Are you still against colorization of B&W films and TV shows?

Discussion in 'After Hours Lounge (Off Topic)' started by Sam Posten, Feb 14, 2017.

  1. Sam Posten

    Sam Posten Moderator
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    I've always been with the "Tell Ted Turner to keep his damn crayola crayons away from my films" mentality, but I've seen some recent examples that are pretty damn slick. The technology and skills needed continue to improve.
    A recent example from Reddit:


    Has your view softened? Will you be against it for life?
     
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  2. Jim517

    Jim517 Stunt Coordinator

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    I'm against it for life !!! Some people hate black and white movies. Not me.
     
  3. Malcolm R

    Malcolm R Executive Producer

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    I'm against it if the color version is then the only version offered for sale/viewing to the public. If it's offered as an alternative version alongside the original B&W version, I don't really have an issue.
     
  4. TravisR

    TravisR Studio Mogul

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    Yeah, I'll never watch a colorized version of something but as long as the B&W one is always available, I don't care if a colorized version is also available.
     
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  5. Jonathan Perregaux

    Jonathan Perregaux Screenwriter

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    Against you!

    [​IMG]
     
  6. Steve...O

    Steve...O Producer

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    Against it. I'd rather the dollars spent in such efforts be spent on film restoration and preservation and not film revisionism.
     
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  7. Josh Steinberg

    Josh Steinberg Lead Actor
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    What Malcolm said.

    Sometimes colorization can benefit restoration. When Legend Films colorizes something, they restore the original B&W version first and then colorize the restoration. Both versions then appear on the disc. Sounds like a win-win to me.
     
  8. RobertR

    RobertR Lead Actor

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    Against it, now and forever.
     
  9. Tony Bensley

    Tony Bensley Producer

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    I much prefer original Black & White presentations, as opposed to Colorized efforts.

    However, not long ago, there were numerous comparison screenshots from original Black & White and Colorized BEWITCHED episodes, in which the Color for the latter was turned off. The result was that there was no significant difference in grey scale. If anything, the lack of detail in the Columbia House VHS transferred BEWITCHED screenshots was far more evident than any detectable grey scale differential.

    What this tells me, is that even if a Colorized version is all that is available, it does not necessarily mean that a simple dialing down of the Color can't make for a proper, original presentation in a Home Theater setting.

    CHEERS! :)
     
  10. Josh Steinberg

    Josh Steinberg Lead Actor
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    I still think that's an unsubstantiated rumor. I've yet to see one piece of real evidence that that's true.
     
  11. Tony Bensley

    Tony Bensley Producer

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    Hi Josh!

    With all due respect, in your previous post, you only quoted the first line in my own above quote. I can only assume that by real evidence, you meant the part of there being no significant difference in grey scale between the "turned off" Colorized BEWITCHED episode on the Sony DVD, and the same original Black & White episode taken from one of the VHS Columbia House sets. If my assessment is incorrect, please do kindly clarify this.

    For the record, I was the one who posted screenshots of the "turned off" Colorized DVD episode in one of the HTF Bewitched Threads, which I accomplished by using the controls on my VLC Media Player. Others who posted the VHS Columbia House screenshots (Bob O'Link was one of those) were of the opinion that there appeared to be no significant difference in grey scale between the two sources, which I agreed with. However, I do concede that this is subject to opinion.

    I'm of the camp that so long as an original Black & White version of a given title is available, the inclusion of a Colorized version doesn't bother me.

    CHEERS! :)

    Tony
     
  12. Josh Steinberg

    Josh Steinberg Lead Actor
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    Tony, with respect, screenshots showing that the greyscale is similar between the color and B&W versions isn't proof that Sony used the colorized masters to create the B&W DVDs.

    Only Sony - or someone from Sony who worked on the release - could confirm if colorized masters were used. There is no evidence to suggest they have done this. That the colorized DVD with the color turned off look the same as the VHS tapes from B&W prints does not prove the B&W DVDs were from colorized masters. Anything else is just conjecture.
     
  13. Tony Bensley

    Tony Bensley Producer

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    For the record, the basis is the fact that the same 2000 copyright notice is superimposed above both the Black & White and Colorized releases of the first two seasons. It may not be absolutely irrefutable proof that Colorized masters were used for the Sony Black & White BEWITCHED seasons, but I consider it a pretty darn likely indicator that it was, especially considering that 2000 copyright does not appear in the subsequent real Color BEWITCHED seasons. My overriding point is, apart from the annoying superimposed 2000 copyright on both Sony DVD versions, it really does not matter, insofar as affected grey scale (Or lack thereof!) is concerned.

    CHEERS! :)
     
  14. Sam Posten

    Sam Posten Moderator
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    Let's not let the past wars fought in the crazy television forums cloud this discussion. Keep to the original Q and BE NICE
     
  15. Tony Bensley

    Tony Bensley Producer

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    I feel that Josh and I have kept the discussion respectful, but I agree with you that any further discussion should stick to the original topic in question.

    On that note, the main issue remaining with Colorization accuracy seems to be with flesh tones.

    CHEERS! :)
     
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  16. sidburyjr

    sidburyjr Second Unit

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    I don't think it's needed now but a long time ago ( but not in a galaxy far, far away), when cable packages had a dozen channels or so and there was no such place as HBO et al, local stations were reluctant to show old black and white movies. So Ted started colorizing movies to get them on tv. Given the choice between seeing "The Maltese Falcon" in color or not seeing it at all, seeing it is my preference. And in case it isn't clear, I was in favor of colorization.

    Two interesting facts:

    I was in DC when congress was looking at colorization James Stewart was there to testify (IIRC against it). That night o. A local station he was interviewed by a local anchor. She was sympathetic to his position and affirmed
    It by telling Stewart that the previous weekend she had watched a colorized version of Hitchcock's "The Birds" and it just wasn't as good as the original. Jimmy Stewart was kind enough not to tell her.

    The DVD of "The Mist" has as an extra of the movie decolorized for those who think horror movies are better in black and white. It was made in color to help the box office.
     
  17. Carabimero

    Carabimero Producer
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    If a colorized version means a film is restored and preserved for posterity when it otherwise wouldn't be, I don't think advanced colorization is bad--as long as the restored B&W is equally available.
     
  18. TJPC

    TJPC Supporting Actor

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    I have long thought that colonization would be a boon to film restoration. Many 2 strip technicolor movies from the late silent/early sound era only exist in black and white copies. What about restoring these?

    What about original directors who would have filmed in colour if budgets allowed and who supervise colonization of their own films like Ray Harryhausen?
    Lastly what about numbers like "I Used To Be Colorblind?" from "Carefree" that was supposed to be filmed in colour but was not because RKO cheeped out?
     
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  19. Rodney

    Rodney Screenwriter

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    I think it is unfortunate that their are people out there that will not watch a film that is in not in color.
    I would not wish to see Out of the Past or He Walked by Night colorized.
    I watched It's a Wonderful Life, and it just looked wrong to me.
    Having said all that, I am all for it when it benefits restoration and release of the original B&W.
     
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  20. Mark-P

    Mark-P Producer

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    I suppose I have a bit of a double standard in that I'm somewhat more tolerant of colorized TV shows than I am of movies. For example I've been enjoying the recent colorized broadcasts of I Love Lucy, The Andy Griffith Show, and The Dick Van Dyke Show. Most often the decision to shoot TV shows in B&W was a network mandate rather than an artistic choice.
     
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