Cabling reqs for 47A/ or is XA777ES a better plan?

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by Rob Roth, May 19, 2002.

  1. Rob Roth

    Rob Roth Stunt Coordinator

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    I've been thinking about the Pioneer 47A for a couple of months. Appreciate all the comments and discussions about this machine, esp. from stalwarts like keithH, PhilA, JohnK, etc. My bottom line is that this is not alot of money to experiment with 2 formats.

    I got a Sony 9000ES 'bout the same time as KeithH. It is my main source for SACD and CD- always in the Direct mode going to an analog bypass in the B&K 307. I use Harmonic Tech cables from the 9000 to the 307.

    1st question: Do I need 6 or 8 RCAs? I understand some DVDa's have a very high quality (24/192) stereo track as well as the 24/96 5.1 mix. Do I need to have separate cables from the 47A's stereo outputs to take advantage of these tracks? That is the case with the XA777ES; in my understanding the bridged DACs for extra high quallity 2 channel output only through the stereo outputs- not the 5.1 outputs. I know you can fool the player to output stereo only from the L and R fronts outputs of the 5.1 array, but those outputs do not support the bridged DACs.

    2nd question: Given the quality of the 47A, how important are good cables?

    I'm not sure of the future of mch SACD- not many titkes yet though most recent releases are mch. Also, perhaps I'm not looking in the right places but I'm not seeing much new material in DVD-A. I admit some of the re-releases are attractive titles, but I've heard some criticism that the DVDA's are being mixed for less critical listening.

    Not trying to start a war here- as i said above for this kind of money it will be fun to play with mch to a greater extent than DVD-V DTS and DD 5.1 discs have allowed.

    BTW, the bass management issue is not a concern of mine.
     
  2. PomingF

    PomingF Second Unit

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    Roth, the 47A does not have a separate set of analog stereo outs. I use SilverCats for the front two channels b/w the 47A & the Sony TA-P also b/w the Sony & my amps. The rest of the channels only gets some generic brand (not the freebies but something at the level of Radio Shack Gold) RCA's.

    PF
     
  3. Rob Roth

    Rob Roth Stunt Coordinator

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    I appreciate your response but I'm a bit confused. I looked at a 47A tonight and saw the following rear panel connections:

    one set of 5.1 analog outputs

    two sets of stereo analog outputs

    S-video outputs

    I can't recall id I also saw component video outputs, but I would imagine they were there.

    The real question is why stereo outputs are neccessary if Front Left and Right already exist in the 5.1 set.

    BTW, thanks for the cable recommendation- are those cables well shielded? I've got an awful lot of stuff radiating RF and EMF.
     
  4. PomingF

    PomingF Second Unit

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    Rob, you're right for I just took a look back there and there are two sets of stereo outs although as I recall when I was setting things up I chose to have multi-channel for both DVD-A & SACD so that must have bypassed the stereo outs. Also there isn't anywhere in the Pioneer's manual that says anything about difference in sound quality (except may be the Legato? feature in CD playback) b/w the 5.1's fronts & stereo outs. The fact that I may have to go through the menu in order to switch outputs I think I'll stay with what I have now. Yes, there are progressive component outs as well.

    I've been using Catscable for most of my audio connections and haven't had much problem with interference. Doug makes a wicked pure silver cable @ probably the lowest price.

    PF
     
  5. Phil A

    Phil A Producer

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    I use the 5.1 channel output of the Pioneer and will use both analog (stereo) outs. The unit is in the bedroom system and backs to the wall of the main system. The answer may be dependent on how your preamp or receiver is set-up and whether the 5.1 channel input bypasses the DSP. If not, then the stereo outs can be used if you can go analog direct and get better sound. I am not sure how the Pioneer's outputs are set-up, but I tried the left and right of 5.1 channel inputs into a stereo analog direct input and on the few things I listened to, I could not detect a difference. I make my own cables, including a 5.1 channel cable, so it is not a big issue for me.
     
  6. Phil A

    Phil A Producer

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    Forgot to add that in a particular situation, such as my bedroom system where I have ltd. room and do not have full range speakers all the way around, I do use the bass management in the receiver if I listen to 5.1 sound in the bedroom which is very infrequently. So the separate 2-channel out would allow me to go analog direct and not go through the other circuitty.
     
  7. Rob Roth

    Rob Roth Stunt Coordinator

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    Phil,

    As you probably know the B&K 307 (Ref. 30) has stereo analog bypass capability for each input. The 5.1 input set is also analog bypass. I use my 9000ES in Direct mode through stereo analog bypass inputs for the vast majority of my listening. I was hoping that if I added the 47A to get some modest DVDA capability and a taste of mch SACD, I would be able to get by with only 6 cables. As long as the quality of the L and R front outputs in the 5.1 set is as good as the stereo outputs I should be OK. Since I'm fairly confident the 9000ES will be superior in 2ch SACD and Redbook I would only have an issue if I wanted to play the very high res stereo layer that some DVDA's offer. I thought perhaps those better tracks would only output from the 47A's stereo outputs (as is the case with the XA777ES). I may not have an issue, but I'd appreciate any further input.
     
  8. Phil A

    Phil A Producer

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    Rob, that is fine. I don't think you will be losing anything using DVD-A, 2 and 6 channel in the 5.1 channel input. I would not also assume the the 9000ES is a better CD player than the DV-47A. I owned both and since I make my own cable I frequently take components into a high-end shop to evaluate things. My main system also includes very good stuff. I listened to both the DV-47A and 9000ES on a variety of systems and with both I changed power cords from what came with it stock and with the DV-47A not having the build quality of the 9000ES I tried various tweaks on both, mainly isolation type feet, DH Cones and also Bright Star stick on feet ($12.50 for a set of 4 - can be bought at Audio Advisor or Bright Star's website) and stuck them to the bottom of Pioneer's feet. The 9000ES is a very average CD player. I actually preferred the Pioneer. Listening was done with a variety of systems including electronics from Bryston, Ayre, Linn, Levinson, etc. The 9000ES sound better on SACD 2-channel though and the picture of both players is good with the Pioneer a little softer. You can try the same to see which you prefer in your system.
     
  9. KeithH

    KeithH Lead Actor

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    Rob said:
     
  10. Rob Roth

    Rob Roth Stunt Coordinator

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    Sorry Keith, is it the 555ES you have? As I just posted on another thread, I am very happy with the DVDA but less impressed with the SACD. I'll give it a bit more time.

    As far as speakers go, I'm using the SonusFaber Grand Pianos and REL subwoofers. Its a system more designed for music than for film. My favorite media are concert DVDs so I'm not real concerned about waking the neighbors with U-571 bass booms.

    BTW, have you seen the Last Waltz? Its my new reference concert DVD despite its age.
     
  11. KeithH

    KeithH Lead Actor

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    Rob, I have an SCD-777ES and 'C555ES in my main stereo system and a 'C555ES and 'C333ES in my second system. The 'C555ES is actually routed to my main stereo system for CDs and stereo SACDs and the home-theater system for multi-channel SACDs. The main stereo system and home-theater system are in one room. In case you are wondering why I have two changers in the second system, it is a bit of a long story, but I'll explain it if you really want to know. [​IMG]
    Given your speakers, I would definitely try different cables with the '47A. I'm sure you will hear differences, but you will have to try some good cables.
    I have not seen/heard the Last Waltz DVD.
     

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