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roxy1927

Supporting Actor
Joined
Jul 10, 2018
Messages
576
Real Name
vincent parisi
Some are good. But some are pretty bad.
I didn't know that about Bunuel's opinion of Discreet Charm. That was the original campaign in the US so that makes sense to me.
He didn't have any say?
 

Craig999

Grip
Joined
Jul 2, 2014
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17
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Craig
Just received and watched my copy today. GORGEOUS picture! Colors and clarity wonderful. And the story was way better than what I remembered from first seeing this years ago on a 19 inch black and white tube. OK, and I'll admit that I clapped after every circus act. Even Charlton Heston was good! So glad I have this in my collection!
 

Vern Dias

Stunt Coordinator
Joined
Apr 27, 1999
Messages
230
Real Name
Theodore V Dias
Watched this last night. While I agree that the video quality is excellent, I am afraid I can't say the same about the audio.

When the main titles started, it seemed like a significant treble boost had been applied. Same for all the musical numbers. However, the dialog seemed to be completely lacking in sibilants, indicating a loss of treble.

Now, it could very well be my age and my old ears are at fault here, but I don't think that would explain the difference in frequency balance between the music and the dialogue.

Did anyone else notice this, or was it just me?
 

AlexNH

Second Unit
Joined
Dec 15, 2010
Messages
447
Real Name
Alex Koutroubas
I watched my copy last night. This was a blind buy me for me. I enjoyed the film very much. It held my attention and was very fun. The integration of the real circus people with the actors was seamless and if nothing else this movie captures a time when the circus was really a circus.
 

Stephen PI

Supporting Actor
Joined
Jan 31, 2003
Messages
876
I just received my blu ray and started to watch it. After about 10 to 15 minutes I had to turn it off and I am now returning it.
Why do studios still persist in degrading optical and some magnetic tracks by processing them to the point where the dialog is at the point of unintelligibility?
Noise gating, as it is known, is one of, if not the worst offender in the transfer of sound in home video. This is nothing new. Its intention is to lower the noise floor to almost zero level and the resulting effect is when an actor speaks and their dialog level fluctuates from high to low, toward the noise floor, it is almost swallowed up and as a result becomes briefly inaudible, and unintelligible. Low level sound effects and music are also affected by this noise gating device.
I wish this device was banned altogether but it appears it is making a comeback!
 

Robin9

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Joined
Dec 13, 2006
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5,931
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Robin
Watched this last night. While I agree that the video quality is excellent, I am afraid I can't say the same about the audio.

When the main titles started, it seemed like a significant treble boost had been applied. Same for all the musical numbers. However, the dialog seemed to be completely lacking in sibilants, indicating a loss of treble.

Now, it could very well be my age and my old ears are at fault here, but I don't think that would explain the difference in frequency balance between the music and the dialogue.

Did anyone else notice this, or was it just me?
I just received my blu ray and started to watch it. After about 10 to 15 minutes I had to turn it off and I am now returning it.
Why do studios still persist in degrading optical and some magnetic tracks by processing them to the point where the dialog is at the point of unintelligibility?
Noise gating, as it is known, is one of, if not the worst offender in the transfer of sound in home video. This is nothing new. Its intention is to lower the noise floor to almost zero level and the resulting effect is when an actor speaks and their dialog level fluctuates from high to low, toward the noise floor, it is almost swallowed up and as a result becomes briefly inaudible, and unintelligible. Low level sound effects and music are also affected by this noise gating device.
I wish this device was banned altogether but it appears it is making a comeback!
Does this disc have sub-titles?
 

Malcolm Bmoor

Stunt Coordinator
Joined
Jan 27, 2004
Messages
198
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UK
Real Name
Malcolm Blackmoor
The problem in general is not the existence of tools but their misuse. The trick with all processing, whether traditional compressors and noise gates or digital restoration aids, is to apply them until an adverse effect is heard and then reduce the amount of processing until the best ratio of help to harm is achieved.

Unhappily there are people, by which I mean producers/clients rather than engineers, who ignorantly demand magic unrelated to the potential of the recording in question.

