Blu Ray drive for Mac Pro (1 Viewer)

[Nelson Au]

Hey Josh, looks like that might be the case for me too. I tried to clean the disc and I tried another disc in the set to no avail. I have not tried Handbrake yet.

I’ll see about sending an email to the MakeMKV developer.

 

[Nelson Au]

A follow up on my Kung Fu ripping troubles. I did try handbrake amd successfully ripped the pilot. But looking at it I could see compression artifacts. I was trying to figure out the highest settings I could do in handbrake, when I thought I’ll try MakeMKV one more time. Like before, the drive read the disc and it started the rip process. But like before, there was no movement with the progress bars, but the elapsed time indicators were showing time elapsing. So I left it and did the dishes. When I came back, I was amazed to discover the first file was actually ripping, but I couldn’t hear the disc moving. It seems to have taken 15 minutes for the file to be read and copied. The entire disc of 3 episodes and the pilot took a little over 35 minutes to rip! That was slow. Must be something in the way these discs are made that it took so long for each file to copy and then save. At least I know it works now.

Looking at the MKv file, the image quality is much better now, the compression artifacts are hardly noticeable now.

 

[jcroy]

The disc spinning at slow speeds, happens every now and then. Computer dvd/bluray drives spin at much higher speeds than a typical standalone dvd or bluray player.

Typically slowdowns happen when the drive is getting too many uncorrectable errors on the first read, and just do a re-read. Reading at higher speeds is much more error prone, which would automatically trigger the drive's error correction algorithm more often.

 

[jcroy]

Sometimes this slow reading spinning happens almost randomly.

There were many times where the first time I put the disc into the drive, it was spinning at a slow speed. Ejecting the disc and loading it again, the drive was spinning at the normal fast speed. (Sometimes this had to be several times, before the drive was able to spin the disc at a higher speed).

 

[Nelson Au]

Interesting feedbaxk Jr, thanks. What I can relate is when I tried to rip the disc with Handbrake, I could hear the disc spin and the rip took 10 minutes for the pilot episode. And I used the internal Apple Super Drive.

When I first tried to make the MKV file, I used the Pioneer blu ray drive I installed in the Mac that I’ve mainly been using for the rips. When I put the disc in the drive, it was spinning and MakeMKV was reading the data as usual. It was then I engaged the rip that it sat there and the progress bars were not moving, but the elapsed timers were moving. On the second try, I used the Apple Super Drive. And the exact same slow reading times were occurring. So my guess is this is not a drive issue, but a disc that as you said, requires a lot of re-reading.
I also noticed after the first file completed the copy, the second file was the same, no movement in the progress bars, after about 10 minutes, I heard the drive click, as if it made a single revolution. Then the progress bar sudden shot over half way. Then about another several minutes, the second file finished the copy. And so on.

MakeMKV’s behavior was so different from my usual experience, it made me wonder if there was a problem. If I have time today, I’ll try the second disc and just expect that it will take about 15 minutes of it appearing to do nothing.

 

[Mark McSherry]

Interesting feedbaxk Jr, thanks. What I can relate is when I tried to rip the disc with Handbrake, I could hear the disc spin and the rip took 10 minutes for the pilot episode. And I used the internal Apple Super Drive.

When I first tried to make the MKV file, I used the Pioneer blu ray drive I installed in the Mac that I’ve mainly been using for the rips. When I put the disc in the drive, it was spinning and MakeMKV was reading the data as usual. It was then I engaged the rip that it sat there and the progress bars were not moving, but the elapsed timers were moving. On the second try, I used the Apple Super Drive. And the exact same slow reading times were occurring. So my guess is this is not a drive issue, but a disc that as you said, requires a lot of re-reading.
I also noticed after the first file completed the copy, the second file was the same, no movement in the progress bars, after about 10 minutes, I heard the drive click, as if it made a single revolution. Then the progress bar sudden shot over half way. Then about another several minutes, the second file finished the copy. And so on.

