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Bose vs. Expensive wire and cable

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by Steve G, Aug 13, 2001.

  1. Steve G

    Steve G Agent

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    Part 1
    Although I don't post here very often, I have enjoyed this site for a couple of years and this hobby for nearly 30 years. I have been watching thread after thread bashing Bose audio products. Most people will go on and on about cheap paper cones and how WAY OVERPRICED these speakers are. The one common bit of advice to anyone purchasing speakers is to buy what "YOU" like.AS long as it isn't Bose. Anytime someone comes on here asking for advice or comments about Bose they are suspected of being a trouble maker or a newbie that doesn't have clue. They are often ridiculed and publicly lashed out at. We all know the sayings; No highs no........ and all the rest. Yet it always come down to "You can do so much better for the money" "you are getting ripped off" "Bose sucks people in with their ad money".......and on and on and on.
    Part 2
    Now in the other corner are the wire, cable and inter connect group. They will come on and talk about and sometimes rave about what a wire or cable will do to improve they're system.Yet sometimes or maybe even most times it is only said to be a slight improvement.It is often said,that if person "A" can't hear or see a differance, then in a lot of cases it's because they don't have a good enough system. I just don't understand how anyone can justify the markup on these things compared to a complete system by Bose.
    This all leads me to wonder about a couple things. If a person goes out and buys a Bose setup for $2000, why are they always taken to task in no uncertain terms?
    Now if someone goes out and spends $2000 on wires and such, they are usually handled with kid gloves for the most part?
    sorry this has gone on so long,but I think its time to respect everyones opinions. i know I can't hear differnces in speaker wire and connections. I also know "I" would get a lot more enjoyment with a complete Bose setup than I would by adding expensive wires to my system.
    By the way I have Denon and Def Tech in my setup. I don't have Bose nor do I plan on buying any in the near future. Not that I wouldn't; I' m just happy with what I have right now.
    Thanks for listening to my little rant here.
    Steve
    This is not being said to incite a riot. Its just how I feel.
     
  2. Jay Mitchosky

    Jay Mitchosky Producer

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    This thread is going to be watched closely. Steve, you've opened up a huge can of worms here: Bose & wire debates have a long history here. People have strong opinions in both regards.
    That being said I would comment that you answered your own question on one point...
     
  3. Gregg Loewen

    Gregg Loewen Video Standards Instructor, THX Ltd.
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  4. Brian Fellmeth

    Brian Fellmeth Supporting Actor

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    Thought provoking and I believe legit post. First time I've seen both flash points hit at the same time. In answer to your question re the apparent double standard- we are almost universally alligned against Bose, so the mob mentality takes over. But with cables, we are pretty evenly divided between Yea and Nay sayers. So the "kid gloves" here at HTF represents a little self restraint (that doesn't exist at some of the other sites) to prevent ugliness. This restraint is unecessary when posting about Bose where gleeful piling on is the rule.
    [Edited last by Brian Fellmeth on August 13, 2001 at 09:13 AM]
     
  5. BryanZ

    BryanZ Screenwriter

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    Pt. 1 - Mainly Bose offers an extremely poor price/performance ratio. There is much better out there for far less money.
    Pt. 2 - No idea. Perhaps cables do make a difference? [​IMG]
     
  6. Phil A

    Phil A Producer
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    Quality cables with good connectors can make difference. Like anything else in a system, the investment should be proportionate. One should not expect a $1,000 system to sound like a $1,500 system with $500 spent on cables. There may be improvements but likley not what could be gotten by spending the money on the system. Before one invests in anything, it is always best to listen to it in the context of their system. The best way to evaluate anything is to change the one item you intend to upgrade whether it be cable or hardware. If you can't hear a difference, then don't buy it. If there is a difference but you don't think it is worth the price then don't buy it either.
     
  7. John Garcia

    John Garcia Executive Producer

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    While I agree that there tends to be an immediate "gang-up" on anyone who asks about BOSE anything, I also have to agree that for the price, you can certainly do BETTER than BOSE. I tend to stay away from those threads, simply because I feel no need to argue the point and beat it to death.
    Personally, I think Bose sounds OK, and will do for most people. I don't feel that their cube arrays provide me with the sound that I am looking for, however their Wave Radio sounds quite impressive (though not $999 impressive).
    I could use myself as an example. My father owns the Bose AM-15 - 5 dual cube arrays and a bass module. Approximately $1200. Cube drivers: 2", Bass:6 1/2" or 7". They provide very good dispersion, and sound very acceptable.
    My speakers on a budget: 4 Paradigm Titans, 1 Paradigm CC-170, 1 Yamaha YST-SW500 (120w, 10", ported, active servo). Far more presence and dynamics than the Bose system, including a substantial increase in low frequency response. Total cost: $950.
    ------------------
    All progress is based upon a universal, inate desire on the part of every organism, to live beyond it's income.
    ITRCA ** Honda/Acura Club ** Speedring (sorry, car guy)
     
