am a new svs sub owner (1 Viewer)

[Wayne Ernst]

Tours of SVS !!!!

I can see it now ... little Johnny goes on a school field trip to the SVS factory. When Johnny gets home, he runs to daddy and says: "Daddy, we went on an awesome field trip today." Where did you go, son?" "Well, we toured SVS." "What, son?" "Yes, dad, we did." "Son, if you're lying to me, you'll be grounded for two weeks." "Dad, no, you need to understand - I actually toured their factory." "I still don't believe you." "Well, dad, I have a sample of one if their cabinet finishes in my pocket to show you and a little incentive for the next purchase from SVS." "Son, give me that coupon right now ... and, this is so great. I've been trying to find an angle so I can purchase a new subwoofer and you know how your mother likes coupons. Man, this will be great, because this time, she'll say yes to me because of the extra savings!"

 

[Alex_P]

Jason, I might disappointed you as well cuz' I don't seem to care on what you say... perhaps you can read the last phrase of that post again...There's no need to be sorry cuz' your comment is irrelevant... who are you to judge me regarding my attitude??? Was I directly talking to you? Get a hint...

 

[Craig Chase]

Alex - You DID say that for 1/2 the cost, you can build a subwoofer that can kill an SVS. Since science considers a 3 dB increase to be a very modest increase in SPL, Let's pick an SVS subwoofer and see what you can do... PLUS, let us remember SPL's are part of the story, we would also have to do blind testing.

For example (and I have put some thought into it), for 1/2 the price of a PB2+, can you build a finished product that can put out peaks of 118 dB at two meters with a 16 Hz signal. I am using the PB2+ because it is the subwoofer I have done the most testing with. And it can handle 115 plus dB peaks under the same conditions.

The exterior finish does not have to be fancy, but it does have to be finished.

Are you game ?

 

[Jason Brent]

Alex,

I'll tell you who I am to judge your attitude......a fellow forum member who disliked your tone in our community. No you weren't talking directly to me, but this is a public place. Every thing you type is open to response from anyone. Seems you are getting a little over defensive of your actions...maybe you realize that your post was illconceived, but are having a hard time appologizing???

I will appologize, however, for saying anything at all. Usually, I just read posts like yours, and then pretty much roll my eyes, and move on. For some reason, I'll felt the need to express my view, as have others on your initial conduct.

Take care

BTW....since your Tempest 'blows' the SVS away, could you please post #'s on it? How about pics? If it truly is that wonderful, and you could back it up, perhaps you could restore a little respect from some of the community members here who don't believe your statements of 'blowing away.' Proof's in the puddin, as they say.....

 

[Alex_P]

Craig,
I was talking about the 20-39 (hence Ronniel ordered that model) since I have heard it and what it can do. In the respond to peak output of 118db at 16hz, it's very impressive number there. Given the time, selection of drivers and good enclosure design... it can be done... Enough said... don't wanna keep carry on and on...

Jason,
Who the hell are you that I have to gain respect from???

So now you are one of them? The SVS fan club, stick to them so you won't be bashed? Regarding to the freq#, what are some of your numbers??? I'll just pick them out from Tom Nousaine table. The 20-39CS w/ 300W amp is only produce 90.1db at 20hz and 106db at 25hz. That's big jump there, not very flat. I didn't read much detail on what kind of tone he used and what type of equipments he used to measure those numbers... Well, I only have a Tempest of a small closed enclosure (preferrably for music) and it puts out 98db at 20hz and 107db at 25hz... Imagine when I build a bigger ported enclosure... Anyway, enough w/ numbers... I'd heard the 20-39 and the owner of it had heard my Tempest and he is impressed... I don't need ppl to respect me. I just say what's on my mind. It might offended lots of SVS fan club members. But hey, that's my opinion...

Regards,
Alex

 

[Felix_F]

Seeing how you uploaded the comment quoted above, saying that you have never heard a SVS sub, some three minutes before you declared the opposite in this thread, can you briefly explain which of the two statements is actually true?

