Anyone own a Lexus? (1 Viewer)

[Michael Mathius]

Between my wife and I we have owned 8 toyotas. One camary, 4 celicas, 2 4runners and 1 lexus gs. Even if the vehicles are made under the same roof in Japan the are vastly different because they are made for two different markets. You really won't notice the differences by just spend 15 minutes test driving them or looking at them at a dealership.
We have stayed with toyota because of their reliability. We put a lot of miles on our vehicles so I can tell you in no uncertain terms about toyota quality. Our current GS bought in July 01 as 19000 miles and the 4runner bought in March 01 has 33000 miles. The most miles we've had was 120,000 on a celica. Not once did we have any type of breakdown on these vehicles.
Do I love my toyotas? You bet!! Do I love my lexus? Hell yes!!!.. But most of all owning these vehicles allow me to spend more money on my hometheater addiction . instead of on automotive repair bills.
Checkout edmunds.com townhall and club lexus.com to get some more info.

 

[Mike Voigt]

Interesting thread. Now that the second car is paid off, I am looking at cars again... sigh. Of course, my wife has her sights on a Stingray.

Re the Lexus vs Toyota debate, though, even on a test-drive the two were readily different. Camry V6 LE was nice, very nice, if totally overpriced at $25K in '97, which the dealer wouldn't budge off of (despite agreeing during verbals, they tried putting it back into the contract by extending the time; we walked away).

Lexus ES300 was a dream machine. Much better ride, much more quiet, nicer interior. Same (basic) platform, perhaps; they are different cars.

Lastly, if you're in the 40K market, also look at the 540 Series from BMW. Very nice cars.

Mike

 

[Andy_B]

Lastly, if you're in the 40K market, also look at the 540 Series from BMW. Very nice cars.

It is not out of my price range, but it is certainly out of my wives price range. Of course it did not help when I suggested I trade her in
Andy

 

[Andy_B]

Between my wife and I we have owned 8 toyotas. One camary, 4 celicas, 2 4runners and 1 lexus gs.

Now that is brand loyalty!

Thanx for all the useful information Michael

Andy

 

[Carl Miller]

Andy,

I'm late on this one, but after the lease ended on our Lexus RX300, my wife and I had to go car shopping in February.

We loved the car, but saw the Toyota Highlander as a potentially less expensive alternative with a new mortgage to contend with. Similar to the ES300 vs Camry debate, the RX300 and Highlander are said to be "basically the same", so for $6000 less we did give the Highlander a serious look and a couple of test drives.

They're not the same, and in fact going from an RX300 to a Highlander makes the differences immediately obvious in a test drive. For me, doing a total 90 mile commute to and from work everyday made it an easy choice. We went with the RX300 because it was better suited for us, though this time we bought it rather than leasing.

Our first RX300 leased gave us 39 months of trouble free driving. The car went in for scheduled maintenance and never had a single problem. The dealership is fantastic, service outstanding and in my opinion, many companies could learn a thing or two from Lexus in how to treat people and stand behind their products. I never thought I'd ever dole out a compliment like that to a car company after previous negative experiences with Ford and Chrylser, but they've earned it.

 

[Andy_B]

Carl,

That was a very close analogy to many of the items being discussed in this thread. Thank you for sharing your experiences.

The dealership is fantastic, service outstanding and in my opinion, many companies could learn a thing or two from Lexus in how to treat people and stand behind their products. I never thought I'd ever dole out a compliment like that to a car company after previous negative experiences with Ford and Chrylser, but they've earned it.

The thing that has caught my eye the most in this very early stage of my evaluation and research is just how many people have complimented Lexus on how well they treat their customers.

Having never experienced a good nor a bad experience while buying a car, this will be interesting to monitor for me if I decide to move forward and test drive a Lexus.

Andy

 

[Philip Hamm]

The thing that has caught my eye the most in this very early stage of my evaluation and research is just how many people have complimented Lexus on how well they treat their customers.

IMO this is highly overrated. Who cares if they treat you like gold if the price isn't good? Is it worth the extra money to get treated well? Not my money. Make sure you read the tutorial at Edmunds.com about how to buy a car and buy with a lot of knowledge on your side. That's a better strategy than deciding based on how well the people at the dealership treat you. I have never had a negative car buying experience when armed with information.

And do check out the Audi A4 3.0 if you have time IMO it's a much better car than the Lexus.

