are Happy Days season 2 music rights keeping L&S and M&M behind?

Discussion in 'TV on DVD and Blu-ray' started by Jay_B!, Jun 22, 2005.

  1. Jay_B!

    Jay_B! Screenwriter

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    I remember last fall, Paramount released the top 3 Garry Marshall shows all at once, with Mork And Mindy about 3 weeks after Happy Days and Laverne And Shirley.

    It's well known that Happy Days has some pricey music rights and that is probably the backup from why season 2 isn't out yet (the rest of the seasons after 2 were filmed with a studio audience and used much less period music), but... it seems like this Happy Days backup is keeping the season 2 releases of Laerne And Shirley and Mork And Mindy from coming, even tho it's been almost a year now.

    Considering Sony has been releasing the Norman Lear shows in jumbled order, as opposed to doing day-and-date with AITF, Sanford and Jeffersons, why not have Paramount go ahead and give us seasons 2 of M&M and L&S while they're still negotiating the music for Happy Days?
     
  2. Paul Miller

    Paul Miller Supporting Actor

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    I'm still waiting on Mork & Mindy Season Two myself. Hopefully whatever the problem or delay is it will get solved soon.



    Paul
     
  3. Gord Lacey

    Gord Lacey Cinematographer

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    Or it could be due to lack of sales...

    Gord
     
  4. Jay_B!

    Jay_B! Screenwriter

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    so Mork And Mindy's been abandoned? I don't care so much for HD and L&S but I did want to further my Mork collection on DVD
     
  5. Scott Kimball

    Scott Kimball Screenwriter

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    Nobody said that.

    -Scott
     
  6. Hank E

    Hank E Stunt Coordinator

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    I have a friend who works at Paramount. It's a rights issue.
     
  7. MichaelColvin

    MichaelColvin Stunt Coordinator

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    Do you know what kind of rights issue and what's being done about it? It'd be great to get these releases out.

    cheers, Michael
     
  8. Hank E

    Hank E Stunt Coordinator

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    I think it mainly has to do with music. I'll try to find out more info.
     
  9. MichaelColvin

    MichaelColvin Stunt Coordinator

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    Sounds great. It'd be curious to find out.

    I also have the feeling that they might want to see if this is more of a catalog title that sells better over time then having initial demand.

    cheers, Michael
     
  10. Hank E

    Hank E Stunt Coordinator

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    So I talked to my friend. It appears future releases for these series have been cancelled because of music rights issues. Apparently "Happy Days" season 2 would cost several million in music rights alone. Whether or not they decide to release them with replaced music is unknown, but as of right now... they're dead in the water.

    [​IMG]
     
  11. Edward Schatz

    Edward Schatz Second Unit

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    Just for the sake of putting my point of view out there, no product is better than half a product (i.e. replaced music). However, that's a debate that will never end. I should be chastised for even saying anything [​IMG]
     
  12. Mikah Cerucco

    Mikah Cerucco Cinematographer

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    Most artists don't own the rights to their own masters. We saw this with the Beatles (MJ owning them), and Prince notoriously had issues with it. So we're talking about one money-hungry industry (records) saying to another money-hungry industry (movie) "not without our cut."

    It seems to me the record companies are being excessively greedy and stupid, but I could be wrong. Anybody out there in the know have a different take? Wouldn't it be better to take a smaller payment rather than no payment, especially since it could introduce more folks to the songs and maybe more will buy them? Why lock up these songs... especially when there's little market for most of them?

    This has become a huge problem for TV-on-DVD.

    Too bad a multimedia company like Dreamworks (movies, records, etc.) hasn't been able to help drag these behemoths into the new millennium.
     
  13. Jaime_Weinman

    Jaime_Weinman Supporting Actor

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    Isn't the issue here probably songs, rather than record companies? "Happy Days" used a few original recordings, but mostly they used cover versions of '50s standards. The problem being, of course, that to release a DVD you still have to pay the owners of the songs.
     
  14. Carlos Garcia

    Carlos Garcia Screenwriter

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    That's awful news! I was looking forward to season 2 of Happy Days, as I consider only the first 2 seasons to be what the show was originally intended to be before it became totally silly. It's a shame season 2 won't be coming out, but when you think about it, after season 2 they started using less and less original music, and instead used Anson Williams to sing most of the songs used on the show. It might make alot of sense for Paramount to forget about season 2 and maybe go directly to seasons 3 and beyond so they won't have to worry about a licensing rights nightmare.
     