 

[Craig Chase]

Alex, There is no way a Tempest in a sealed enclosure hits 98 dB at 20 Hz at two meters. Of course you do not want to carry on and on, you would rather insult people, make inane remarks, and resort to profanity.

Ed was able to hit 94.6 dB at two meters with a pb1-isd, and the cylinder will be a couple dB higher. Larger enclosure with more porting area. It is $599 for the 20-39 PCi ... The tempest and amp alone are $320 ... plus shipping, plus enclosure and mounting materials.

As I said, Send me your subwoofer, and I will test it. I will go a step further, if it does 98 dB at 20 Hz/two meters ... I will buy it from you for $600. Of course, If the driver blows before it hits there, you may have a warranty issue.

 

[Robb Roy]

Alex,

There is no “SVS Fan Club”. If there was, I’d join -– they’re a great company providing an excellent product, at a great price, with outstanding customer service. You have even noted they provide good bang for the buck (though whether this is from anecdotal evidence or experience, as Felix noted, is an unknown).

You have also noted there are people here who know more than you do. I would suggest you learn from them, not insult them.

Anyone who has been in this hobby knows if you commit the necessary time and money a DIY sub can compete with, if not best, any retail subwoofer (SVS included). There has been some excellent discussion about the effort and costs of DIY in this thread, and you’ve been invited to provide your input into that. You didn’t. Craig called for the actual costs of building a DIY sub and you responded with: “The fact is that it actually cost half of the price to build one...I'm just stating my opinion.”. DIY is, in fact (e.g., Wayne who was willing to put in the effort and enjoys it) the way to go for certain people, but is the cost “fact” or “opinion”?

You also used Nousaine’s numbers for a comparison while admitting (I applaud that much) you didn’t really read his data. Odds are your room is not as large (7,000 + cubit feet) and your gear is nowhere near as accurate (as Craig pointed out, your SPL claims are, well, unlikely). I feel compelled to mention he tested a first generation driver from SVS that has been improved upon since then. Nousaine’s methods, data, and the surrounding discussion is another opportunity for you to learn from people more knowledgeable than yourself -– I would suggest you take advantage of it.

Perhaps you just wanted to ask if Neil had considered the DIY route. If he had, why he hadn’t chosen it, and if he hadn’t, you were willing to share your knowledge. That may have been the case, but it really looks like you picked a fight and then cried foul because some “SVS brothas” asked you to back up your statements. You actually appear to be making the blind, uneducated, outrageous statements so many SVS owners are accused (and often guilty) of.

-Robb

 

[Jason Brent]

Check out my posts, I can hardly be classified in the category of the "SVS rules over everything else" clan. Now I've been a member here for, oh coming up on a year and a half. I just today placed an order for an SVS. Have never heard, or even seen one before. But I would like to try one.....nothing wrong with that.

I was not defending SVS with my dissent for your comments. You simply made a rude, crass remark that had no beneficial meaning to the original posters comments. That's all I'm saying.

 

[Craig Chase]

Robb... You were really nice and eloquent there. I almost feel bad for my challenge to Alex. Hang on a second... ok... PHEW ! ...There, I am over it....

 

[Alex_P]

Craig,

I found it amusing when you posted your freq# 118db at 16hz I didn't seemed to question it...but when I said my tempest hits 98db at 20hz seemed like not possible??? What is there to debate about? You won't accept anything I said...so the discussion stops here... I've read your review you seemed like a very knowledgable person, unfortunately, you see things only 1 direction...

Alex,

Supposedly, SVS can't be touched

 

[Alex_P]

Robb,

First of all, you don't know me... You don't know my background...You might think my statements are outrageous, uneducated and so on. It might seem that way to you... Maybe you're uneducated and outrageous yourself that can't see things further than it is... And what am I accuse SVS owners of?

Seemed like you all are hurting due to my statements. It's ok dude...cry it off...

Alex,

 

[Alex_P]

Craig, I'm sure you are not over it yet But then again, you will disagree

Supposedly, SVS can't be touched hahaha

 

[Bhavesh]

Ronneil, hope the SVS meets all your expectations.

