B&W Upgrade Questions - Help!!

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by Arron H, Sep 22, 2002.

  1. Arron H

    Arron H Second Unit

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2002
    Messages:
    332
    Likes Received:
    0
    Here are a couple of upgrade paths that I am considering:

    Trade back B&W603s & LCR6 ($1,180 trade value) for the following:

    CDM 7NT - $2000
    CDM CNT - $600
    Balance - $1420

    Trade back B&W603s & LCR6 ($1,280 trade value) for the following:

    Nautilus 805s - $2000
    Nautilus HTM2 - $1000
    Balance - $1720 (would need to buy stands as well)

    I will be keeping the following equipment:

    B&W601s for surrounds
    Yamaha RXV-1200 receiver
    Adire Rava sub

    Will the 601s be okay for surrounds with the 805s or CDM7s? How much power will be needed for the 805s verses the 7s?

    I would like to add a power amp in a year or two. I am thinking about adding a Rotel RMB1075.

    The CDM 1s are not an option because my dealer requires that the speaker you are trading for be twice as much as the speaker you are trading. After listening yesterday, I liked the CDM 1s almost as much as the 7s when the 1s were accompanied by a sub. The 1s paired with an HGS18 and RMB1075 were really nice. The 7s with the HGS18/Rotel combo were really amazing as well. I really need to give the 805s and HTM2 a listening session next weekend as I have not had a chance to listen to them yet. I am assuming that they will be a significant step up from the 1s but I really need to listen. Opinions please!!!
     
  2. Ned

    Ned Supporting Actor

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2000
    Messages:
    838
    Likes Received:
    0
    Forcing you to upgrade to something that is at least twice as much is rather nasty. Can you afford 804's with the HTM2? 805's are kinda small, I would rather have 7NT's for the money.
    No doubt there will be others bashing the NT's a few replies below mine [​IMG] If you like the 1NT's just push your dealer and he'll probably go along with it. Or you can tell him you'll just shop elsewhere from now on.
     
  3. Kevin T

    Kevin T Screenwriter

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2001
    Messages:
    1,402
    Likes Received:
    1
    if it were in your budget, i would think you should shoot for the 804 / htm2 setup. however, if that's too much...consider the cdm-9nt which, from most accounts i've read, gives nautilus performance at nt price.

    kevin t
     
  4. Thomas_Berg

    Thomas_Berg Screenwriter

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2001
    Messages:
    1,422
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Dallas
    Real Name:
    Thomas
    yes, the CDM9NT's use the Nautilus midrange driver (whereas the others in the NT series do not). if you have the $$ it's worth it to grab the '9NTs.
     
  5. itai

    itai Stunt Coordinator

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2002
    Messages:
    221
    Likes Received:
    0
    if you're on a budget, the cdm7's are an amazing mid range b&w speaker. i wouldn't go the 805 route, as your entering a much more expensive range (the htm is ridiculously expensive), i'd wait to "outgrow" the cdm line first.
    the rvx-1200 isn't enough, consider an amp together with those kind of speakers. it will work, but you wouldn't hear the clean sound the b&w's can put-out at high volumes.
    [​IMG]
     
  6. Arron H

    Arron H Second Unit

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2002
    Messages:
    332
    Likes Received:
    0
    Everyone, thanks for your replies so far. The 804s are definately out of range at this point. They are a truly amazing speaker but beyond my current means. I will go back this weekend and listen to the 9s, 7s, and 805s. I still need to check out the Nautilus and CDM center speakers as well. It looks like the 9s with the CDM center are about the same overall price as the 805s + HTM2 + stands. I should probably give the 9s a closer look. I really liked the 7s and I think they are probably the frontrunner at this point. The 9s do have the Nautilus midrange driver though, hmmmm ......
     
  7. rodneyH

    rodneyH Supporting Actor

    Joined:
    May 22, 2001
    Messages:
    844
    Likes Received:
    0
    I use to have the 7s, now I have the 804s. I bought the 7s vs the 805s b/c I run DVD-a and SACD, so I needed so bass in my speakers. The 7s are a great speaker, my dad has the 9s, but I am not sure the $600 is worth it (at least not in a small/medium size room).

    btw, I run 601s with my 804/htm2, and I think it sounds fine, I am not looking to upgrade any time soon.

    go listen.
     
  8. Jim_F

    Jim_F Screenwriter

    Joined:
    May 15, 2000
    Messages:
    1,077
    Likes Received:
    0
    I love my 805s, but in order to have adequate bass with SACD, I had to use speaker level connections and cross them over through my sub. My sub is up to it, and yours should be too, but it's just something to keep in mind.
     
  9. Mark C.

    Mark C. Supporting Actor

    Joined:
    May 21, 1999
    Messages:
    557
    Likes Received:
    0
    Arron:

    It all comes down to how you want to use your system. If you want a HT that does double-duty as a two-channel or multi-channel audio system, then the NT full-range speakers would be the choice.

    If you are looking primarily with HT in mind, then I would highly recommend going with the 805s and HTM2. You have a fine sub, and the 601s (which I use as my rears) are great. This combination would be a knock your socks off HT system.

    Good Luck
     
  10. Arron H

    Arron H Second Unit

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2002
    Messages:
    332
    Likes Received:
    0
     
  11. Arron H

    Arron H Second Unit

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2002
    Messages:
    332
    Likes Received:
    0
    I had an interesting discussion with the B&W salesman today. He owns the 7s but indicated that for the same $$, the sound quality of the 805s with a sub is far superior to the 7s. He indicated that he would take the 805s in heartbeat but he lives in an apartment where he cannot use a sub and so, he went with the 7s because the 7s are closer to full range.
     
