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Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by Dean DeMass, Nov 12, 2001.
Darren, all I've heard is that it was delayed for 'technical difficulties'. Also the Flight Data Recorder has now apparently been found, it was the Cockpit Voice Recorder that was recovered yesterday.
While browsing Yahoo's news links I decided to check out a link for Airbus Industrie. Would you believe they didn't have a single press release on the incident? Seems like Boeing had one out pretty quickly following the 9-11 happenings. And when McDonnell-Douglas was on their own, they never seemed to waste time issuing one.
Perhaps Airbus doesn't have enough data to crunch into info yet, but it seems strange.
"What did Mr Spock see when he looked in the toilet? The Captain's Log."
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My warmest regards to the families, friends and victims on flight 587. But, I strongly feel it was sabotage and/or meant to go down in Rockaway. Did anyone watch the police and fireman charity gimick on TV a while back. This one fire fighter said on National TV that He was from Rockaway and Osama Bin Laden can come find me and kiss my ass.
Coincidental that a plane just happens to go down in the same area he stated he was from. Oh come on! How many times do two engines just happen to fall off of a plane in flight. If one engine fell off and the plane went down because the pilot couldn't handle the plane that is one thing.
Here we are, just moments away from Thanksgiving. The biggest travel time in America. On a clear November day, and a holiday to observe one the very same day... A plane just goes down because the engines fell off. I think it is way to coincidental to be an accident.
There was a guy on the news who stated that it is very rare that an engine would fall off of a plane. I think he said it has happened 3 times in aviation history. For it to happen twice on the same plane at approximately the same moment. That is no accident. My feelings may be harsh... But I feel, that plane was meant to go down where it did.
If terrorists cant get on planes, they have to take them out some other way. And as the saying goes: "When there is a will, there is a way".
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You nailed that one, John. There is something wrong here. They fished the tail out of the bay near the airport, and a wing in another part of the bay. I'm assuming the south side, but can't get any details.
I saw the photes of both engines. If a wing landed in the water, how did the engine make it all the way to shore? (Can't accept the propulsion crap because without a wing, and with the weight of the engines, they would go straight down).
The gas station was on 133rd, but they never mentioned where the other wing landed or where the engine was that landed on the boat. Then they find one of the boxes on someone's front lawn - the next day! Can't buy it.
Sorry, but I can see someone planting it at 2 am or so. If I had debris on my front lawn, I'd make sure that someone saw it, and it wouldn't take long before someone that knew exactly what to look for would pick it up.
Come on fellas. There is no way to sabotage a plane so that it will crash into a specific target. Rockaway was not a target. And don't you think Osama is a little busy to care about what a firefighter said?
I have no idea what altitude that plane was at when the malfunction occured, but if it was high enough then the shearing off of the engines and wings is easily attributed to excess speed. If the loss of an engine produced a severe roll, then this could also have been a factor in parts of the plane coming apart.
It is possible (thought highly doubful) that the plane was sabotaged, but its final resting place was not a result of an act of retribution. TF
www.landings.com has some good information.
issues with the history of the engines
~2800ft was what I read was the altitude at when the first engine blew and fell. No way was Rockaway purposefully targetted. The voice recorders didn't record anything unusual for the first 1 min 47 seconds and after that it was just the first officer frantically trying to regain control. No way could somebody hijack the plane, not make any noise, and crash the plane in that little time.
Plus, does Osama get cable in the stinkin cesspool he's hiding under?
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I don't think that Rockaway was a target, but the more I read and hear, the more conflicting the news is. I heard/read that the turbulence from the other plane was both at 2 min 20 sec and 1 min 30 sec before this flight.
And now one of the recorders is going back to the factory. I think that was one that was not found on the lawn, and that is a lot of damage considering the ones from WTC were picked up intact.
Sorry, but this was a bit much for an accident. An official yesterday (from the FAA, I think), said that any one failure could not affect another failure in another part of the plane. They are built that way, and I have to agree.
I think what will happen is that this whole mess is going to 'go away'. Sorry again.
quote: Osama bin Laden is the dumbest man on the planet![/quote]We must be dumber still, as his cronies have nailed us FAR too many times. Underestimating his power has been our gravest error, IMO.
Here's what I've heard lately:
-There is no foreign object damage in either of the engines. In fact, there is no real damage indicative of any failure in flight- just that from falling.
-The tail section may have let go first, causing the engines to break off in the ensuing violent pitch of the aircraft.
-The plane began takeoff 2:20 behind the 747, but may have closed the gap to 1:30 at the time of the crash.
-Rattling heard on the voice recorder before any indication of trouble.
To me, this pretty much explains what they've found so far (engine (lack of) damage, largely intact tail in the bay, etc.) The question remains, though, why did the tail fall off? I don't buy the "wake turbulence" thing. Planes fly that close daily (I think the gap is 2:00).
It seems to me the structural elements of the tail section hold the story. One should be able to look at the metal and determine if it broke off, got knocked off, or simply fell off. What is the history of this plane, and was there a previous incident that caused weakening?
As a long-time troubleshooter, this is the sort of "mystery" that I find very intriguing. The pieces are all there- they just need to be put together. I mean no disrespect for those that lost their lives by that, though.
P.S. I'm not ready to consider the conspiracy theories just yet.
[Edited last by Todd Hochard on November 14, 2001 at 05:13 PM]