Apple HomePod (1 Viewer)

[DaveF]

I
Mean you could say the same thing for every Apple product but especially AppleTV

Uhm....no?

Apple brings products that do what people want better at higher prices. Especially with iPhones and iPads which is why they’re so popular.

The HomePod is worse than competition and costs like 5x more.

AppleTV at risk of being in this category. It’s overpriced without commensurate benefit for most people.

AIrPods Pro Max latest speculation if it survives as super niche, super expensive, audio gear.

 

[DaveF]

Very good summary from the article you linked to. Ultimately it shows how clueless most of the constant "HomePod is overpriced" criticism is, unless sound quality is considered worthless.
Mind you, Apple was warned that "most people don't care about sound quality". I guess it was a question of the size of the minority that does, or Apple's failure in promoting the HomePod to precisely that minority

I don’t understand your critique. The criticism that HomePod is too expensive is proven correct. And apparently it didn’t sell and failed. Because people want a $50 smart assistant. And Apple tried to sell them a $300 one. That is perceived to be worse than the $50 ones.

So Apple came out with the HP mini. Because $100 is in line with what people will pay.

 

[Ted Todorov]

I don’t understand your critique. The criticism that HomePod is too expensive is proven correct. And apparently it didn’t sell and failed. Because people want a $50 smart assistant. And Apple tried to sell them a $300 one. That is perceived to be worse than the $50 ones.

So Apple came out with the HP mini. Because $100 is in line with what people will pay.

Maybe we read a different article, but the quote I gave was that the HomePod was *better* than some more, if not considerably more expensive speakers. There certainly were not *any* that cost less but still had the same audio quality.
"It uses audio technology that debuted in speakers costing tens of thousands of dollars, and was previously unavailable in anything costing less than four figures."
That is my point. Anyone who wanted a $50 smart assistant clearly had no interest in sound quality -- when I heard the Amazon Echo* at someone's house, it was a joke, not a serious speaker.
Again, I understand that a sufficiently large market by Apple's standard didn't exist for the HomePod.
But from my point of view it would have been fine, with no Siri, just AirPlay 2 as a competitor for existing Bose and Sonos wireless speakers instead of the terrible ones from Amazon. Siri is just a bonus

*Honestly Amazon would have to pay ME a substantial amount of money to willingly run an Alexa Echo in my house

 

[DaveF]

I think we’re in violent agreement, mostly. The cost is probably fine, even great, for its audio technology. I don’t recall people arguing otherwise, but maybe some did.

But overall the critique that it was overpriced was seemingly dead on: HomePod was overpriced for the market of smart assistant speakers, particularly for a company that demands of its products huge market sales, not niche sales.

Unfortunately for its fans, that $300 speaker market is a weird one. Kind of a no-man’s land for speaker buyers.

If Apple liked small-market sales, the HomePod would likely continue. Sonos could totally live off this thing, I imagine. But a Trillion $ company demands Billion $ “home runs”, and if HomePod was a ”puny” $10M or something, it’s getting a lot of side eye.

 

[Ted Todorov]

If Apple liked small-market sales, the HomePod would likely continue. Sonos could totally live off this thing, I imagine. But a Trillion $ company demands Billion $ “home runs”, and if HomePod was a ”puny” $10M or something, it’s getting a lot of side eye.

I totally agree: and honestly I think that Apple is making a mistake. They spend vast amounts of money on advertising. Why not take a few million from the ad budget and finance (affordable) Apple Cinema Displays, AirPort, HomePods, etc. Think of them as advertising instead of products. Instead of Dell or LG monitors, people see Apple monitors with Mac Minis or old(er) Mac Pros. Instead of people getting aggravated by the router/wifi they *rent* from the cable company, they are happy with their AirPort and the superior support plus bonuses depending on the kind, like attaching the printer, backup HD for computers or AirPlay 2 for old receivers/stereo systems. Etc.

Look at Tesla -- their advertising budget is zero -- they even fired their communications (marketing) staff. They think that every Tesla EV they sell is the most valuable advertising they can get, and the Tesla customers are way more effective than any marketing exec they could ever put on salary. Even the customers themselves aren't showing off to their friends -- the friends are pestering them for info or rides. It is a magical, self created advertising system.

Apple already does have some of that, but a few additional low margin products can only help and be a lot more useful that TV ads in 2021

 

[Carlo_M]

The one thing I think all can agree on (fans and detractors alike) is that the HomePod did not meet Apple's sales expectations, and subsequently the product was discontinued due to that. This isn't the first or last Apple product that will be discontinued.

Where my view differs from the "it was simply a too expensive smart speaker and that's why it failed" viewpoint, is that I believe that sentiment to be correct from the Customer's Perspective.

I don't think Apple themselves had any illusion that people would suddenly en masse replace their $50 Alexas with $300 devices with an AI that lagged behind the others.

I think Apple wanted to move the goalposts. As they did with the iPhone and iPad. Those of us who remember when iPhone was rumored to be created with a, gasp, touchscreen, heard a lot of rumblings especially by younger people (I work at a university) who were expert at texting with their tactile buttons without having to look at their phones. A touchscreen keyboard would be disastrous and would require having to relearn how to type. Also the iPhone was so much more expensive than the flip phones they were using. 15 years later, and just about everyone on campus has a smartphone, and a high percentage of them is an iPhone.

I believe Apple thought there was a sub-demographic of the smart speaker crowd that wanted a better sounding speaker (and again, if you haven't heard a stereo HomePod setup, you are likely underestimating how good it sounds) and would come for the ride. There are some very smart people who work at Apple and they had to know the majority of $50 Echo folks weren't going to switch, any first year BusEcon student could have told them that.