  12. Mark C.

    Mark C. Supporting Actor

    Joined:
    May 21, 1999
    Messages:
    557
    Likes Received:
    0
    I agree with that salesman. Of course, I don't have any interest in DVD-audio or multi-channel SACD. I have Nautilus 804s in my two-channel system and love them. I've toyed with the idea of moving up from the CDMs to the 805s for my HT, but enough is enough.
     
  13. rodneyH

    rodneyH Supporting Actor

    Joined:
    May 22, 2001
    Messages:
    844
    Likes Received:
    0
    Aaron, regarding the HTM2 vs CDMCNT, I have a very very strong opinion (even more so that the 804s sounding better than the CDM7NT-believe it or not). The HTM2 center is much much more open, when you listen to the CDMCNT (even just with test tones) you hear a sort of "echo" sound, the more I listened the more I heard it, My dad has a CDMCNT like I did and I told him to listen for it, after I told him, it became VERY VERY obvious (I did NOT find this same "echo" in the CDM7 or 9). I wasn't dead set on replacing my CDM7 like I was my CDMCNT, but since I got such a great deal on both I went for it (a story that I can't really reveal, other than my best friend works in the Audio industry and got everything for me at less that dealer cost). The CDM7 is a great speaker and the 804 is not as big of an upgrade as the CDMCNT to the HTM2.
     
  14. JayF

    JayF Stunt Coordinator

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 1999
    Messages:
    105
    Likes Received:
    0
    Arron-
    My system consists of 7NTs for mains, 1NTs for surrounds and a CNT. I love the 7NTs & 1NTs, but not at all satisfied with the CNT. If the HTM2 is as good as others say, I'd go with that setup.
    Jay
     
  15. Arron H

    Arron H Second Unit

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2002
    Messages:
    332
    Likes Received:
    0
    ARRGH!! I just found out that the stands for the 805s are $600. Is anybody out there using a more affordable stands with the 805s? The salesman said that the 805s have a unique shape and that only the custom stands work. For the same $$, the CDM 9s may be a better value but I am going to go for a preety heavy listening session tomorrow. Would the 805s+stands be better than the 9s for $2600?
     
  16. Ned

    Ned Supporting Actor

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2000
    Messages:
    838
    Likes Received:
    0
    Your dealer is starting to sound shitty. They will only allow you to trade-in if the value is double or more and they are most likely gouging you on the price for the new speakers. Now they are feeding you this nonsense about the stands. It might be time to cut your losses and find a more reasonable dealer.

    The 9NT's will blow the 805's away when it comes to the lower frequencies, even with the UBER B+W stands

    The 805's will sound more refined but will lack much of the low end.

    JayF-

    Odd position you're taking. The CNT is basically a 1NT with a wider cabinet. Seriously, just look at the two speakers. Notice any resemblance? Maybe your placement is poor?
     
  17. Arron H

    Arron H Second Unit

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2002
    Messages:
    332
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ned,
    It's probably because they are the only Nautilus dealer in town [​IMG] I'm starting to think seriously about buying used and selling my 603s online [​IMG]
     
  18. JayF

    JayF Stunt Coordinator

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 1999
    Messages:
    105
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ned-

    I've noticed the similarity and I've tried placement both above and below my screen. I don't have an acoustically transparent screen so I can't have it directly at ear level. RodneyH posted that he felt the HTM2 sounded more "open", and while I haven't heard that speaker, I would say that kind of describes my problem with the CNT.
    I had a Canton Ergo setup before the B&Ws and I believe that center is a much better performer. But... since I love the 7NTs I'll begrudgingly stick with the CNT. And even though I think the 1NT is great as a surround, I don't think I'd be satisfied with it for any other use.

    Jay
     
  19. Arron H

    Arron H Second Unit

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2002
    Messages:
    332
    Likes Received:
    0
    Okay, listening round 2 is in the books. Here are my subjective observations:

    The CDM 9s & 7s seemed very similar to me. Very nice imaging and very full sounding speakers even without the sub. I know that I should have noticed a dramatic difference given that the 9s incorporate the Nautilus midrange driver and an additional low bass driver. I was expecting a huge difference between the two but they sounded very similar to me. I would say that the 9s seemed a little bit deeper and a little bit more open. The salesman played the 9s first followed by the 7s using the same Rotel amp. He asked me if I noticed a huge difference and I said "not really." He was taken aback by this. Oh well, I said, I guess I'm tone deaf. On the second time through I did notice the extra depth and openess (perhaps the openess is attributable to the Nautilus midrange) but it was not like night and day to me. The 7s with the sub seemed very close to the 9s to me. The CDM CNT did not seem like much of a step up from my LCR6. Like I said, these are my subjective takes for what they are worth.

    N805s: YABBA DABBA DO!!! I really liked this speaker a lot. If I had to sum up in one word, I would describe the 805s as ethereal. IMHO, the 9s & 7s were just not the same. I know this makes absolutely no sense, especially since the 9s have the Nautilus midrange driver but to me it was night and day. The HTM2 was also noticeably better to me. I do not quite know how to deal with the stands issue but the salesman did indicate that you could use less expensive stands with the 805s albeit it would be a "travesty." The one thing that bothers me about this audition was that I listened to the 9s & 7s in a smaller, completely enclosed room. I listened to the 805s in a huge showroom. Perhaps the 9s & 7s would have opened up more in a larger room with the same class A amp that they were using with the 805s? I don't know but the 805s definately worked better for me during this audition.
     
  20. Arron H

    Arron H Second Unit

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2002
    Messages:
    332
    Likes Received:
    0
    I should add that I did not even get to hear the 805s with a sub. Maybe next time.
     

Share This Page