A PEEK AT HEAVEN AND EARTH (1 Viewer)

[Persianimmortal]

It needs to be noted that the visibility of aliasing can be exacerbated or reduced depending on the model of TV and the settings. Most TVs process the image with some (often mild) amount of anti-aliasing depending on which picture mode is being used. More importantly, higher levels of the Sharpness setting (which should ideally be set at 0%) will make aliasing more visible. Motion processing on LCD/LEDs may also reduce the temporal shimmering effect and hence the visibility of aliasing in motion. So let's keep these factors in mind when discussing what people do or don't see.

I will agree however that regardless of what's being seen, certain people on certain forums have an anti-Twilight Time agenda due purely to TT's business model, and will actively make a mountain out of any mole hill just to further that agenda. I feel for TT having to deal with these people, many of whom are probably never going to be actual customers and who are just stirring up trouble.

 

[Robert Crawford]

It needs to be noted that the visibility of aliasing can be exacerbated or reduced depending on the model of TV and the settings. Most TVs process the image with some (often mild) amount of anti-aliasing depending on which picture mode is being used. More importantly, higher levels of the Sharpness setting (which should ideally be set at 0%) will make aliasing more visible. Motion processing on LCD/LEDs may also reduce the temporal shimmering effect and hence the visibility of aliasing in motion. So let's keep these factors in mind when discussing what people do or don't see.

I will agree however that regardless of what's being seen, certain people on certain forums have an anti-Twilight Time agenda due purely to TT's business model, and will actively make a mountain out of any mole hill just to further that agenda. I feel for TT having to deal with these people, many of whom are probably never going to be actual customers and who are just stirring up trouble.

Excellent comments!

 

[AndyBlu]

it's clear from these screenshots:

http://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Heaven-and-Earth-Blu-ray/43396/#Screenshots

that it's a problem with the disc. no debate.

bad work from warner/TT.

whoever is to blame, i really couldn't care. it's a flawed product. and for the price TT are asking ... ouch !

if you don't notice it, great, just as well after the money you spent.

but it's a sloppy product - which could have been fixed.

makes me think no one at warner/tt gives a **** what they release sometimes.

 

[Robert Crawford]

it's clear from these screenshots:

http://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Heaven-and-Earth-Blu-ray/43396/#Screenshots

that it's a problem with the disc. not an equipment issue.

how much people notice it seems to be the point of contention.

either way, bad work from warner/TT.

whoever is to blame, i really couldn't care. it's a flawed product. and for the price TT are asking ... ouch !

I don't think anybody is implying it's an equipment issue just that on some equipment it's less noticeable to see.

As to TT's asking price, nobody is making us buy their product, flawed or not.

 

[Konstantinos]

As to TT's asking price, nobody is making us buy their product, flawed or not.

True but it is the only option on Blu-ray!
It's not that we have many choices if we want the film..

 

[Robert Crawford]

True but it is the only option on Blu-ray!
It's not that we have many choices if we want the film..

That's life, if the film means that much to you then you'll find a way to get enough budget to make it happen.

 

[AndyBlu]

As to TT's asking price, nobody is making us buy their product, flawed or not.

yes, i have the choice to not buy this film. i do understand that. and trust me, i won't be.

although we all have to live with the reality that we have to pay this kind of money for a 10+ year old transfer for some of these films, i don't think it's unreasonable to expect a technical competent job at the authoring level. someone wasn't doing their job (or just didn't care enough). premium price for a f***ed up product is not acceptable in my opinion. TT or warner should sort this mess out.

 

[Robert Crawford]

yes, i have the choice to not buy this film. i do understand that. and trust me, i won't be.

although we all have to live with the reality that we have to pay this kind of money for a 10+ year old transfer for some of these films, i don't think it's unreasonable to expect a technical competent job at the authoring level. someone wasn't doing their job (or just didn't care enough). premium price for a f***ed up product is not acceptable in my opinion. TT or warner should sort this mess out.

If the video presentation is not good enough then don't buy it! Furthermore write TT and/or Warner and tell them way you're not buying it.

 

[moovtune]

It always gets me- to read criticisms about bad transfers and terrible authoring from people who haven't bought the disc or even viewed it. You're wasting my time making me read your opinions and then discovering you haven't even seen it.

 

[EddieLarkin]

I'm not aware of any issues that were brought in at the authoring stage. If that was the case it would mean Warner Bros. themselves would have made the same authoring mistakes with Enter the Dragon et al (http://www.caps-a-holic.com/hd_vergleiche/multi_comparison.php?art=magnify&x=617&y=245&action=1&image=6&hd_multiID=250&cap1=1377&cap2=22518&disc1=137&disc2=2442&lossless=#vergleich), which I don't see being the case. If users with technical knowledge would like to comment on what can and can't be done to alleviate issues like the above when authoring discs, that would be appreciated.