I recently tried to help somebody improve an early 1920s vaudeville disc in which the music and noise floor were undifferentiated. Using RX5 & RX7 with the judgement I've described prompted complaints of:

'But there's still noise'

A few years ago I complained to the makers of a Blu-ray of the Fred Astaire film SECOND CHORUS, on which the sound is so heavily digitally over processed that it sounds like gargling underwater. They rejected my (professionally informed & experienced) complaints out of hand.

I've not heard the discs being discussed in this thread.
 

Malcolm Bmoor

Stunt Coordinator
Joined
Jan 27, 2004
Messages
198
Location
UK
Real Name
Malcolm Blackmoor
Something to add to my previous post:

AGC - Automatic Gain Control - a device that should have no place in professional audio. It used to be found on some domestic cassette machines to help people unable to set a recording level.

It 'searches' or 'pumps' during silences and raises the level until the next louder sound knocks it back again. Depending on the programme material - and most films have plenty of silences - you hear a constant WHHHOOOOSSSHHHHING as the level rises and falls.

Reasuringly I've never heard it on a commercial disc but here in the UK we have a tv channel called TALKING PICTURES and whoever transfers their older films is devoted to AGC.

And it's certainly present on much CNN heard in the UK.

Let's hope this vile and unecessary device doesn't find its way to Blu-rays.
 

Nick*Z

Screenwriter
Joined
Apr 30, 2003
Messages
1,328
Location
Canada
Real Name
NICK
I was sort of hoping they would have digitally removed the cue marks - but no. They're still here. Otherwise, image quality easily bests anything this has looked like on home video before. But for a Paramount Presents...title, I would have expected a 'complete' restoration, and at least an audio commentary to accompany such a noteworthy and Oscar-winning film. Despite these flaws and deficits, I still very much enjoyed this one and will continue to own it as a cherished part of my ever-expanding home library. It's just not the poster child for perfection in hi-def I was hoping for. Regrets.
 

David Weicker

Senior HTF Member
Joined
Feb 26, 2005
Messages
3,896
Real Name
David
Has anyone received their copy from someone other than Amazon?

My Deep Discount order went to BackOrder on Release Date, and I notice that both Bullmoose and Best Buy list it as not available.

I thought about switching my order, but Amazon's current price (with tax) would be $8.64 more than what I expect to be charged by DD (a 47% increase).
 

Colin Jacobson

Senior HTF Member
Joined
Apr 19, 2000
Messages
10,762
I was sort of hoping they would have digitally removed the cue marks - but no. They're still here. Otherwise, image quality easily bests anything this has looked like on home video before. But for a Paramount Presents...title, I would have expected a 'complete' restoration, and at least an audio commentary to accompany such a noteworthy and Oscar-winning film. Despite these flaws and deficits, I still very much enjoyed this one and will continue to own it as a cherished part of my ever-expanding home library. It's just not the poster child for perfection in hi-def I was hoping for. Regrets.

I definitely didn't expect new bonus features beyond the usual Maltin chat, but I agree that the level of work done on the transfer disappoints.

We've gotten accustomed to virtually flawless presentations of older movies over the last few years, so this one's way "messier" than I'd expect!
 

david hare

Supporting Actor
Joined
Aug 10, 2014
Messages
564
Real Name
david hare
Aside from the cue marks and a few scratches and tiny emulsion nicks my only issue with the transfer is that it's a little "dark", meaning (I think) the white levels and/or gamma are slightly out.) Otherwise I'm very happy with it.
 

Mark-P

Senior HTF Member
Joined
Sep 26, 2005
Messages
5,637
Location
Camas, WA
Real Name
Mark Probst
I am a little disappointed in Paramount on the digital releases of late. The new master of Greatest Show on Earth still hasn’t shown up on iTunes. At least iTunes got the new master of The Court Jester, but unfortunately unlike nearly all of the other “Paramount Presents” titles it didn’t get a 4K bump. It’s possible both will upgrade to 4K at some point in the future, but I’m beginning to lose hope...
 

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