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Are my speakers "small?"

Discussion in 'Speakers' started by Nathan Bjork, May 15, 2004.

  1. Nathan Bjork

    Nathan Bjork Stunt Coordinator

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    Hello everybody,

    I remember looking at a thread a while back and it was on setting your speakers to small or large on your AVR. I just skimmed through the thread and didn't read much. I searched for this question but couldn't find anything. So if anyone can point me to a thread or give me an answer that would be great.

    Well here's my question:
    -Im using a H/K AVR 230 (50Wx6)
    -A Sony WM500 sub (150W-12in)
    -Front L&R~ JBL S38II (3-way, 8in-woofer, 4in-mid, 1in-tweerer)x2
    -Center~ JBL S-CenterII (3-way, dual 5 1/2 woofer, 4-inmid, 1in-tweeter)x1
    -Surround~ JBL N26II (2-way, 6in, 3/4 tweeter)x2
    -Surround Back~ JBL N24II (2-way, 4in woofer, 3/4 tweeter)x1
    -10x10 room no openings (unless door is open)

    Should I use the large or small speaker setting on my AVR?
    I can't really tell to much of a differnce when all speakers are set to large or small, is this because my AVR is not powerful enough?

    Thanks
     
  2. Wayne Ernst

    Wayne Ernst Cinematographer

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    It seems like your speakers should be able to handle bass down to 40Hz or so. I'd run them as "large" speakers so they can still play some bass - and then let your sub take over from there. Given the lower frequency response of your speakers, you could set the crossover on your H/K receiver to 60Hz or so.

    Also, there is another question that you should be asking. With your receiver, you could direct bass to both your JBL speakers and the subwoofer, so when you listen to 2-channel music, the sub would be able to augument the S38 speakers.

    I think that H/K receiver has enough power for the room size and what you are driving with it.
     
  3. Johnny_M

    Johnny_M Second Unit

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    well i have yamaha speakers that technically qualify as large, but when i set them to small the sound is MUCH better. it allows the sub to deal with all the base, thus allowing the amps of the receiver to only have to push treble and midrange. when i set it this way for example, someone with a very deep voice when talking if you put your ear next to the sub, you can hear it helping to produce their voice, where-as when setting the speakers to large this doesnt happen. if i were you i would try it both ways and see what ya like.

    Johnny
     
  4. ScottCHI

    ScottCHI Screenwriter

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    i vote for "small" all the way around
     
  5. Nathan Bjork

    Nathan Bjork Stunt Coordinator

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    Thanks Wayne,

    I went into my H/K setup and set my front 3 speakers to large. Now my sub options are LFE and L&R+LFE. If I have it set to just LFE, if I have it set to LFE+L&R does that mean the sub takes over LFE and my L&R LFE, or does it mean that is uses LFE and SHARES the L&R LFE?

    I have all of the specs for my speakers (from JBL) and this is what it looks like

    -S38~ 45hz
    -S-Center~ 75hz
    -N26~ 55hz

    Should I set my L&R to x-over 60hz? When my center is set to large I cannot set an x-over, so should I have it set to small at 80hz or lage at "----"
     
  6. ScottCHI

    ScottCHI Screenwriter

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    set all your speakers to SMALL with an 80Hz xover
     
  7. Nathan Bjork

    Nathan Bjork Stunt Coordinator

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    Didnt see the rest of the post's took to long to write my last one. Im going to see what I like best now, Large or small, the only deffernce I can tell is when its set to small the sub sounds "boomy" . So I like just the L&R large and the rest at small, it seems to level out the bass more.

    thanks again
     
  8. Lewis Besze

    Lewis Besze Producer

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    To me the rule of thumb is that if any of the speakers can't match the sub in extension and output then set them to small.
    Yes the 80hz setting seems "ideal" in your case.
     
  9. ScottCHI

    ScottCHI Screenwriter

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    have you calibrated you speakers properly? your sub is probably set too loud.
     
  10. Phil Iturralde

    Phil Iturralde Screenwriter

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    I agree with those that recommend that you set your HT speakers to "Small". ... and let your AV Receiver handle the X-over chores @ 80 Hz.

