A Question for those who use more than One Sub

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by Richard Burzynski, Jan 24, 2002.

  1. Richard Burzynski

    Richard Burzynski Second Unit

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    In your HT, do you guys/gals place the subs:

    (1) Together (stacked or next to each other).

    (2) Different parts of the room.

    Just curious. Thanks.

    Rich B.
     
  2. Bhagi Katbamna

    Bhagi Katbamna Supporting Actor

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    I have a SVS 16-46 sitting on top of a Citation 7.4 in the front left corner of a 7000 cu. ft. room.
     
  3. Legairre

    Legairre Supporting Actor

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    Richard,

    I use two identical 12" 250 watt LFE subs in the front, in opposite corners. I tried stacking them, but it was horrible, so I seperated them and I was great. I know all the stuff about cancellations, but in my room opposite front corners just worked better. I also use two 10" 150 watt surround subs in the rear(one for each pair of surrounds) speaker level connected. These combined with my surrounds give me full range speakers in the rear.
     
  4. EarleD

    EarleD Supporting Actor

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    I have a pair of 20-39's in the front right corner of my HT sound pretty good.

    Earle
     
  5. gene avallon

    gene avallon Stunt Coordinator

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    I had two subs in different locals I thought was great.then after hearing they should be together I tried it,stacked them in the rear corner that I cleared for the two 46plus comming, and for these two junky subs it improved 100 percent.I guess it what boliles down to is what you like best.

    gene

    hey wayne im typing real good.thank you
     
  6. Wayne A. Pflughaupt

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    Allright Gene, be nice. [​IMG]
    Legairre,
     
  7. joe logston

    joe logston Stunt Coordinator

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    hi wayne i wonderd about your genesis eletroatic speakers , about 5 yrs. ago i went to the ces convention and gave the genesis a lesten and it was one of the best speakers i ever heard it is a lot better than the big reference martin logans & the apogees. do you like them tell me about them if you can. thank you, joe
     
  8. John A. Casler

    John A. Casler Second Unit

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    Hi Richard,

    I have a VMPS LARGER sub in the front right angle (not a corner exactly- odd shaped room) and a HSU VTF-2 in the left rear.

    I think the interesting thing is that I run them in opposite phase (or reversed phase).

    That way when the VMPS is pushing, the HSU is pulling. This seems to provide an incredible amount of air movement. In fact all the air in the room seems to move. It also seems to reduce the amount of "dead" spots (phase cancellation)

    I am surprised more people with two subs don't set up like this. I don't care what anyone says, in a single sub system, if the SUB is in a corner and crossed over above 60 I can localize it and find the bass energy coming from a specific place very distracting so I like two subs.
     
  9. Wayne A. Pflughaupt

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    Joe,

    My speakers are Genesis Physics – standard “cone and dome,” not electrostatic. The company is no longer in business. The current Genesis brand of speakers is a different company.

    Regards,

    Wayne A. Pflughaupt
     
  10. joe logston

    joe logston Stunt Coordinator

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    sorry i didnt know that; the genesis i lesten to where so good sounding that i couldnt believe my ears they where tall electrostatics, i didnt get the price of them but i thank they where real high thats probley what happin to the co. they over price them self. thank you for the information, joe ps. genesis physics is not the same co. the genesis had a dynamic sub driver though.
     
  11. BruceD

    BruceD Screenwriter

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    John,

    your quote:

    ----------------------------------------------------------

    I am surprised more people with two subs don't set up like this. I don't care what anyone says, in a single sub system, if the SUB is in a corner and crossed over above 60 I can localize it and find the bass energy coming from a specific place very distracting so I like two subs.

    -----------------------------------------------------------

    What you are really hearing is the higher harmonics of the original fundamental bass frequency, the room's modal reinforcements of the harmonics, and items in the room actually resonating.

    You are not able to actually localize the bass notes themselves at 80Hz and below.

    Reducing a room's modal anomolies and resonating items will greatly cleanup your bass response.

    The easiest and quickest way is with a single location for sub(s) and a Parametric EQ. This is easily proved with a frequency response graph and your ears.
     
  12. ling_w

    ling_w Second Unit

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  13. EarlR

    EarlR Stunt Coordinator

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    I use a pair of Aerial SW12 subs paired with my Aerial 10T front main speakers and Velodyne HGS12 for rear surround with Aerial Model 6’s. The SW12’s are crossed over at 40 Hz and the HGS12 is crossed over at 53 Hz. I have a Theta Casablanca II, which allows great flexibility in bass management. The Casablanca allows me to set up the subs as stereo pairs but still routes all the .1 low frequency channel to all subs at the same time. This ability makes setting up the subs correctly in the room much easier to accomplish than with most Processors.

    Earl
     
  14. Julian Data

    Julian Data Second Unit

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    I have my subs in one corner.
     
  15. Lewis Besze

    Lewis Besze Producer

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    I have mines also in two opposite corners in the room,also wired out of phase with each other.Both are EQ'd.One is a Sonotube[2 Shivas 12^ft it over 7 feet tall[​IMG]]the other one is a Blueprint 15" with 2 15" Adire PR's,in a conventional box[5.7^ft].
     
  16. Wayne A. Pflughaupt

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    Lewis,

    I was going to say “Wire them in phase and you’ll get much more output,” but with that rig you probably have more output than you can handle as it is!

    Regards,

    Wayne A. Pflughaupt
     
  17. John A. Casler

    John A. Casler Second Unit

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    You wrote:

    ==========================================

    I was going to say “Wire them in phase and you’ll get much more output,” but with that rig you probably have more output than you can handle as it is!

    ===========================================

    Wayne,

    Why would the "in phase" in a front corner to back corner set up offer more output?

    Wouldn't they basically fight or cancel each other in the center of the room, which is where most of us sit?

    It would seem that if the front woof is "pushing" and the (out of phase) rear is "pulling" that the greatest amount of air movement would take place in the rooms center.

    I came up with this idea back in 1972 when playing with my Dahlquist stereo subs. It seemed to work like a champ and I have used it ever since.

    If they are both pushing toward each other "in phase" it would seem like they would be fighting one another.

    I could be wrong, but the "out of phase" push pull would be like being inside a "push-pull" woofer (M&K, Pinnacle,and others) between the two speakers.

    If we performed an experiment and place a woofer right in front of us and a woofer right behind us and tried them both in and out of phase which would offer the best air movement?

    Not being an acoustic engineer I don't know but it seems the "out of phase" would.

    What do ya think?

    Regards,

    John A. Casler
     
  18. Lewis Besze

    Lewis Besze Producer

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  19. Wayne A. Pflughaupt

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    I spend 4 hours tonight helping another Forum member EQ his sub; I’ll have to respond to this tomorrow. Hope that’s okay.

    Regards,

    Wayne A. Pflughaupt
     
  20. Ben Salvemini

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    Hi All

    I have just purchased a velodyne sub fsr 1500 to go with my f1500

    I read a post from a gentleman about in phase out of phase use and positioning one in the front and one in the rear.

    My room will be 5.3meters wide by 8meters long.

    Would it be better to place one at the front in the corner and the other at the rear in the opposite corner one in phase and the other out?

    Or one in the front near the centre channel and the other directly opposite at the rear out of phase.

    When I used one I would get pockets of little bass and others overkill. So I read using two would smooth out the bass.

    My new room 5.3 x 8 has not been built yet but plans are being drawn up.

    Since I can start from scatch with new room construction what do you guys think???
     

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