 

[Dick]

I will agree however that regardless of what's being seen, certain people on certain forums have an anti-Twilight Time agenda due purely to TT's business model, and will actively make a mountain out of any mole hill just to further that agenda. I feel for TT having to deal with these people, many of whom are probably never going to be actual customers and who are just stirring up trouble.

Or who really are secretly regular customers but use their anonymity online to pick fights whenever possible. I don't see how true movie buffs could possibly avoid purchasing from TT.

 

[bruceames]

True but it is the only option on Blu-ray!
It's not that we have many choices if we want the film..

Thanks to TT and director Stone, at least we have an option now on Blu-ray. And you can still choose the DVD, but from what I've read this is leaps and bounds better.

Realistically, I don't think Warner would have ever gotten around to remastering this to put out on Blu-ray themselves. The catalog Blu-ray market is just too tough and they have a huge backlog of more viable movies that could be released on Blu-ray.

 

[bruceames]

Or who really are secretly regular customers but use their anonymity online to pick fights whenever possible. I don't see how true movie buffs could possibly avoid purchasing from TT.

I'd rather have them be secret customers and (occasionally) 'stir up trouble', then to be quiet on both fronts. The catalog market needs all the support it can get.

 

[Peter Apruzzese]

it's clear from these screenshots:

http://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Heaven-and-Earth-Blu-ray/43396/#Screenshots

that it's a problem with the disc. no debate.

bad work from warner/TT.

whoever is to blame, i really couldn't care. it's a flawed product. and for the price TT are asking ... ouch !

if you don't notice it, great, just as well after the money you spent.

but it's a sloppy product - which could have been fixed.

makes me think no one at warner/tt gives a **** what they release sometimes.

OK, I'm looking at these on my computer monitor. Which one exhibits the problem the most and can you point to the exact area of the shot that demonstrates it best? I don't have the disc so am trying to get a handle on what people are saying about it.

 

[EddieLarkin]

Number 4:

http://www.blu-ray.com/movies/screenshot.php?movieid=43396&position=4

Make sure you have your Blu-ray.com site settings set to 1080p.

Aliasing is most noticeable on the hair over the side of her face, the entire right side of her face, her lips, the back of her hair that we can see, her neck, the rim of the side of the shirt that hangs open, both hands/fingers, the tear in her shirt on her right arm, the side of her entire left arm, all of the barbed wire on the left of the image, basically all of the foliage in the foreground.

If you still can't see it, here's a 75% zoom for that area:

http://i.imgur.com/ucv8oco.png

 

[bruceames]

Was thinking that it would be cool if Oliver Stone signed some copies of this as well, like he did for Salvador. After all, he's the one that made this happen, so he probably wouldn't mind.

 

[Peter Apruzzese]

Number 4:

http://www.blu-ray.com/movies/screenshot.php?movieid=43396&position=4

Make sure you have your Blu-ray.com site settings set to 1080p.

Aliasing is most noticeable on the hair over the side of her face, the entire right side of her face, her lips, the back of her hair that we can see, her neck, the rim of the side of the shirt that hangs open, both hands/fingers, the tear in her shirt on her right arm, the side of her entire left arm, all of the barbed wire on the left of the image, basically all of the foliage in the foreground.

If you still can't see it, here's a 75% zoom for that area:

http://i.imgur.com/ucv8oco.png

Thanks - I'm not a member over there so I can't see them in 1080p but your blow-up demonstrates it.

 

[Konstantinos]

It always gets me- to read criticisms about bad transfers and terrible authoring from people who haven't bought the disc or even viewed it. You're wasting my time making me read your opinions and then discovering you haven't even seen it.

I'm sorry but never have I seen a Bluray that is different than the screenshots posted.
If the screenshots are bad, the BLuray loooks bad too.
If they are good, it is good, and vice versa..
The problems shown in screenshots aren't miraculously solved in the Bluray.
At least, that's what I see from my experience.

 

[ROclockCK]

Thanks - I'm not a member over there so I can't see them in 1080p but your blow-up demonstrates it.

The operative words there being "blow-up" Peter.

Who actually watches a motion picture frozen and zoomed like that?

 

[Robert Harris]

I've taken a peek at H & E.

It's derived from probably a 15 year-old 1080i master, with all of the obvious attributes,
both positive and negative.

For those who love the film, the Twilight Time Blu-ray will be as good as it gets for the
foreseeable future. They've done a service by making it available in any form.

I'm unaware of any other way to have gotten this film to the public in anything approaching HD.

RAH