 

[Derek Williams]

I look at customer service as a reflection on the dealerships value of my time. A simple example of this is my 99 VW had a check engine light warning on a weekend. I took it to the VW dealership and they told me to bring the car back Monday morning, which was two days later, and not to drive the car until then. My IS300 had a slight tear in the tire sidewall; I was on the way to the beach so I stopped by to make an appointment for later that week to have the tire replaced. When I arrived the service depart was closing up for the weekend. The service writer told me they could replace the tires the Monday morning, gave me an ES300 for the weekend with unlimited miles. Plus I did not need to worry about filling up the gas tank when I returned the car. If I figure in my normal hourly wage to drive back to the dealer ship-to work-back to pick up the car, the miles I would of put on my IS300 that week end, and the gas to fill the tank up it easily make up the price between getting a Toyota vs. a Lexus.

 

[Justin Doring]

Andy,

I never attributed the “glorified Toyota” quote to you. I was simply responding to it. Please note how I began with “Andy” in the subsequent paragraph, as that should have been a signpost that I was now addressing you. It’s painfully apparent, however, that you failed to properly interpret this.

Regarding your blatant antagonism, recall your statement that reads that, “The base price of the high end Camry is $26,000. / The base price of the Lexus ES300 is $32,000.” This quote is most certainly antagonistic, as it flouts my “$10,000-$15,000” quote. No further words were necessary, as you made your point quite clear.

You also began one of your posts with: “ok, I want to talk about this issue of the ES300 being identical to the Camry.” This is also flagrantly argumentative, and if you don’t see it as such, you may wish to hone your interpretive skills.

Further condemnation of my opinions and me comes from you with comments like, “Safe to say your opinions have been rendered useless by such an incredibly rude and ignorant comment. Congrats, you are the first person to try and ruin a very informative thread to date...” You don't see this as antagonistic?

Other posts are also directly addressed at me: "Thanx [sic] Mike, while this mirrors nearly every professional review I have read, it is nice to see so many non-profesional [sic] reviewers have the exact same opinion.” Once again, you are obviously seeking affirmation, and you are angered that I will not placate you. In retaliation, you release a salvo of belligerent comments at me.

It is obvious that nothing will convince you that the Camry and the ES300 are nearly identical. Regarding your “profesional [sic] reviewers” comment, you should peruse reputable auto journals like Road & Track, Car and Driver, etc., as they always write things similar to, “the ES300 is an upscale Camry.” Also, in Japan, Lexus, Infiniti, and Acura do not exist, as the Japanese do not need their egos inflated by having “Lexus” instead of “Toyota” on their cars.

 

[Andy_B]

And do check out the Audi A4 3.0 if you have time IMO it's a much better car than the Lexus.

Thanx! With the BMW kind of off my list as I am not sure I would be able to appreciate the items it has to offer, I am now going to start researching the Audi and the Passat that has also been mentioned in this thread.

I saw some Passat's on the road this weekend and I liked the look of them. I did not know too much about them until some people brougth them up in this thread. I always heard that Audi made a nice automobile, but they are not very common that you see them all too much (which can be a good thing in a way).

Anyway, thanx again, I am sure I will be back for more opinions later.

Andy

 

[Carl Miller]

IMO this is highly overrated. Who cares if they treat you like gold if the price isn't good? Is it worth the extra money to get treated well? Not my money. Make sure you read the tutorial at Edmunds.com about how to buy a car and buy with a lot of knowledge on your side. That's a better strategy than deciding based on how well the people at the dealership treat you. I have never had a negative car buying experience when armed with information.

For whatever it's worth, my intention of mentioning dealer service was to relate it to the after-buying experience. Most car dealerships treat you well when you're buying, many treat you poorly once you've bought.

I've only owned 3 cars in my life, a Ford, a Chrysler and a Lexus. The service at Ford was ok. The service at Chrysler absolutely atrocious and Lexus has been wonderful.

It matters when/if things go wrong. When my Chrysler transmission blew out 7 months and 4,000 miles after warranty, Chrysler had the gall to tell me that "electronic transmission weren't built to last 70,000 miles". When I took my complaint to Customer Care, they actually agreed with me, and took the opportunity not to ease the pain of a $2,000 tranny bill, but to tell me I should have bought the extended warranty. All I was looking for at the time was a discount on the bill considering the car wasn't even 4 years old and had only 40,000 miles on it..Not an unreasonable request on my part.

You're totally correct that arming yourself with the right information is the smart way to go car shopping. But a dealership with good service, and eager to earn return business can save you lots of time, aggravation and money down the line.

 

[Matt Pasant]

I just took the Lexus plunge yesterday myself, I bought a 2002 GS 300, and even though I am only 24 hours in the car, I love it already.

This is my first "car" car. I have had three GM trucks, so this car is like nirvana thus far.

 

[DaveF]

Pardon my ignorance, but how does the Nissam Maxima compare to the cars being discussed? I've never owned a "luxury" car, but I had the opportunity to drive a Maxima for a week (rental), and loved it. I'm not in the market for a new car, but am curious how it compares to the Lexus, and such.

 

[Michael Mathius]

Matt;
Sweeeeeet car. Enjoy the ride.