  15. JeffWld

    JeffWld Stunt Coordinator

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    Greed seems to eclipse logic in these situations. Music rights owners recognize that the DVD industry turned into a somewhat unexpected cash cow-and now they want to make hay while the sun shines. Case in point:

    One distributor was prepared to put out the short-lived Tim Conway series "Rango". There were only 17 episodes produced. However the composers of the show's theme (Earle Hagen and Ben Raleigh)wanted a fixed amount for each time the song was used (17 X 2 = 34 times). The requested amount would have added approx. $10 to each box set sold. The distributor declined and the project died.

    As a result, the composers wind up with nothing. Pretty stupid considering that this was the first time in almost 40 years that they had the opportunity to realize any revenue from this long-forgotten composition. Maybe they think that 40 years from now, someone will come along and offer their asking price. Not likely.
     
  16. Jay_B!

    Jay_B! Screenwriter

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    why can't we get more Laverne and Mork over Happy Days' music rights?
     
  17. Randy*S

    Randy*S Second Unit

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    Yes, why can't paramount at least release S2 of Mork which did'nt use music from outside composers.
     
  18. Jay_B!

    Jay_B! Screenwriter

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    it really doesn't make sense, I like L&S and M&M over HD anyways.

    Just because they're spinoffs means anything, just look at Sony and the Norman Lear shows.... Good Times was the spinoff of a spinoff of All In The Family, yet next month, more GT seasons will be out on DVD than AITF DVD's, and Maude (the show that spun GT) doesn't have ONE DVD out yet.

    Why can't Paramount suck up the music rights for season 2 of HD? once the show went to a studio audience in season 3, less and less music was used on the show anyways that if Paramount averaged out the music they'd have to spend for season 2 and then what they'd spend for seasons 3-11, it'd probably be a very low and reasonable average. The show was hardly The Wonder Years in terms of using music the entire run.
     
  19. Mikah Cerucco

    Mikah Cerucco Cinematographer

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    Yes. I meant to say Music Industry instead of record companies. The point I was making is the casual observer isn't always clear about who is really holding up these things. If I want to use Whitney Houston's rendition of, "I Will Always Love You" do I have to get permission from Whitney, Dolly, or the record company responsible for the specific rendition I want?

    There are regular record industry contracts that cover regular royalties, but those only cover certain pre-defined situations. I don't know how it works for using songs in TV on DVD. I just heard Stevie Wonder's "Sir Duke" in an Episode of Good Times (S4). Did they have to get approval for that, and did they have to pay someone for it?

    I want Happy Days as much as the next guy, but as much as Hollywood cries broke way too much, I understand they are a business. If it were my money, I wouldn't put out a DVD I didn't think I could make money on. If I have to put $100k into something including all expenses, and my expected profit margin on any product is 30%, I expect to make $130k. If the music rights come in at $50k instead of $10k (let's just say), my choices are to accept less profit or raise the price of the box set.

    We've already told the studios over and over (for the most part) that we're not paying exhorbitant prices for old TV-on-DVD. Not en masse anyway. They're simply looking at the numbers and making sound business decisions.

    I say the music industry (which I should have said instead of record companies) needs to get realistic about this stuff. Get your fair cut, but don't be ridiculous.
     
  20. Peter Raber

    Peter Raber Stunt Coordinator

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    I think once the music industry sees that the studios owning the rights to the TV shows will not play ball and give them stupid money they will start to come to their senses.

    Remember just a short time ago there was hardly any tv on dvd. For some reason, the studios never saw this as a viable market, and it just exploded on them. So they scrambled to get out as much as they could. Maybe Paramount payed ridculous amounts of money for the rights to the music on Season 1 and at this time the music industry wants the same amount. Paramount is obviously balking. Someone will blink though. There's just too much money to be made. I think the studios are trying to stand firm at the moment. We may never knows who caves in at the end, but someone will concede.

    It just sucks for fans who want it in a reasonable time-frame and yet have to wait for greedy businessmen.
     

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