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BFD & Sound Quality (1 Viewer)

Rus Bowisc

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I've been reading a lot of posts on HT owners putting a BFD in their signal chain (subs).

I'm curious to know how much will the BFD deteriorate your sound? Will it make a noticeable difference having the Behringer in the path?

Rus
 

kevitra

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The only difference I noticed was my much improved frequency response.

I have read that it does noticably affect the sound if you try and use it for the rest of the frequency spectrum.
 

Michael R Price

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The excuse for using a cheap piece of digital equipment like the BFD is, we can't hear distortion and noise as well at low (bass) frequencies, so it is perfectly acceptable for equalizing a subwoofer. I bet the sound degradation would be immediately noticeable if you tried using a BFD full range.
 

Rus Bowisc

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Thanks for clarifying... just wanted to make sure before I give it a try.

What is the purpose of setting up a "house-curve" if your original intent was to EQ the sub-woofers to get a flat response as possible?

Bowisc
 

MingL

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I've only got better bass from the introduction of the BFD.

The orignal intent of introducing a BFD is not to get a flat response, but more accurately to get a smooth response, and none of the peaky bass room modes generate.

Flat curve sounds less involving than a house curve. The only way to explain it is to experience it yourself. Try them flat and with a house curve.
 

Kevin C Brown

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What is the purpose of setting up a "house-curve" if your original intent was to EQ the sub-woofers to get a flat response as possible?
Because some people prefer the sound quality this way.

Not me. I've been listening with a flat freq response for years, and a house curve doesn't sound right to me. But you have to experiment and see what floats your particular boat! :)
 

Brian L

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The excuse for using a cheap piece of digital equipment like the BFD is, we can't hear distortion and noise as well at low (bass) frequencies, so it is perfectly acceptable for equalizing a subwoofer. I bet the sound degradation would be immediately noticeable if you tried using a BFD full range.
FWIW, I have a Behringer UltraBASS Pro, which is patched into a tape loop, and it definitely affects the sound more than just to add in some bass.

Its primary function is to add frequencies one or two octaves below the fundamental frequency, and if set correctly, can add a nice amount of impact and low end to recordings that just don't have the bottom end that you might like.

But, the point is, being in the tape loop it affects the entire signal. And yes, it does alter the sound, more so than just adding some low end.

When I switch it in, there is a discernible roll off of the highs, and the soundstage tends to get just a little bit more narrow. To my ears, it sounds like the treble control is backed off a click or two.

Its not enough for me NOT to use it, but its there.

While its a fun device to play with, its useless on stuff that is well done to start with (the latest Steely Dan for example).

But its quite useful for much of the rock music that I like (stuff that has not been properly remastered) that just does not have the kick drum and bass slam that I want to hear.

BGL
 

Rus Bowisc

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I just got the BFD in today, so I will give it a try. If I don't like, I'm sure it'll have some purpose in the live rig.

By the way, I have some BBE and Aphex units that would probably work better than your BassPro unit... have you ever tried 'em? They certainly wouldn't leave as much residue on your signal path as the Behringer. The Aphex Type C with "Big Bottom" is pretty good at adding that low-end, and you'd have a nice top-end sweetener to boot.

Bowisc
 

Rus Bowisc

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And that's my original thread... signal integrity.

Some say the BFD won't impact too much where it works, in the low-end.

Being a newbie to HT, I was surprised how popular the BFD route is for calibrating sub-woofers.


Rus
 

Brian L

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My first choice was a Audio Control unit, having had great experience with their Richter Scale and Bijou products, but as you say, they don't make it any more. At the time, I was not e-bay savy, so I went for the UBP.

FWIW, it was pretty cheap (about $120 at the time, cheaper now, I think). I first learned of these things in Howard Ferstler's book, and was intrigued.

There are so many rock CD's that I like that just don't have the low end to my liking. And I would rather not much with my EQ settings. I go for as flat as I can get, and punch in the UBP is I feel the need.

I am not so chained to using it that I would be to worried if a competing product outperformed it. Thats why its in the tape loop!

BGL
 

BruceD

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The "tape loop" is not where you want to use most of these devices, but rather you want to put it in the sub-out signal path (only that portion of the signal going to the subwoofer) so it only affects the frequencies in the low-bass region.

This is the intent of using a BFD as a Parametric EQ for only the bass modal room frequencies from the sub-out of the prepro or receiver. This way it doesn't affect the signal integrity of the majority of the frequency spectrum going to the main speakers.
 

Brian L

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The "tape loop" is not where you want to use most of these devices, but rather you want to put it in the sub-out signal path (only that portion of the signal going to the subwoofer) so it only affects the frequencies in the low-bass region.
Uhhh, the BFD (when used for EQing a sub) yes, the UBP, no. The tape loop (or between a preamp and poweramp if you are so inclined) is where it wants to go.

It can act on frequecies up to about 130 Hz, and has various controls to allow the user to taylor the effect (it even has a 90 Hz crossover in it, if you need one). While it could work on a sub channel, unless you had a very high crossover, it would not be as effective.

But since this thread is really about BFD issues, I will shut up now.

BGL
 

Wayne A. Pflughaupt

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Uhhh, the BFD (when used for EQing a sub) yes, the UBP, no. The tape loop (or between a preamp and poweramp if you are so inclined) is where it wants to go.
You’re right, Brian, they work best in a tape loop (at least I know the AC does). The processing seems to be affected by signal level. I first had mine connected in the sub path, but when you lowered the volume, at a certain point the processing would just drop out.

Regards,
Wayne A. Pflughaupt
 

Wayne A. Pflughaupt

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Not me. I've been listening with a flat freq response for years, and a house curve doesn't sound right to me.
So Kevin, when you switch your SPL meter between “A” and “C” weighting, the meter reading doesn’t change? If it does, you have a house curve, not flat response. :D

Regards,
Wayne A. Pflughaupt
 

Brian L

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You’re right, Brian, they work best in a tape loop (at least I know the AC does). The processing seems to be affected by signal level. I first had mine connected in the sub path, but when you lowered the volume, at a certain point the processing would just drop out.
And even then, the level is still not quite what the UBP would like, since it is really a piece of pro gear, which seems to want to run with higher levels.

Its still enough to work with, but I would theorize that the SN ratio takes a bit of a hit running at less than optimal signal levels.

BGL
 

BruceD

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Uhhh, the BFD (when used for EQing a sub) yes, the UBP, no. The tape loop (or between a preamp and poweramp if you are so inclined) is where it wants to go.
OK. But I would never put something like that in my main signal path, for me that's just asking for signal degredation. Of course that's just my preference.
 

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