Alien Saga - Documentary

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by Simon Massey, Oct 13, 2001.

  1. Simon Massey

    Simon Massey Cinematographer
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    Did anyone see the new documentary on the Alien saga tonight on Channel 4 (UK), with Mark Kermode
    It was really well put together, similar to the ones he did on the Exorcist and the Shawshank Redemption. It was nice to see Sigourney Weaver commenting on each film as well, and the interviews look very recent(except James Cameron). They was also some frank discussion about the problems with Alien 3 - seems that Fincher should take a lot of credit for actually coming out with a coherent story judging by the comments made about the studio's interference. Charles Dance said that Fincher's cut was absolutely brilliant and then the studio just butchered it and made it "OK".
    I'd love to see this cut of the film in the future, given that I actually quite like Alien 3 anyway.
    These documentaries are really well done, and I hope Kermode does a few more in the future.
     
  2. Brad_W

    Brad_W Screenwriter

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    As much as I LOVE these movies, I can't help but feel a bit of contempt for how Alien Resurection decided not to give H.R. Giger any credit. He was pissed and his fans were pissed. Big Giger fans began calling the movie, "Alien Insurrection." Remember, Fox refused to give Giger his credit. I think that really sucks. For an artist that inspired such a fantastic movie legacy, you think that they would set up his credit. I am wondering if any of this or any real reference was made about H.R. Giger on this show?
    Thanks,
    -Brad
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  3. Alister Willis

    Alister Willis Auditioning

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    I managed to catch the last 40 minutes of the documentary, pretty much missing any discussion of Alien and Aliens...wish I'd known it was on.
    From what I did see, I thought it looked like an excellent documentary. Good mixture of interviews from cast members (and directors) from the 4 films.
    As Simon said, it was interesting to hear Charles Dance's comments about Finchers cut. Wonder if we'll ever see a director's cut of Alien ^3?
    Woody.
     
  4. Dan Brecher

    Dan Brecher Producer

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    As much as I find it hard to stomach Kermode as a presenter, I do commend the documentaries he has written and produced, the Alien documentary last night was decent.
    As for ever seeing Fincher's cut of Aliens 3, it's been much discussed on the HTF, fox have no plans, allegedly much of the deleted footage was destroyed and Fincher himself has said it was such a bad experience he's no wish to re-visit the movie... Shame.
    Dan (UK)
     
  5. Simon Massey

    Simon Massey Cinematographer
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    They interviewed Giger on this documentary as well, and he mentioned how the design of the alien had evolved over time from his original concept. He didn't comment on Alien Resurrection.
     
  6. Simon Massey

    Simon Massey Cinematographer
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    Brad
    Having watched the documentary again, Giger actually said that he felt that alien concept had developed from a beautiful thing in his original design to "a piece of turd".
    I don't know much about Giger's involvement in the fourth one, but it sounds to me like he didn't have much input. Having said that, he may simply have been referring to the newborn creature in the fourth film rather than the alien itself.
     
  7. Guy Martin

    Guy Martin Second Unit

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    Giger didn't design the aliens for Resurrection and was not involved at all. After he protested though they did restore his "original alien design by" credit for all the video versions. Stan Winston designed the aliens for Aliens and I've seen an interview with Giger where he said he didn't particularly mind what Winston did. On the other hand Giger does have a pretty legitimate beef regarding Alien 3. Apparently he did a bunch of pre-production work before Alec Gillis and Tom Woodruf (protege's of Winston) took over, but he still only got "orginal alien design by" credit and was quite miffed. Gillis and Woodruf also did the creature effects of Resurrection. Incidentally they were assisted on 3 by future Blade director Stephen Norrington for those into trivia.
    - Guy
     
  8. Brad_W

    Brad_W Screenwriter

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    This was taken directly from the official H.R. Giger website:
     
  9. SteveGon

    SteveGon Executive Producer

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    Maybe we can expect a dvd release of this? Hope so! [​IMG]
    ------------------
    He thought on homeland, the big timber, the air thin and chill all the year long. Tulip poplars so big through the trunk they put you in mind of locomotives set on end. He thought of getting home and building him a cabin on Cold Mountain so high that not a soul but the nighthawks passing across the clouds in autumn could hear his sad cry. Of living a life so quiet he would not need ears. And if Ada would go with him, there might be the hope, so far off in the distance he did not even really see it, that in time his despair might be honed off to a point so fine and thin that it would be nearly the same as vanishing.
    -- Charles Frazier, Cold Mountain
     
  10. Kevin H. Martin

    Kevin H. Martin Auditioning

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    I understand the point being made about giving credit where it is due (and it isn't like anybody has ever accused this guy of ripping his alien off from another artist's work), but it is pretty standard to screw people out of credit. Do you see any acknowledgement in STAR TREK II about Cary Wilbur, the guy who invented KHAN for the TV episode that introduced the character? Or Gene Coon, the guy who produced that episode and almost surely rewrote most of it?
    I think Writer's Guild rules have changed now, and the creators of a character do have to get credit and payment when it is reused, but for artists in other parts of the business may or may not have access to a union or guild to protect them. As a result, stuff goes uncredited.
    Sometimes it is a legal matter. Every James Bond movie has the credit 'james bond theme written by monty norman,' even though the guy didn't write the tune (he was credited with scoring the whole first film, but in fact the bond theme was a John Barry piece -- norman's name on that first film has guaranteed him a place on the rest, even though it ain't his music! If you can find Barry's pre-soundtrack music, there's a piece called Bea's Knees that IS the bond theme, instrumentally speaking)
    I always wondered if James Horner got any money for his BATTLE BEYOND THE STARS music getting reused in SPACE RAIDERS (or if the Skotak Bros got any money for their FX shots from BATTLE getting reused in the same movie). Then again, enough folks think Horner should be paying royalties for 'sampling' other composers, including himself (try listening to or watching Horner-scored films 48HRS, RED HEAT, COMMANDO and GORKY PARK -- the action/pursuit cues are exactly the same in each, with only slight changes in orchestration). I can't watch UNCOMMON VALOR without thinking that someone is stealing the Enterprise out of spacedock, for the same reason (more horner stuff).
    how's that for a massive digression?
    [email protected]
     
  11. Guy Martin

    Guy Martin Second Unit

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    Kevin-
     
  12. Guy Martin

    Guy Martin Second Unit

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