Certainly if I lived in the US, I'd buy SVS in a heartbeat. Unfortunately shipping and customs duties have put it out of my league for now [A 25-31PCi would have cost approx $900 in total].

DIY proved a very affordable alternative for me (see my sig). For $300 I'd gladly put it up against anything I could buy locally for 3 times the price. The driver is a clone of the Adire Shiva which has been compared favourably to the original SVS driver by others. Maybe Ron could tell me how much performance I am losing out to the 25-31CS.

Anyway its great for everyone that SVS and HSU provide an alternative to the DIY and megabuck Branded sub route.

I don't think its been mentioned, but the Tempest is 15''.

 

[Craig Chase]

Alex, IF you read my entire review, I list all the methods of testing used. My final test, ALA Noussaine, was done using LinearX calibrated TrueRTA software, a Behringer ECM-8000 Microphone, the subwoofers were corner loaded, measurements taken at 2 meters, 10% Max THD.

You say the Tempest measures 98 dB at 20 Hz, while Noussaine says a sealed Tumult measures 93 dB at 20 Hz. Congratulations, with about 35 % of the linear "throw" of the Tumult, you have managed 5 dB more output.

By the way, I also own a Denali, with the Tumult and twin mass loaded 18 inch passive radiators... it is tuned at 18.5 Hz by Kyle. It weighs 220 pounds, and will hit 113 dB at 20 Hz, using the Noussaine method.

 

[Allen Marshall]

Alex, ridiculous.

 

[Edward J M]

Guys, in the interest of debunking myths and advancing forum knowledge, let's get one thing perfectly clear:

THD results cannot be compared or extrapolated between testers and testing environments. Different room acoustics (i.e., varying boundary reinforcement and room gain resulting in a different FR and absolute SPL levels at the THD test location), different mics and preamp/hardware, different sound cards and software, and varying mic placement TOTALLY preclude any valid comparisons.

Sub builders and testers with a great deal of experience and savvy have tried to duplicate test results from Nousaine, Keele, et al, and failed - often not even close.

Nousaine's data is valid for products tested in his room, with his gear, under his repeatable conditions - period. Anyone who tries to extrapolate data between testers, rooms, and test methods is walking on very thin ice in the credibility department.

The only way to determine if Subwoofer A can outperform Subwoofer B in FR and THD-limited output is to test them under identical conditions. Anything else is worthless and unworthy of further discussion.

Furthermore, if anyone is going to say "my sub can hit X dB @ Y Hz" they should be prepared to validate that statement with a detailed description of the test methods, all test rig gear used, the test rig calibration methods against known standards, and the method used to measure and calculate the THD at that SPL, frequency, and mic distance. Furthermore, the data must be repeatable under the scrutiny of an independent third party. If the tester isn't willing to buck up under these minimum standards and test protocols, then he has no business making the claim.

Let's get this thread back on track guys.

 

[Craig Chase]

OK, Dad... we will...

Ed - You are right... Ronneil... Congratulations on your new sub, make sure to set it up properly, and enjoy !

 

[Jack Gilvey]

It's just you.
Seriously, it used to be the case that one could acheive a certain performance level by DIY-ing a sub that couldn't be touched commercially unless one spent much, much more. As an avid and "somewhat" knowledgable DIY-er, I can say that this is absolutely not the case anymore. I wouldn't try to match the performance of any of the SVS models for the same price.

Craig, I'm seriously tempted to send you one of my subs, as humbling as that might prove to be.

 

[Craig Chase]

Jack - Checking out one of your subs would be a treat. I promise to be as gentle as with any other sub...

I have real admiration for guys who DO build their own stuff... look at Kyle's site, and there is some beautiful work there. I can assure you I have no where near the talent needed to build one myself.

Heck - I would settle for Ed's ability to take all the technical jargon and simplifying it to real English the way he does.

What will ALWAYS PI** me off is when anyone makes mean or rude statements to people about what they purchased... I have written to guys that bought their first system... even a BOSE system, and congratulated them... They were excited, and someday, if treated right by us hobbyists, he might join us in the pursuit of the "good stuff" ... or be driven away... depending on us.

nuff soapbox...