MakeMKV’s behavior was so different from my usual experience, it made me wonder if there was a problem. If I have time today, I’ll try the second disc and just expect that it will take about 15 minutes of it appearing to do nothing.

At times (DVD, not blu-ray) MKV will dither for 30-45 minutes or more before transferring. Not often, but on occasion. The last time was with WB's FILM NOIR CLASSIC COLLECTION Volume 4.

 

[Josh Steinberg]

I’ve noticed that too. I think what’s happening are some discs are authored in a way that’s more complex and MakeMKV is too busy stitching together the different pieces into a whole to report the progress. I’ve noticed this most frequently on Warner DVDs where it’s the second disc of bonus features, and on some TV discs with multiple episodes authored in a way that gives the viewer the option to select individually and also to play all. MakeMKV is definitely working behind the scenes but it’s not always obvious what it’s doing until it’s done.

 

[jcroy]

MakeMKV is definitely working behind the scenes but it’s not always obvious what it’s doing until it’s done.

Definitely.

I don't know about recent versions. In the older versions of makemkv I used in the past, I read the error/debug messages to figure out what it might be doing. (Anydvd does this too, by dumping the error/debug mesages into a log file).

It is definitely not "passive".

 

[Nelson Au]

Thanks guys for chiming in! That was an interesting learning experience. I’m glad I stuck with it to see it actually was working. Dithering is an interesting way to call it!

 

[jcroy]

One has to remember programs like makemkv, etc ... were designed as general purpose dvd (or bluray) disc rippers. A lot of the stuff running behind the scenes, is just to make things where the user only has to click a button on two.

So a lot of the stuff I've been talking about for a long time on here, is done in the background by programs like makemkv and is not really required to be known by folks doing casual ripping. Though occasionally ripping programs might get tripped up, either by authoring mistakes or deliberate basketcase drm.


The hardcore folks have other ways of ripping discs and/or extracting video + audio streams. For example in my recent/current setup, I'm running the old dvd decrypter with just about every option turned off including decryption. So it is more or less acting in a "passive" mode and not doing much processing other than reading the raw disc sectors and dumping them into an iso file. (I don't know if there are any widely available ripper programs on a mac, which do a "passive" ripping of dvd or bluray discs. The only way I can think of offhand, is if Linux is running on mac/apple desktop hardware and using the "dd" command).

 

[jcroy]

I’ve noticed that too. I think what’s happening are some discs are authored in a way that’s more complex and MakeMKV is too busy stitching together the different pieces into a whole to report the progress.

In practice, I have found that getting a computer program to recognize a type of pattern that isn't extremely precise, is not always easy to write code for. Not surprising at all that a program like makemkv, dvdfab, etc ... is taking a lot of time churning away at such a task.

In contrast, I have found that I can recognize immediately the common patterns in authoring and/or basketcase drm, just from skimming over the code in the *.ifo files (using a program like IfoEdit).

 

[Nelson Au]

Hey JR, I was feeling under the weather, so I didn’t reply sooner. I get it that us regular people using apps like MakeMKV are using an application that is doing a lot background effort automatically. But the hardcore people who know code and such can do more with other software.

I'm glad that a application like MakeMKV can handle most disc ripping most of the time, unless the disc is badly corrupted. I’m not interested, at least not now, how to dig deeper into software and code. I appreciate that I can rip a DVD and blu ray like ripping a CD.

I did try to rip a disc from the infamous MASH complete series set the other day. I did not realize till after I took the disc out of the computer that the playing surface was scratched. Due to the packaging of that set, nearly every disc has some scratches. MakeMKV tried for over an hour and I stopped it. I figured there was going to be a problem if the surface is scratched up. Luckily I had the first three seasons of MASH in the individual sets, so those are ripping ok.

 

[jcroy]

I did try to rip a disc from the infamous MASH complete series set the other day. I did not realize till after I took the disc out of the computer that the playing surface was scratched. Due to the packaging of that set, nearly every disc has some scratches. MakeMKV tried for over an hour and I stopped it. I figured there was going to be a problem if the surface is scratched up. Luckily I had the first three seasons of MASH in the individual sets, so those are ripping ok.