  8. Bob McElfresh

    Bob McElfresh Producer

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    Steve: I believe advising against Bose or expensive copper is NOT a lack of respect for peoples opinions.
    We get a lot of sticker-shock people new to HT/Music that come here for advice. And many of them are fresh from the stores where they have gotten the "fresh-out-of-Bose-marketing-seminar" spiel from the salesman.
    This is what we are fighting against. Not the people.
    And I disagree that people who buy Bose are always taken to task. I've even encouraged people considering them if they have SAF issues. This way, both the husband and wife will get into home-theater without the speakers becoming a point-of-contention.
    So please, dont paint the entire fourm with a single brush. [​IMG]
    I'm proud of HTF. We often get new-members that have been critized/yelled at from other sites. And I hope we treat them with friendship and respect.
    But since you bring the issue up, I will try and watch the tone of our posts to be a little less hard-nosed. (We probably DO scare some people off.)
    [Edited last by Bob McElfresh on August 13, 2001 at 10:08 AM]
     
  9. Todd Hochard

    Todd Hochard Cinematographer

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    Just a note:
    Good cables do not have to be expensive cables. I can make a 1m cable that will equal many esoteric brands out there for about $8. I use the same stuff that BetterCables.com uses.
    Bose- they just sound bad. Paper cones suck at high freq. reproduction. This has been reaffirmed by my recent purchase of an Acura TL Type S, with it's Acura/Bose system (no choice here). The highs are muted, and the midrange just isn't "right", for lack of a better term. The factory Honda system, with its component (separate woofer and tweeter) speaker system, is much more precise, even in the lousy car environment.
    Todd
     
  10. RicP

    RicP Screenwriter

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  11. John-D

    John-D Stunt Coordinator

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    this post has been changed from it's original version. It's been formatted to fit forum standards and edited for content

    [Edited last by John-D on August 13, 2001 at 10:46 AM]
     
  12. John Morris

    John Morris Guest

    Last week I went to the local Fry's with my boss who was in town visiting with some of my accounts. We were there to look at portable printers but eventually wandered over to the HT area of the store. As we began to chat about HT gear, he matter of factly and proudly proclaimed that he ONLY used Bose speakers, because for music he HAD to have the very best... After a brief pause, I said:
     
  13. Alex F.

    Alex F. Second Unit

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    As for the Bose query, the folks I know who own or have owned those products initially didn't bother to spend any time auditioning competitive speakers. They admittedly made their purchases based on a "need" created by many years of Bose advertising.
    I will add that, coincidental or otherwise, that not one acquaintance who has spent an evening in our home enjoying a movie in our theater room or listening to music via our music-only system has ever purchased any Bose gear at any time afterwards.
    As for cables, we have two systems built around high-end components, as alluded to above. Originally skeptical, I learned many years ago--starting with a blind test--that I can indeed hear differences between cable products. Sometimes the differences are subtle, sometimes not. Some cables can make a system sound unpleasant (particularly in the upper midrange and lower treble, where my hearing is most critical of a product's performance), whereas others can help a system sound better than expected.
    In our bedroom system, which utilizes budget gear (inexpensive speakers and receiver), I use low-priced cables because I can discern no improvement using higher priced cable products. So, yes, I've found, the better the associated equipment, the easier it becomes to hear those differences.
     
  14. Steve_D

    Steve_D Second Unit

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    Because Bose have major provable problems in Freq Response due to their design. If someone just spent $2000 on cables that completely dropped the 120 to 200 HZ freq range (maybe made by Bose? lol), I assume the whole forum would chime in.
    Also, expensive cable/interconnect purchasers probably already have a good experience base and those that can hear a difference and are willing to pay for it are already well advanced in the audiophile category.
    Think of it this way, in Little League every outfielder should be coached to catch the ball with 2 hands. Yet, by the time the select few get to the Majors, many of them catch it with the glove only, yet no one yells at them for not using "proper" technique (until they drop it!)
    ------------------
    http://www.sdiver.org
    [Edited last by Steve_D on August 13, 2001 at 11:18 AM]
     
  15. Steve G

    Steve G Agent

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    After re-reading my original post I think I may have gotten to long winded for my own good.
    The point I was trying to make is how two groups of people perceive value. I really am not trying to say which is right or wrong or better or worse. Both products are marketed at a specific client group. Bose towards people that either don't want their rooms filled up with gear and Wire companies at people who want to try for the last ounce of improvement. A premium is paid for by each group. I was just trying to understand why one group is singled out so badly for trying to accomplish the same thing. That being what they think is right for them. I certainly apologize to anyone who feels slighted here.I was just trying to figure out why things are valued so differantly. Jay, please feel free to delete this thread as I really meant no harm and was only sharing my thoughts on what I understand are 2 very volitile subjects.
    Thanks Steve
     
  16. James Q Jenkins

    James Q Jenkins Stunt Coordinator

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    You lost me. What's the connection???
     
  17. Saurav

    Saurav Cinematographer

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