinations handle the full range of (non-LFE) audio, so that I can settle on a setting to use.
    I have a DTS music CD, so I'll try that tonight. I'll also try some normal CDs.
     
  5. Cliff

    Cliff Stunt Coordinator

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    Richard,
    Here is a really nice concert DVD with both DD and DTS in 5.0 format (no LFE channel): The Moody Blues: Hall of Fame. Live from the Royal Albert Hall. Give it a try.
    Cliff
     
  6. Jeremy Anderson

    Jeremy Anderson Screenwriter

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    Disney's TARZAN has no LFE track, lots of music, and some nice bass in the mains.
     
  7. Selden Ball

    Selden Ball Second Unit

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    Richard,
    Some "objective" arguments for setting all speakers to small, redirecting all low frequencies to the sub output are the following:
    1) A subwoofer has a far better low frequency extension than any bookshelf or tower speaker.
    2) The wavelengths of low frequencies are comparable to most room dimensions. When there are multiple sources of low frequencies in a room, the speakers have to be very carefully located to minimize the resulting standing waves and interference patterns where the sounds reinforce or cancel one another. These can cause serious distortions of the low frequency sounds reaching your listening position(s). Very little can be done with an equalizer to affect the interference patterns.
    If the result doesn't sound good to you, then, the argument goes, you need to invest in a better subwoofer -- one that has less distortion and a broader frequency response.
     
  8. John Morton

    John Morton Stunt Coordinator

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    Hi Richard..
    Thought I'd chime in since I have a Sony DB-930 and have tried almost everything now. I agree, use either a dts cd or a regular cd. I use 2 chanel music to do almost all of my "by ear" testing now. Then I change to movies for verification. I also ALWAYS use the same 3 songs and the same 3 scenes in a movie for my testing, no matter if it's in my room or another. I'm growing tired of them, but consistancy in source material can't be replaced. If you can't, use the setup menu on the db-830 to turn the LFE to -10, but leave the sub setting at 0. I found for 2 years that I prefered all 5 speakers at large. Music seemed to miss something if I set the 5 speakers to small. However, the bass impact of CERTAIN MOVIES was definitely increased when all 5 were set to small. An example of a movie where I could tell an impact was "Gone in 60 seconds". Watch for when the car lands on the bridge after the jump (sorry, can't remember the track). With all 5 at large, you won't get much of a "boom". With all 5 speakers set to small, you'll see what I mean!! Also, I thought that the sub cross setting should match the receiver cross setting, but my sub has a +5db increase around 75, so I always prefered my sub at 65, which I thought sounded good, I always felt like something was missing, but couldn't put my finger on it and couldn't tweak it out, so I left it alone. WELL, I read a post last week which suggested that I raise the cross on the sub to it's max, because there is LFE above 80 that I might be missing. I then read Dolby's recommendation that even though most mixers roll off above 80, they recommended the same. I tried it over the weekend. I think I just have to get used to what sounds right again. My sub is now a full click (out of 10) lower in volume, sounds better than ever, and I don't feel like the bass effects are comming and going like they seemed to in some films: (Lost World-chapter 9-dinos walking around-you hear foot steps, but they don't seem to be there all the time with the sub's cross low. They are there however at almost every step with the sub's cross at high. I guess the designers knew what they were doing as it now sounds much more natural. Back to gone in 60 seconds, you'll notice after chapter 25 that the bass comes and goes (listen to the Shelby car and especially the helicopter)just like the lost world did if the sub's cross is set low. Also, if you set any of the main 5 to large, unless you don't have enough sub, once you hear what I'm talking about, you'll definitely notice these tones missing!!
    OH, my 5 at small with the sub's cross turned all the way up, now 2 channel AND multi-chanel music fills the room way better than it ever did with my 5 main at large.
    Just my .02
     

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