I've found scratches are highly variable, when it comes to ripping. I have many discs which looked really scratched up, where they were previously library copies which were taken out of circulation.

Oddly enough, about 99% of these scratched up ex-library dvd discs could be ripped entirely with no error problems and no disc spin slowdown. (The remaining 1% might have a disc spin slowdown).

 

[jcroy]

The type of nasty scratches which are usually fatal and caused uncorrectable read errors, were scratches (or damages) which were circular concentric.

If you know how the data is encoded on the disc surface, you will understand why such concentric circular scraches are fatal on cd, dvd, bluray, etc ... discs.

 

[Nelson Au]

Hey guys, a little something different to ask.

Last night I watched the Criterion blu ray of the 1946 Hitchcock film, Notorious. I made an MKV of course and it looks great! Josh if you’re here, I re-read your review of the Criterion disc! No matter how many times I’ve seen it, still is an engrossing viewing experience. What a great film!

Onto my question, many of the Hitchcock titles I really like do not have proper film score soundtrack releases on CD. But I know that the previous Notorious blu ray from MGM and one earlier DVD has the score in an isolated track. I’d like the rip the disc and extract the score and then make a high quality audio file. This is a project I’ve been thinking about doing for ages. I’ll do some reading on this as I’m sure there are lots of ways to do it. I’m curious if any of you guys have done this? And how, if I can ask, how do you guys do it? Thanks!

By the way, you might find this amusing, the very first time I saw the film was after buying a used copy of the Criterion laserdisc from the laserdisc shop that I frequently went to in those great laserdisc days! The previous owner was selling it to the shop owner and I happen to be there and watched the transaction and I said, I’ll buy that disc right away! The disc must have only been watched once and had no wear, it was like new. I still have it! The previous owner must not have liked the movie! I don’t see why, it was a really amazing experience seeing it for the first time on that disc. The scene in the wine cellar was particularly memorable!

 

[DaveF]

@Nelson Au
I’ve extracted bits of music and audio a number of times, including a dozen commentary tracks I’ve turned into “podcasts” to listen to on the go.

MKVToolNix can export the audio track per se. It can also break it into sub pieces (it’s kind of clunky, but works for me since I don’t have an audio editor). You’ll need to transcode the audio from MKA to something easier to play, like MP3 or AAC.

The hard part is if there’s dialog over music and you hope to separate out the music from the audio. I don’t know how to do that.

 

[Nelson Au]

Hi Dave,

Thanks a lot for the reply. I’ve got to get that MKVtoolNix! I recall you’ve mentioned it before. Luckily on Notorious, the score is on an isolated track. Though it does include some sound effects I believe. So it make it easy to extract that track. Then converting to AAC or something similar would be ideal for playback on the iPhone. I’ll do some reading to see if MKVToolNix will do the conversion to an audio format. Thanks!

 

[DaveF]

MKVToolNix won’t do the transcode, last I checked. I use ffmpeg for that.
ffmpeg -i "Movie (YYYY) Commentary.mka" -acodec aac “Movie (YYYY) Commentary.m4a"

You can install it in your Mac. I think I use Homebrew to install current ffmpeg.

Homebrew

The Missing Package Manager for macOS (or Linux).

brew.sh

 

[Nelson Au]

Thanks Dave, I used ffmpeg way back in 2005 or so. But I lost track, so it’s good it’s still available for the new OS. I’ll check that out.

It would be cool to extract the commentary tracks too as podcasts! Years ago I was reminded of the Criterion commentary tracks on the first three James Bond laserdiscs that had that track removed because the producers didn’t like some of the comments. I have those discs, so it would be cool to see if those can be extracted.

 

[Mark McSherry]

PowerDVD 20 (Windows version) easily extracts the audio from video files. I've been transferring Laserdisc titles to mp4 video. And use PowerDVD to capture the commentary as a m4a. Just did this with Criterion's LD of Hitchcock's BLACKMAIL. Right-click the video file and choose 'extract audio.' Of course, PowerDVD isn't free.