B&K 307 w/ SVS 20-39+'s w/ Behringer 1124---need settings help

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by Harold Leroy, Feb 14, 2002.

  1. Harold Leroy

    Harold Leroy Stunt Coordinator

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    I have a B&K 307, Sampson 1000 and two SVS 20-39+'s. I'm curious about B&K sub speaker level settings, bass management sub level and Sampson 1000 gain/volume setting.

    My Sampson is set at max (as recommended by many), B&K sub level at -12 and B&K sub speaker level at -4. At these levels I get 75dbs for the subs when I'm in the speaker level settings screen on the B&K. When I do a frequency sweep with the B&K base amnagement, everything below 100hz is over 80dbs and in some cases 100dbs (never near 75dbs).

    I know I need to EQ and I'm ready to proceed, but when I'm in the initial B&K speaker level screen and I measure 75dbs, shouldn't I be somewhere near 75dbs at least in part of the frequency sweep?

    I have read in several posts to keep the Sampson at max. I have also read to set the input levels from per/pro to a point where the Behringer 1124 just starts to clip (orange light blinking)--this is while the Behringer is in the by-pass mode. I used U-571 and the orange light blinks during depth charge scene when I have my B&K volume at a little higher than my normal listening, -8dbs below reference.

    It seems to me the only way to get the volume at a near normal level during my frequency sweep is to turn down the gain on my Sampson. If I lower the input from my B&K, the Behringer doesn't get even cloe to the orange light (or near clipping--perhaps this near clipping level isn't too important).

    I know I should post the actual measurements, but I know something in the volume string has to be changed before I start--I just need to know where I should lower the volume--where's the best place to start.

    Thanks for the help
     
  2. Harold Leroy

    Harold Leroy Stunt Coordinator

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    Bump
     
  3. Bill_D

    Bill_D Supporting Actor

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  4. Harold Leroy

    Harold Leroy Stunt Coordinator

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    Bill,

    Thanks, that's a great thread and I had read it before. My question doesn't really deal with the Behringer 1124 settings, it's more fundamental--I think I need to lower my overall volume and I want to know the best place to do that and get the cleanest signal--also keeping in mind the near clipping level for the Behringer. Perhaps I'm placing too much emphasis on the Behringer input level.

    Sorry if my question isn't expressed clearly.

    I was hoping to find someone that had a similar set-up and we could compare volume/input settings.
     
  5. Harold Leroy

    Harold Leroy Stunt Coordinator

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    Advice please
     
  6. brucek

    brucek Second Unit

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    Harold,

    The important setting to start with is getting the input level to your BFD properly set using its LED readout and ignore the SPL levels of your system. Once this is accomplished, then you can freely adjust the SPL level of your sub with the subs own amp setting. If that isn't at maximum, then so be it. Then setup your filters and readjust the SPL level of your sub amp if neccessary with its own volume again to get your +10dB above mains or whatever end SPL level you like.

    Read the reprinted except below that I wrote for Sonnie Parkers site. It may help.

     
  7. Harold Leroy

    Harold Leroy Stunt Coordinator

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    Bruce,

    Thank you for the very detailed response. I was trying to keep the sub amp at max--as some recommended, but I was pretty sure the BFD needed a high enough input to be able to deal with it properly.

    Thanks for the help.

    Harold
     
  8. Rick Radford

    Rick Radford Supporting Actor

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    Harold,

    I just caught your thread. Your BFD input question was one I struggled with as well and was surprised to find little public help here. I assume few have bothered with this or else found it to be a non-issue. If the latter was the case, it would have been nice to know.

    The problem for me was that "low input level" was not qualified in any way that I could relate to.

    BFD customer support says:

    "-30 is a little too low to detect feedback filters. For parametric equalizer use the input level should come up to -10, if you are in -10dBV mode."

    WayneP found and sent me that info that BruceK quoted which I found most helpful. I didn't see that verbatim on Sonnie's site, so I assume Sonnie paraphrased BruceK's info.

    Regarding the BFD: I do not see any way to control the output level from the BFD. The only way I see to calibrate the sub (once you have set the input level to the BFD and setup filters) is to alter the gain of the Samson.

    When I setup my input level to the BFD, I used a ref level volume setting of my receiver (a setting I had previously determined) and then cranked the receiver's sub trim while playing some bass intensive material (I used Titan, AE) and watched the BFD input levels (in bypass mode).

    I probably set it a bit low (never saw anything above a yellow -3dB light), and hope my normal listening levels of -10 to -25 dB are sufficient for the DACs to operate properly.

    Hope this helps.
     
  9. brucek

    brucek Second Unit

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    Rick,
    The info that I quoted was from the "linked" review that can be found verbatim on Sonnie's site. Sonnie liked my review and asked if he could include it on his site for a more technical side to the BFD.
    Sonnie's site on the BFD for those that don't know is at:
    http://www.troycable.net/~snap/bfdinfo.htm
    The review I quoted is at:
    http://www.troycable.net/~snap/brucekreviewofbfd.htm
    Anyway, if your levels are in the -10dB to -25dB, then you're in great shape. The BFD is still quite accurate even at low levels of -40dB for quiet passages, but obviously you would like to operate in the middle region with the red LED "almost" never coming on.
    To control the output of the BFD I use an X-30. It has quite a bit of control over the signal and is handy because it can be physically placed directly beside your processor for quick use if you need it. It has quite a good output volume range providing its own amplification. Unity gain is realized about half volume on the dial.
    brucek
     
  10. Rick Radford

    Rick Radford Supporting Actor

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    brucek,

    >The info that I quoted was from the "linked" review<

    Sonnie's site is quite thorough and I missed that link with all the info there. Thanks!

    >if your levels are in the -10dB to -25dB, then you're in great shape.<

    When I reread my msg, I can see that I was unclear with this reference. I was referring to -10 to -25 under ref being normal listening levels. I'll have to check the BFD output LED's to see what it's doing with that Master Volume setting.

    I've seen the X30 mentioned a number of times around here, but I've never investigated it to learn more about it. Sounds like another tweak may be due. (but after I upgrade my SVS cs driver to the csi driver!)
     
  11. Harold Leroy

    Harold Leroy Stunt Coordinator

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    Rick/Bruce,

    WOW, what a great thread. I was in Myrtle the last 8 days and this is the first chance for me to see all your great feedback. Thanks for all the help. This should also help others with this input delema.

    Thanks,

    Harold
     

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