    The sub should never sound boomy no matter what option you choose, ... ScottCHI is probably correct, so lower the sub's level.

    FYI: Sound&Vision objective benchmark for the S38 is ...


    Phil
     
  11. John Roger

    John Roger Stunt Coordinator

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    Yeah i have experienced that too.The bass is more even, though i use 6 1/2 woofer speaker for mains.My amp crosses at 150hz.I don't know to change this.
    Maybe the mains help the bass to fill the room more evenly.
     
  12. Nathan Bjork

    Nathan Bjork Stunt Coordinator

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    Thanks everyone, I will lower my sub 4db, set my speakers to small and crossover to 80hz.
     
  13. David K.

    David K. Second Unit

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    i have a question, my setup uses the same receiver, at least last years

    i have a hk avr 225, i have mirage omni bookshelves connected.

    omni cc 90 db
    omni 60 fronts 1" tweeter 6.5" woofer 91 db

    and omni 50 rears 1" tweeter 5.5" woofer 91 db

    along with the same sub again but last years sawm40 two of them stacked.

    for the longest time, i had them on small, and they always sounded too bright. then i read this post and decided to make them all large

    all of a sudden mid frequencies were audible that were not before, the image became a lot sharper and the sound became huge filling up the room. they didnt sound like the same speakers!

    i used to be able to play t3 at insanely loud levels with no disotrion of harm. on small setting .....

    but im afraid to play any soundtrack thats dynamically intensive, can someone tell me if setting all of these to large is too much for my hk to handle?
     
  14. ScottCHI

    ScottCHI Screenwriter

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    the hk will be fine. i'd worry more about the speakers.
     
  15. David K.

    David K. Second Unit

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    will my speakers clip from the hk?

    i on loud music listening if i abuptly switch tracks i hear a quick pop when the new track plays, as if theres a burst of energy.

    so should i keep them at small? i dont want to kill my speakers.
     
  16. David K.

    David K. Second Unit

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    i decided to bitw the bullet and test it, i put in lion king enhanced mix, and it went through safely, no clipping or shutdown, i thought i heard a tiny pop in a voice but it could be the 10 year old movie sound track.

    then the monster....

    i put in t3 and played the entire cran truck sequence at relatively loud levels, the bass seemed low, then i realized i had only one sub on, and switched the 2nd on. it sounds amazing, its no longer bright and piercing but seems pleasant to listen to at loud levels. the scene lasted 15 minutes and i didnt hear any distortion, but then there were so many things going on that i dont know if i couldve heard it if it did distort.

    the amp kep going without a sweat, i was expecting it to shut off, and i was cringing the whole time. but it never did, and the churned out all the effects without trouble. does it mean im safe?
     
  17. Johnny_M

    Johnny_M Second Unit

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    i would say so. speakers can usually take alot before they blow. i doubt your amp will be powerful enough to hurt them, unless your listening at levels that would hurt your ears. i've always pushed speakers to their limits, and have never killed one yet...

    of course now that i say that..



    Johnny
     
  18. David K.

    David K. Second Unit

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    i doubt your amp will be powerful enough to hurt them,

    im not concerned about that, im more concerned about "Underpowering" them. my amps o(tiny ones)utput is only 50 watts per channel [​IMG] i here more pops and stuff when theres sudden shifts in sound like when i switch surround formats on the fly.
     
  19. Jason Bell

    Jason Bell Stunt Coordinator

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    DavidK,

    That pop you're hearing when you switch inputs or surround modes on the fly is not clipping. I always turn my volume down if I'm gonna switch modes or inputs.

    Clipping is like this hideous distortion. The best way I can think to describe it is have you ever been in someones car with a stock radio and they got it really cranked and the treble sounds so harsh it hurts your ears and you cant really hear the bass anymore because everthing is really compressed.

    If you made it through those movies and you didnt hear any distortion I think you are safe.

    Enjoy the movies dont be so paranoid you spend the whole time with your hand on the volume control listening for distortion.[​IMG].
     

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