 

[Scott Merryfield]

Pardon my ignorance, but how does the Nissam Maxima compare to the cars being discussed? I've never owned a "luxury" car, but I had the opportunity to drive a Maxima for a week (rental), and loved it.

The Maxima has always been a very fine car, and is sort of on the border between the main and luxury models (Infiniti is Nissan's luxury line). However, I test drove a 2002 Maxima vs. a 2002 Altima, and preferred the Altima. The redesigned Altima is almost the same size as the Maxima, has slightly less horsepower (240 vs. 255), but is quicker and handles better. I was able to purchase the Altima for $23k, while a Maxima would have started at around $26-27K. For this model year, I think the Altima is a better value (although the Maxima has a plusher interior, if that is important to you). However, the Maxima is due for a redesign next year, and it will be upsized so that it no longer competes with the Altima. I would expect the cost to rise, also.

 

[LarryDavenport]

In my wildest dreams I could never afford a Lexus (though my wildest dreams (car-wise) actually involve either a BMX Z8 or a Aston Martin Vanquish).

But I did go on a test drive of a 2002 IS300 with a friend and I thought it was an incredibly smooth ride and it was excellent climbing a steep windy hill. Though I like the looks of the BMW 3 series better, I think the Lexus is an excellent car.

BTW, my friend wound up buying a Jetta.

 

[DaveF]

Scott - Thanks I'll probably be car shopping in a year or two, and ever since my brief experience, the Maxima has been in the back of my mind.

 

[Justin Doring]

I'd take a Maxima over an ES300 any day! The Maxima and the Altima are similar cars, but, comparably equipped, they are about the same price, and you get a lot more for your money with the Maxima, as it is much nicer, quieter, and is built to higher quality standards (slam the doors on both and you'll notice the difference right away). A loaded Altima SE and Maxima SE are about $30,000 each, which is the same price as the more luxurious Infiniti I35 (the Infiniti version of the Maxima), so you might prefer that. That said, all three cars are front wheel drive, and you can get the rear wheel drive Infiniti G35 with leather and the sport package for $30,000 as well. All four above mentioned cars have the same engine, but the G35 handles much better. If I wanted a mid-size sedan around $30,000, I would get the Infiniti G35 without hesitation.

 

[Scott Merryfield]

Justin,

You can get a well-equipped Altima for about $25k. I purchased my 3.5SE for $23k without leather or premium sound, but with the power moonroof. Standard equipment is quite extensive on the 3.5SE. The other two options would have added less than $2k.

 

[Steve Schaffer]

Somebody earlier compared the base price of the V6 Camry LE to the ES300 and came up with a 10k difference. The LE is not the top line Camry, but actually the base model this year.

The XLE is the more comparable model, and without nav or leather runs about 27k. With nav, leather, stability control, etc. an XLE Camry lists for 32k.

The ES300 has variable valve timing, the Camry doesn't. This makes for about a 20hp advantage in favor of the Lexus.

There is a new Camry model this year, the SE, which comes with a sportier suspension, brushed chrome in place of fake wood, and a number of other sports sedan goodies. If you want something a bit sportier and better handling than the ES300, for about 5k less comparably equipped, the SE may be the way to go.

I've worked in the service dept. of a largish Toyota dealership for 30 years.

The original Lexus ES, the 90-91 ES250, WAS a glorified Camry. In Japan, most 4 drs in that size class are available as either a conventional sedan with frames around the door windows, or as pillared hardtops, with frameless window glass. The ES250 was simply the hardtop version of the Camry.

For it's 92 replacement, and all versions since, the platform is designed to Lexus levels, and the Camry is a "downgrade".

I wouldn't own a German make past the warranty period, especially a VW/Audi, based on our experience with trade ins.

BMW and Mercedes hold up very well, but maintenance is very expensive. VW/Audi aren't much better than Fiat, Renault, Peugeot, and any number of other European makes forced out of the US market by superior Japanese reliability.

Our used car buyers are forbidden to buy 'em at auction due to reconditioning costs being so high and the frequency with which buyers come back with problems--same as Ford Contours, Taurus, and Windstars.

If ya gotta have awd in a passenger car, buy a high end Subaru, not an Audi.

Every Maxima I've driven has struck me as being quite Germanic in character--rock solid "carved from one big block of steel" body stiffness, austere but very functional interior, excellent handling and braking. My ex owns a 94 Altima, which has the same "junior BMW" feel, without the outrageous maintenance and repair costs of the German makes. Nissan/Infiniti have always been more of a "driver's car" than Toyota/Lexus, with comparable reliability.

The current Maxima/Infiniti i35 is in it's last year, the new Altima is actually larger and roomier.

The Infiniti G35 is actually our version of the legendary Nissan Skyline, and well worth consideration.