What I believe ended up happening was that the number of people who did come over was not as high as they would have wanted to sustain the product's evolving lifecycle. The HomePod doesn't scream for regular upgrades like iPhones/iPads do. It's a sell-it-once-until-it-breaks device.

The end result is the same, the HomePod is dead, long live the HomePod. I just don't think it was because Apple mistakenly thought they could dominate the smart speaker space. They had to know they'd only get a small slice of the market due to the price. They just underestimated how small the slice was.

 

[DavidJ]

I believe Apple thought there was a sub-demographic of the smart speaker crowd that wanted a better sounding speaker (and again, if you haven't heard a stereo HomePod setup, you are likely underestimating how good it sounds) and would come for the ride. There are some very smart people who work at Apple and they had to know the majority of $50 Echo folks weren't going to switch, any first year BusEcon student could have told them that.

There was definitely that sub-demographic but it may not have been as large as they thought or too many like me in that demographic made another choice. I looked extensively at the HomePod and decided to go another route. As good as the sound was compared to anything from Amazon or one Sonos One, it was not as good as the two Sonos Ones I got for the almost the same price. With two, I have stereo sound. So, I got the improved sound I wanted, while still having a smart assistant that is better than Siri. Too bad she’s a gossip.

 

[DaveF]

re: the market size. It’s not just that slice of people who would spend $600 ($700 at launch?) for *stereo* (not surround or Atmos) speakers. But who also *only* listen to music or tv through AppleTV or iPhone. Roku, fire stick, smart tv....nope.

Those people exist. But that doesn’t seem like a big customer base to start from.

Maybe the plan was to Apple Watch it, which grows more independent and versatile every year, becoming less niche?

Maybe one day we’ll get the behind the scenes story. It’s got to be interesting.

 

[Robert Saccone]

I was able to pick up one at Best Buy so that I would now have the mate for the one in my home office. I had ordered an open box item that was supposed to be in excellent condition. There were no new ones available. When I got there they couldn’t locate it after they tried for about 40 minutes. In the end it turned out they had a new one and they gave me that at an even further discount than what I was supposed to pay for the open box version. Very happy. Hopefully Apple supports these at least with basic functionality for a number of years to come as they sound great.

 

[Ted Todorov]

Maybe one day we’ll get the behind the scenes story. It’s got to be interesting.

The latest ATP episode has an absolutely excellent summary of what happened to the HomePod: https://atp.fm/422

The history they mention is that Apple was working on the never released Apple HDTV set, and the HomePods were meant to be its sound system.

It seemed like a waste for a great product, so they released it solo, but they never thought through how to provide input not coming from an AppleTV -- i.e. from the ARC (audio return channel) of your existing TV set, which would allow you to work with DVD/Blu-ray, your cable box/TiVo, etc. the way a Sonos sounder does.

 

[Ted Todorov]

New HomePod for AppleTV??

First, having this, with the camera, would have made sense in the beginning of the COVID/Zoom era. not the end of it. And secondly if we need to get original HomePods from eBay to add to this new gem for truly great sounding 5.0/Dolby Atmos home theater sound, well -- better late than never, like the AirPort Express which Apple updated to AirPlay 2 *after* it had completely disappeared from the market? And is the *only* AirPlay 2 device with TOSlink output so it can make ANY receiver released in DECADES AirPlay 2 compatible???

Please Apple, please, don't make us depend on eBay, bring back the AirPort Express identical to the previous one, just with up to date WiFi support and the original HomePod with a new Axx SoC processor for faster Siri support but otherwise a sound as good as the original.

 

[DaveF]

I don't understand the AppleTV + camera rumors. People with smart speakers have them in random corners or behind a plant or something. They're definitely not dead center in front of the TV.

 

[Ted Todorov]

A typical sound bar is dead center underneath the TV. The new rumored HomePod with a camera seems to be Apple’s version of a sound bar.

 

[DaveF]

An Apple sound bar is a great idea over due. Couple it with a pair of wireless speakers for rear speakers and it could be a killer surround system.

 

[Ted Todorov]

Finally: https://www.macrumors.com/how-to/use-stereo-paired-homepods-with-mac/
macOS 11.3 adds true HomePod stereo for Mac sound. How it took them so long is beyond me -- haven't tried it to see if video/sound will be in sync, but better late than never

 

[Nelson Au]

That reminds me, I forgot I can do that now my ancient Mac Pro. I’ve been using my iPhone to AirPlay to the HomePods. That’s nice as I can control the volume by my Apple Watch. But I can do AirPlay on my Mac Pro (mid 2012) that’s on High Sierra. But I cannot control the volume or skip tracks on my Apple Watch this way.

Of course AirPlay from the Mac Pro is just for iTunes music, not the Mac sounds.

 

[Clinton McClure]

Today I put a HomePod Mini in the kitchen and another in the master bathroom. They were real easy to setup and look nice. They can play loud enough without distortion, however, the sound tends to border on the muddy, almost like there’s a towel over them. Other than that, all I wanted was a couple of networked speakers I could airplay to and that’s exactly what I got.

 

[Nelson Au]

Congrats Clint. Do you have a full size HomePod to compare the sound quality to?

Enjoy the HomePods!

 

[Clinton McClure]

Thanks Nelson. I never bought a full sized HomePod and haven’t heard one in person.

 

[Ted Todorov]

Thanks Nelson. I never bought a full sized HomePod and haven’t heard one in person.

I’m sure with a full sized HomePode (and more than twice with a stereo pair) you will find spectacularly good sound even at full volume. If quality is important to you, get them before they disappear.